Gotham - Season 1

[JD]

You should really check out Arrow if you're into comic book stuff. Even though I've been enjoying Gotham, it's nowhere near as good as Arrow.

I really enjoyed this episode. It was nice to finally get some real characterization for Selina. I'm glad they had her telling Gordon about seeing he Waynes' murder, I was afraid they were going to keep that a secret for a lot longer.
I have feeling at this point, there probably aren't many people who aren't loving the show's take on Penguing. I know I am.
I do agree that some of the stuff, like the kidnappers this week, and Fish in both episodes, is campy, but for me it's just enough to give it a comic booky feel, but not enough to turn me off.
Gordon was also good again this week, I think he's a hero it's going to be easy to root for.

 

[sidious618]

Any show set in a comic book universe is going to have elements of campiness.

ARROW doesn't. There are comical lines here and there but nothing I would call campiness.

Maybe not intentionally but as someone who is a very infrequent viewer tuning into a scene like this is not without camp moments.

Yep. It's silly to think that there's not an element of camp to Arrow.

 

[trekkiebaggio]

I thought this was better than the first episode, but to be honest I don't find Gordon in this show to be terribly interesting.

I liked Selina, loved Penguin and especially the way his kidnapping attempt went awry, and I liked Bruce. The bit where he said he was testing himself was a cool moment.

 

[Vendikarr]

^Except most Batman characters don't have superpowers, with rare exceptions like Clayface or Poison Ivy (to an extent).

I hope they plan to take Ivy back to the characters beginnings. She hasn't always had the power to control plants. She had an immunity to toxins and was basically a poisoner. She would apply toxins to her lips and immobilize or knock out people with a kiss.

The plant angle came from her using extracts from plants as her toxins.

 

[Christopher]

Any show set in a comic book universe is going to have elements of campiness.

First off, that's a really lazy and ill-informed stereotype. Not all comics are about superheroes. The Walking Dead is based on a comic. The movies Road to Perdition and A History of Violence were based on comics. Comics are a medium, not a genre. They can tell stories of every type, not just fanciful superhero stories. And not all superhero stories are equal in their approach either.

Second, it's misusing the word "camp." Camp is a deliberate, conscious exaggeration and satirization of one's own subject matter. People often use it for things they find unintentionally laughable, but that's not what it really means. Camp is that which mocks itself on purpose.

 

[Dorian Thompson]

Pardon me, you condescending jerk. It's just subjective opinion about comic book based entertainment. It's not that important.

 

[Captain Qwert Jr]

Still Wobbly.

-The cast is bloated beyond all reason. Seems like Everyone gets 5 minutes just to remind us they exist, not to advance any existing plots.
-The city's look just screams 'photoshop' to me
-The Wayne's murders are important because... Falcone says so. (By the by, isn't nice of him to always provide background info for us? A truly thoughtful Don.)
-No therapy? Ah, The Wayne's are scientologists. Much is explained.
-Bruce is just weird.
-Alfred makes a strong impression on you, but he also sends out so many different signals. It strikes an awkward chord.
-I have no sense of Gotham. The corruption is weakly handled. All I see is cops doing petty stuff, and politicians being concerned with *gasp* politics. They need to establish both the huge breadth and terrible depths of it.

I like a lot of the cast, so i'm still watching, but it need to establish a stronger direction fast.

 

[Mach5]

Wow, this show devolved into Smallville quickly. :/

 

[Allyn Gibson]

I'm going to give it a few more episodes, but I can see myself kicking out around episode six.

My problems right now are these.

Alfred is unrecognizable as any iteration of the character with which I'm familiar. Sean Pertwee is fine; the characterization is not. He reminds me of the Alfred in Geoff Johns' Batman Earth One, which I thought was an interesting take on the character. It worked there. It's not working here.

Small universe syndrome. I was really hoping that the two characters who met at the end of last night's episode -- Selina and Gordon -- wouldn't meet just yet. I'm also not at all clear how Selina knows the things she says she knows. (No, not the fact that she witnessed the Wayne murder. It's the way she keeps up on what's happening in Gotham.)

Schizophrenic storytelling. The events outside the squad house crowded out the procedural. We didn't get any understanding of the motive or the endgame of the bad guys in last night's episode. I've made an assumption about what they were up to (white slave ring), but that's just my guess. Instead, time was spent on Penguin.

Penguin. Seriously, why are we going back to the Penguin plot? The way his story was structured in the pilot, he felt like he should have been a guest star for that episode, and we'd see him come back at the mid-season finale or the two-part season finale as a "Surprise, I'm not dead." Instead, it feels like we're going to have to follow this psycho ad nauseum, and he'll be back in Gotham before the NLCS starts.

There's potential in Gotham. If they figure out how to make it into The Wire: Gotham City, I think it has the potential to be brilliant. Right now, though, it feels like Batman prequel fanwank.

 

[Mach5]

If they figure out how to make it into The Wire: Gotham City, I think it has the potential to be brilliant.

Call me silly, but that's EXACTLY what I was (secretly) hoping this show would be.

Instead, they gave us a campy CW show.

 

[Timby]

Between the "wink wink, look at this guy, he'll be a future villain" stuff and the eye-rollingly terrible dialogue, I think I'm going to check out of Gotham for a while. This is a very tonally confused show that feels half-Batman '66 and half-Nolan, with a dash of Burton mixed in, and it feels very muddled as a result. If they went full-on crazy, that'd be one thing, but nothing is telling me that anyone has an idea of what the show is supposed to be -- some actors are going whole-hog with their decisions, and every now and again the writing feels like it's going in that direction, but everything is so conflicted that it isn't coming together for me.

I'll check it out again later in the season, because I really like the leads and the visual style is pretty solid and maybe this will grow into something better ... but right now the dialogue and tone are just too much for me.

 

[Christopher]

Alfred is unrecognizable as any iteration of the character with which I'm familiar. Sean Pertwee is fine; the characterization is not.

I agree. At this point Alfred is a real creep. Going in a more soldierly direction like Michael Caine's Alfred or the Beware the Batman version is fine; Alfred's military service has been part of his backstory since the late '70s or early '80s. But he's also supposed to be a loving surrogate father, and there's little of that in evidence here. Partly he just doesn't get enough scenes to have any clear characterization yet.

You know, I'd wanted this show to focus on Gordon and downplay Bruce even more than it has. But so far Bruce is by far the most effective and compelling character, and we hardly see him.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

If they figure out how to make it into The Wire: Gotham City, I think it has the potential to be brilliant.

Call me silly, but that's EXACTLY what I was (secretly) hoping this show would be.

Nothing silly about that. That's what Gotham could easily be. I'd prefer, honestly, Homicide: Gotham City (in other words, more focus on the GCPD, less focus on the mob and life in Gotham), but either way Gotham needs more David Simon.

Instead, they gave us a campy CW show.

I'm not finding it campy. Just underthought and underwhelming. Last night reminded me a bit of Birds of Prey, and not in a good way.

 

[Mach5]

Last night reminded me a bit of Birds of Prey,

You too, eh? :/

and not in a good way.

There's a good way?

 

[Turd Ferguson]

Alfred is unrecognizable as any iteration of the character with which I'm familiar. Sean Pertwee is fine; the characterization is not.

I agree. At this point Alfred is a real creep. Going in a more soldierly direction like Michael Caine's Alfred or the Beware the Batman version is fine; Alfred's military service has been part of his backstory since the late '70s or early '80s. But he's also supposed to be a loving surrogate father, and there's little of that in evidence here. Partly he just doesn't get enough scenes to have any clear characterization yet.

You know, I'd wanted this show to focus on Gordon and downplay Bruce even more than it has. But so far Bruce is by far the most effective and compelling character, and we hardly see him.

I had complaints about Alfred from the pilot too, but giving it more thought, I can see where Alfred would be irritated with his current situation and grow into the loving Alfred later on.

For one, he is ex-military. He admitted to Gordon he never had kids. He's out of his element. Second, the Waynes gave him explicit orders not to let Bruce undergo any sort of counseling should anything happen to them. Watching his parents die has obviously done something to him mentally.

So, in the space of a couple of weeks, Alfred goes from cushy job cooking and cleaning for a rich couple and their weird son, to being put in a position where he has to CARE for the weird son, who now probably has PTSD.

Like I said, the father role is new to Alfred, and he hasn't raised Bruce since childhood to adapt to the role. He was just thrown into it. He'll probably evolve into the Alfred we all know and love later on.

Edit: From other incarnations, we see and even hear Alfred talk about the friendship he shared with Thomas and Martha Wayne. If he feels doubts about the situation he's in now, with the Waynes dead and Alfred taking on their son, he could possibly be feeling resentment for the Waynes for even putting him in that position, and is transferring that resentment onto young Bruce.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Last night reminded me a bit of Birds of Prey,

You too, eh? :/

and not in a good way.

There's a good way?

Dina Meyer sufficed. And when she wore a Batgirl costume was perfect.

 

[Agent Richard07]

We were never going to get The Wire on FOX.

 

[kirk55555]

I don't think I'm going to tune in next week. The villains are just lame. Penguin is boring and Mooney is annoying. Selina wasn't anything special, and Riddler is just bland. When it comes to the good guys, Gordon is ok, but that's about it. Alfred is probably the second worst written Alfred I've seen (although no one beats Nolan's Alfred as the worst Alfred). This episode just really didn't impress me, and I thought the pilot was just ok, so I think I'll give Gotham a pass. In a few weeks Arrow and Flash will be on, and between those shows and Agents of SHIELD I have more than enough good superhero shows to watch.

 

[Warped9]

My real question is what to do next week because I have two shows on at the same time: Gotham and the premiere of Season 8 of Murdoch Mysteries.

Gotham I'm just getting accustomed to and I'm curious to see more, but I really like Murdoch Mysteries already.

Hmm...

 

[Christopher]

Second, the Waynes gave him explicit orders not to let Bruce undergo any sort of counseling should anything happen to them. Watching his parents die has obviously done something to him mentally.

Actually what I like about this version of Bruce is how he's really very clear-headed, intelligent, and self-aware. His actions may seem crazy to the people around him, but they're actually calculated and rational, and they're motivated not by emotional instability but by his sense that he could've done more to save his parents, his desire to overcome his weaknesses so that he can do more to help others in the future. Yes, he's racked with guilt, but he's coping with it by choosing to make himself as effective as possible at helping others, so that he will never again have to feel he didn't do enough.

And that fits the way I prefer to interpret Batman. He's not anywhere near crazy or unbalanced; he's actually highly rational and competent, and has chosen to devote his existence to the service of others, to turn his tragedy into something positive, selfless, and constructive. And everything he does in service to that cause is calculated and carefully judged, no matter how strange it may seem to those who don't follow his reasoning.

Dina Meyer sufficed. And when she wore a Batgirl costume was perfect.

Dina Meyer was awesome as Barbara Gordon -- the best Babs ever aside from Tara Strong, and the best thing about Birds of Prey. The Batgirl costume was just the one from Batman and Robin with a new paint job, and nothing about that film was perfect.

Now, the other best thing about BoP was the late Ian Abercrombie as Alfred. Of course, the ultimate live-action Alfred will always be Alan Napier, but Abercrombie was nearly as good. So far Pertwee isn't even in the running. He needs better material.