Happiness

[Mr Radioactive]

Do you think the purpose of life is to be happy?
Do you think that once you have achieved all of your ambitions in life that you will end up being happy?

I think that the idea of achieving a state of happiness is regarded as some kind of ultimate aim for people in our society.

If you think that you will be happy once you have gotten married, or achieved success, or whatever it is, then what exactly do you expect this happiness to be? How long do you expect it to last for?

If you don't think you can achieve a state of happiness, then why do you do the things you do? Why get married? Why even bother to continue living?

 

[Jetfire]

I think most people just want to be content.

 

[Niorah]

No, I don't think the purpose of life is to -be- happy. I think the purpose of life is the pursuit of happiness.

The journey is more important than the arrival.

Said happiness is absolutely individual of course, as is the chosen path.

 

[iguana_tonante]

Do you think the purpose of life is to be happy?

No. I don't think there is "purpose" of life. Life is.

Do you think that once you have achieved all of your ambitions in life that you will end up being happy?

No. I haven't achieved all my ambitions is life, and I'm already happy. I will say more: I could never achieve all my ambitions: I have endless ambitions, and infinite curiosity. The world is simply not enough for that.

I think that the idea of achieving a state of happiness is regarded as some kind of ultimate aim for people in our society.

Different people have different aims. For me, it's better to be happy than unhappy. But I've met people that aren't happy unless they are unhappy, so your mileage may vary.

If you think that you will be happy once you have gotten married, or achieved success, or whatever it is, then what exactly do you expect this happiness to be?

About the same happiness I'm experiencing now, just... different.

How long do you expect it to last for?

With the help of some Viagra, up to four hours.

If you don't think you can achieve a state of happiness, then why do you do the things you do? Why get married? Why even bother to continue living?

Because it's fun.

Life is not about struggling and fighting and kicking and screaming to achieve a state of happiness. It's about being happy now. Whatever "happy" means to you. If you forgive me a quote: "it's not the destination, it's the voyage".

I'm rather Zen tonight, and I'm not even drunk!

 

[Amaris]

No, I don't think the purpose of life is to -be- happy. I think the purpose of life is the pursuit of happiness.

The journey is more important than the arrival.

Said happiness is absolutely individual of course, as is the chosen path.

That covers it for me as well.

 

[Mr Radioactive]

Do you think the purpose of life is to be happy?

No. I don't think there is "purpose" of life. Life is.

If you don't think you can achieve a state of happiness, then why do you do the things you do? Why get married? Why even bother to continue living?

Because it's fun.

Life is not about struggling and fighting and kicking and screaming to achieve a state of happiness. It's about being happy now. Whatever "happy" means to you. If you forgive me a quote: "it's not the destination, it's the voyage".

If life is about being happy now, but, let's just say for arguments sake, that you are not happy now - then doesn't it follow that you should strive, kicking and screaming even, to be happy? So regardless of whether happiness comes to the person after some event in the future or whether it is in "the voyage" now, you seem to be implying that being happy does represent some kind of purpose in life.

 

[Captain_Nick]

There is no 'strive'. You are either happy, or you are not. If you want to be happy, then be! Right now.

 

[Mr Radioactive]

There is no 'strive'. You are either happy, or you are not. If you want to be happy, then be! Right now.

But some people can't just be! What if you have some kind of problem which is preventing you from being happy? Like a mental health problem, an addiction, debt, a wife, a lack of direction in life?

 

[Kestra]

Like a mental health problem, an addiction, debt, a wife, a lack of direction in life?

One of these things is not like the other ...

 

[Captain_Nick]

Just excuses. You use external things to explain why you are not happy because you do not realise that happiness is a state of mind. An internal thing. It is how you respond to external events which determines your mood, not the events themselves. The funny thing about that is - you decide how you respond. So like I said before, if you want to be happy, decide to be! Simple.

 

[Jetfire]

@Kestra

A wife!

 

[Crusher Disciple]

I just read an article from Psycholgy Today that stated that the pursuit of happiness means something different for introverts.

 

[Captain_Nick]

Interesting article. Unfortunately, it is premised on the notion that 'introverts' are somehow different from 'extroverts', which is plain rubbish.

 

[Mr Radioactive]

Just excuses. You use external things to explain why you are not happy because you do not realise that happiness is a state of mind. An internal thing. It is how you respond to external events which determines your mood, not the events themselves. The funny thing about that is - you decide how you respond. So like I said before, if you want to be happy, decide to be! Simple.

If happiness is an internal response to an external event, then being happy would still require you to try to strive for the event. If you were lonely and you wanted friends, then you would have to join some kind of club, or make more of an effort with the people you work with etc. You couldn't just decide to no longer be lonely.

 

[iguana_tonante]

Just excuses. You use external things to explain why you are not happy because you do not realise that happiness is a state of mind. An internal thing. It is how you respond to external events which determines your mood, not the events themselves. The funny thing about that is - you decide how you respond. So like I said before, if you want to be happy, decide to be! Simple.

I agree with you, except for the last part: it's simple, yet it takes a life to learn it. So it's not simple at all.

If life is about being happy now, but, let's just say for arguments sake, that you are not happy now - then doesn't it follow that you should strive, kicking and screaming even, to be happy?

No, because that would never bring you happiness. The more you struggle to seize happiness, the more it will escape you (add some trite metaphors about sand in your hand if so inclined). Stop trying to be happy and be happy.

So regardless of whether happiness comes to the person after some event in the future or whether it is in "the voyage" now, you seem to be implying that being happy does represent some kind of purpose in life.

I disagree. Happiness is not a purpose. It's a state of mind. A purpose implies a goal, a strategy, a path, a timeline. Happiness is the opposite of that.

However, if we want to discuss accurately, we must be very careful, because we are talking about two different types of "happiness", and it's incorrect to mix them up.

There is happy-ness, the emotion of being happy, fleeting and elusive. Beautiful, but addictive: you can only savour a drop of it at any time, and it will be gone before you know it. And then there is Happiness, the state of a complete mind. You can also call it peace, or whatever. Using the usual trite metaphors, happy-ness is a dropper: you can't have more than one drop at a time; Happiness is the ocean: without beginning and without end, because it is simply there.

So, going back to your question: happy-ness can be a purpose, but it's a shallow one. You will be happy for a moment, but then it's gone. On the other hand, Happiness can never be a purpose, because by definition you can't find it: in a sense, you have to be found by it.

Moreover: happy-ness can be a way to Happiness, but that's not the rule. As I said (but now I can say it with this new typographic convention) some people are Happy only when they are not happy.

However, more seriously: I'm just conjuring some interesting stuff I've read about in my years, without much thought and formalism. I don't even really believe all of it: but I find it very interesting and worth examining. But if you like to discuss philosophy, and especially Eastern Philosophy, there are many people here smarter and more educated than me on this topic that could explain things much better than me. Enjoy!

 

[TheGodBen]

Do you think the purpose of life is to be happy?

I've got to go with the iguana on this one, I don't think there's a purpose to life. It's a very liberating worldview.

Do you think that once you have achieved all of your ambitions in life that you will end up being happy?

No, but I imagine that achieving my life goals would bring a sense of fulfilment. Happiness is a different thing entirely; right now, my life is a stressful mess, but I'm reasonably happy. I've been happier.

I think that the idea of achieving a state of happiness is regarded as some kind of ultimate aim for people in our society.

Hmm, I think society encourages us not to be miserable wasters, which is slightly different than encouraging us to be happy.

If you don't think you can achieve a state of happiness, then why do you do the things you do?

It all makes sense at the time.

Why get married?

To inherit your father-in-law's property, of course.

Why even bother to continue living?

Because the alternative is killing myself, and since I don't believe in an afterlife, I feel like I'd be missing out on a lot. Will the Israelis and Palastinians make peace? How will global warming turn out? Will the Arrested Development movie ever get made? These are things I want to know, so I choose to stick around and fill my time with whatever I find most enjoyable.

 

[Captain_Nick]

If happiness is an internal response to an external event, then being happy would still require you to try to strive for the event. If you were lonely and you wanted friends, then you would have to join some kind of club, or make more of an effort with the people you work with etc. You couldn't just decide to no longer be lonely.

Yeah you could. Happiness, sadness, anger etc are the consequence of internal responses, they are not the responses themselves.

If you want more friends then by all means get out there and make them. But you have to do it for the right reason. If you feel sad and miserable because you believe you have no friends, then going out and trying to interact won't work because the cause of your misery, your belief that you have no friends, hasn't changed. All that will happen, I suspect, is that you will spread your negativity to other people. The interaction will fail, and more so since you are mentally primed to expect failure, and in the end you'll get a bit of negative reinforcement, feel even worse about yourself and be further discouraged from interacting with people.

Go out for the right reason - you're a fun bloke and you want to spread it around and make other people feel good about themselves.

There is a link in the chain that lies between 'stuff that happens' and 'how I feel'. It's a subtle link but one that you have ultimate mastery over. As iguana said, it takes a lifetime to learn it. But I'm telling you now that it's there and saving you years of introspection. You're welcome.

 

[Captain_Nick]

I agree with you, except for the last part: it's simple, yet it takes a life to learn it. So it's not simple at all.

The simplest things are often the hardest to learn.

 

[Mr Radioactive]

If happiness is an internal response to an external event, then being happy would still require you to try to strive for the event. If you were lonely and you wanted friends, then you would have to join some kind of club, or make more of an effort with the people you work with etc. You couldn't just decide to no longer be lonely.

Yeah you could. Happiness, sadness, anger etc are the consequence of internal responses, they are not the responses themselves.

If you want more friends then by all means get out there and make them. But you have to do it for the right reason. If you feel sad and miserable because you believe you have no friends, then going out and trying to interact won't work because the cause of your misery, your belief that you have no friends, hasn't changed. All that will happen, I suspect, is that you will spread your negativity to other people. The interaction will fail, and more so since you are mentally primed to expect failure, and in the end you'll get a bit of negative reinforcement, feel even worse about yourself and be further discouraged from interacting with people.

Go out for the right reason - you're a fun bloke and you want to spread it around and make other people feel good about themselves.

There is a link in the chain that lies between 'stuff that happens' and 'how I feel'. It's a subtle link but one that you have ultimate mastery over. As iguana said, it takes a lifetime to learn it. But I'm telling you now that it's there and saving you years of introspection. You're welcome.

I really appreciate you taking the time to reply to my post, but I think I might have given you the wrong idea. I am not actually sad and miserable or friendless - it's my mistake for not making myself clear. I was only using not having friends as an example.

My point is that in order to be able to interpret the event, the event has to occur. In order for the event to occur you have to strive to occasion it.

 

[Captain_Nick]

I really appreciate you taking the time to reply to my post, but I think I might have given you the wrong idea. I am not actually sad and miserable or friendless - it's my mistake for not making myself clear. I was only using not having friends as an example.

Oh I think I came across a little too strong! I wasn't talking about you per se, just the hypothetical person who is lonely.

My point is that in order to be able to interpret the event, the event has to occur. In order for the event to occur you have to strive to occasion it.

If you want to do something, you have to do it. For sure.