Grade: Roger Moore's James Bond movies

[Holdfast]

But they're not prequels. It's a restart to the series from the beginning of Bond's career. And, as such, the producers were wise to keep Judi Dench, who was one of the best parts of the Brosnan films.

Also ways liked her reparte with Geoffrey Palmer in Golden Eye
"Frankly M, I don't think you've got the balls for this job"
"well at least means I don't have to think with them".

Tomorrow Never Dies actually.

"What's your man doing, M?"

"His job!"

The jokes in TND were the best across the Brosnan films; while I probably prefer GoldenEye overall as a movie, TND is definitely a whole lot of fun because of the great gags.

 

[Starkers]

Live And Let Die: C (this movie comes off really racist when you view it today)

If it's racist against anyone, it's white Southerners.

The racial aspect has always made this film a little odd. Supposedly it was to take advantage of the "blaxploitation" genre that was the rage at the time. And it has strange racial attitudes - the blacks are the "bad guys", but are interested in dealing drugs to their own people - whites are for the most part portrayed as buffoons - even Bond, as when he is in Harlem, and the Black CIA agent says to him "clever disguise, Bond - whiteface in Harlem" - and Bond is captured rather easily on a number of occasions by Kananga's black henchmen. Of course, the "voodoo" stuff is racially sensitive. Its seems the film makers were keenly aware of the racial aspect of the film and it almost subliminally permiates the movie. I even have discussed this movie with my friends of African heritage, and we can't seem to decide if it is in fact racist or not.

Well so I've been told Yaphet Kotto's very proud of it, and the role of Kananga.In a bizzare way the film might be considered progressive, the black guys being dangerous and resourseful villains in their own right rather than being just some white dudes comedy henchmen. I hope that makes sense! And Kananga is at least an equal opportunities villain. "Black or white, rich or poor, I don't discriminate."

 

[Starkers]

Also ways liked her reparte with Geoffrey Palmer in Golden Eye
"Frankly M, I don't think you've got the balls for this job"
"well at least means I don't have to think with them".

Tomorrow Never Dies actually.

"What's your man doing, M?"

"His job!"

The jokes in TND were the best across the Brosnan films; while I probably prefer GoldenEye overall as a movie, TND is definitely a whole lot of fun because of the great gags.

and Brosnan is clearly having a ball. The glee in his eyes driving the BMW from the backseat is something, for all his many talents, that still annoys me about Craig. He never looks that happy to be 007.

t'other best bit of TND?

Kauffman- "I'm just a professional, doing my job."
Bond- "So am I." Blam!

 

[Holdfast]

Tomorrow Never Dies actually.

"What's your man doing, M?"

"His job!"

The jokes in TND were the best across the Brosnan films; while I probably prefer GoldenEye overall as a movie, TND is definitely a whole lot of fun because of the great gags.

and Brosnan is clearly having a ball. The glee in his eyes driving the BMW from the backseat is something, for all his many talents, that still annoys me about Craig. He never looks that happy to be 007.

Yup, agreed there. Every guy wants to be Bond, the least Craig could do is grin once in a while.

(that BMW chase is great. The female german computer voice shouting instructions to "fasten seatbelt" or "reduce speed" is brilliant. And Brosnan's little chuckle in the back of the beemer when he reinflates his punctured tyres after driving over the nails he dropped is a crowning moment!)

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

^I think that, among Brosnan's movies, Tomorrow Never Dies gets better with age. It & The World Is Not Enough are Brosnan's best work and he's clearly having a ball in each of them. Goldeneye is a great film but Brosnan is a little stiff starting out. Sadly, he seems to be phoning it in in Die Another Day and while he's not too old for the role the way Roger Moore became by the end, he does seem to have lost some of the youthful spark that he posessed in Tomorrow Never Dies & The World Is Not Enough.

I suppose we should stop hijacking the thread over an issue we can't satisfactorily resolve.

You're probably right, although to bring it back to James Bond, I recently listened to Mankiewicz's Live & Let Die commentary track during Clifton James' scenes. Unfortunately, he doesn't mention anything about bringing the character back for either The Man with the Golden Gun or Superman II. Maybe I'll give another listen to the commentary track on the Donner cut of Superman II to see if there are any clues there.

^ They weren't promoted as prequels, CR was promoted as a re-boot. Unfortunately, some rather silly people in the media who covered the movie can't tell the difference. Batman Begins faced just the same problem - a lot of people assumed it to be a prequel to the Burton/Schumacher movies, even though it was very evidently set in a different continuity.

Basically, the Star Wars prequels have a lot to answer for - anything that goes back to a character's roots is seen as a prequel, even if, as with the above movies, it's actually a brand new take on old material - think Smallville, often wrongly described as a prequel to the Superman movies.

And now, reboots like Batman Begins and Casino Royale (and to a lesser extent Star Trek (2009)) have a lot to answer for. Now, it seems like sequels that exist in the same continuity yet somehow revamp the concept or bring back a long dormant franchise are referred to as "reboots" even when they aren't. I recently bought a magazine that referred to Terminator Salvation as a "reboot" even though it clearly takes place in the same continuity as the previous movies (even the much reviled Terminator 3, as evidenced by the presence of Katherine Brewster). I also occasionally hear Robert Rodriguez's new Predator movie referred to as a "remake" or "reboot" even though I don't think it is at all supposed to contradict the previous 4 Predator films. And the same thing with Ridley Scott's new Alien prequel.

If it's racist against anyone, it's white Southerners.

The racial aspect has always made this film a little odd. Supposedly it was to take advantage of the "blaxploitation" genre that was the rage at the time. And it has strange racial attitudes - the blacks are the "bad guys", but are interested in dealing drugs to their own people - whites are for the most part portrayed as buffoons - even Bond, as when he is in Harlem, and the Black CIA agent says to him "clever disguise, Bond - whiteface in Harlem" - and Bond is captured rather easily on a number of occasions by Kananga's black henchmen. Of course, the "voodoo" stuff is racially sensitive. Its seems the film makers were keenly aware of the racial aspect of the film and it almost subliminally permiates the movie. I even have discussed this movie with my friends of African heritage, and we can't seem to decide if it is in fact racist or not.

Well so I've been told Yaphet Kotto's very proud of it, and the role of Kananga.In a bizzare way the film might be considered progressive, the black guys being dangerous and resourseful villains in their own right rather than being just some white dudes comedy henchmen. I hope that makes sense! And Kananga is at least an equal opportunities villain. "Black or white, rich or poor, I don't discriminate."

Certainly Live & Let Die has fewer obnoxious racial stereotypes than the Transformers movies.

 

[cardinal biggles]

t'other best bit of TND?

Kauffman- "I'm just a professional, doing my job."
Bond- "So am I." Blam!

Ah, yes, the late Vincent Schiavelli in another one of his deliciously quirky roles.

"I could shoot you from SCHTUTTGART und still create ze proper effect!"

 

[Starkers]

t'other best bit of TND?

Kauffman- "I'm just a professional, doing my job."
Bond- "So am I." Blam!

Ah, yes, the late Vincent Schiavelli in another one of his deliciously quirky roles.

"I could shoot you from SCHTUTTGART und still create ze proper effect!"

Yeah its a shame he wasn't in it more he was much more fun than Herr Stamper...

I love that he's slightly embaressed at having to ask Bond how they can get into his car!

 

[siskokid888]

Well so I've been told Yaphet Kotto's very proud of it, and the role of Kananga.In a bizzare way the film might be considered progressive, the black guys being dangerous and resourseful villains in their own right rather than being just some white dudes comedy henchmen. I hope that makes sense! And Kananga is at least an equal opportunities villain. "Black or white, rich or poor, I don't discriminate."

True. I think the one aspect that bugged people from a racial angle was that Kananga's woman was white (Jane Seymour) and Bond had to get the "white girl back from the black villain". However, Bond usually steals the villian's girl, and it's made clear that the relationship between Kananga and Solitare is not sexual, at least not yet. As you look more closely, you might even say that the film makers were rather bold (intentionally or unintentionally) in some of the themes they broached in the movie.

 

[Starkers]

Yeah it would have almost worked better if Rosie had been white and Solitaire black.

 

[Captaindemotion]

Batman Begins[/I] and Casino Royale (and to a lesser extent Star Trek (2009)) have a lot to answer for. Now, it seems like sequels that exist in the same continuity yet somehow revamp the concept or bring back a long dormant franchise are referred to as "reboots" even when they aren't.

Good point! The recurrent theme being lazy reporting and journos opting for a 'catchphrase of the moment', methinks!