Glaring flaw

[JeffinOakland]

Or maybe they justs fudged it because they figured the average fan wasn't keeping score. Ever noticed how the hero in most action flicks would need about five lives to survive the movie? Same thing here. If everything on Voyager actually happened, they would have needed about a dozen ships to survive the series.

 

[Guy Gardener]

All she had to do was sell the Kazon a replicator in the pilot and everything would have been fine.

Oh.

And shoot Neelix.

Janeway tells the Kazon they can't give them replicator technology because it's dependent on ship's power.

But if there are portable replicators for use in the field, a basic consumer version of a Starfleet field item perhaps, how are those things powered? Couldn't the ship's replicators create one and give them that? Perhaps it would be limited by the level of quantum resolution and unable to make highly sophisticated technological items.

The Prime Directive says that you cannot give advanced technology to unadvanced species since it will disturb their natural development and/or alter the balance of power in the region or further.

Which was very important in season two.

NEELIX: Forgive me, Captain, but are you sure going after the Nistrim is the wisest course of action after what they've already done to us?
JANEWAY: Let me make something very clear. The Nistrim are in possession of Federation technology. That is an unacceptable situation.
NEELIX: Even though all they've stolen is a small computer component?
JANEWAY: That small component has the potential to cause vast problems in this quadrant. You're our resident expert on the Kazon. What do you think the other sects will do when they realise the Nistrim have transporter capabilities?
NEELIX: They'll try to get it for themselves any way they can. You're right. It could alter the balance of power among the sects.

But they had gotten over that after a couple years...

JANEWAY: How many times have we shared replicators to help people feed and clothe themselves?
CHAKOTAY: Trading technology is part of our life in the Delta Quadrant.
TUVOK:: It has been necessary for our survival.
JANEWAY: Maybe we should have been a little more careful about what we traded and who we traded with. Replicators make weapons just as easily as they do food.
CHAKOTAY: We can't undo what's been done.

It's like with torture.

You can talk immediately, or you can talk after they cut your fingers off, but everyone talks.

 

[Hypaspist]

Or maybe they justs fudged it because they figured the average fan wasn't keeping score. Ever noticed how the hero in most action flicks would need about five lives to survive the movie? Same thing here. If everything on Voyager actually happened, they would have needed about a dozen ships to survive the series.

That's pretty much how I interpret it. I like the concept of Voyager and I like the stories. I don't like how the writers seem to be less invested in it than the fans and the actors.

They could have talked about consequences or about permanent changes to the ship, it wouldn't have been that hard. I think that was one of the reasons BSG was so appealing. What's odd to me is that there is a good deal of continuity in the series so far. I don't like that they save it for Deus Ex Machina situations while kind of taking for granted the technology. It's one of the things I'd like them to change in future shows: stop making some technology more primitive (scanners, engines, weapons) while using replicators and stuff to wave away all of the stuff that is actually pretty necessary and usually thoroughly explained in any sci fi.

 

[JeffinOakland]

Or maybe they justs fudged it because they figured the average fan wasn't keeping score. Ever noticed how the hero in most action flicks would need about five lives to survive the movie? Same thing here. If everything on Voyager actually happened, they would have needed about a dozen ships to survive the series.

That's pretty much how I interpret it. I like the concept of Voyager and I like the stories. I don't like how the writers seem to be less invested in it than the fans and the actors.

They could have talked about consequences or about permanent changes to the ship, it wouldn't have been that hard. I think that was one of the reasons BSG was so appealing. What's odd to me is that there is a good deal of continuity in the series so far. I don't like that they save it for Deus Ex Machina situations while kind of taking for granted the technology. It's one of the things I'd like them to change in future shows: stop making some technology more primitive (scanners, engines, weapons) while using replicators and stuff to wave away all of the stuff that is actually pretty necessary and usually thoroughly explained in any sci fi.

I enjoy Voyager. I think its thoroughly entertaining. However, I think, of all the series, it was the one that most consistently went for the "magic pill" solution to resolve life or death situations at the last second and covered it with pseudo-scientific/techie bullshit that would make George "midi-chlorian" Lucas blush with modesty. Most of the techie stuff like replicators, holodecks, tricorders, warp drives and transporters work as well or as poorly as the episode's plot needs them to & that's true throughout all ST but VOY and ENT seem particularly bad about this.

 

[Melakon]

TOS had the same sort of item broken due to plot as the other shows too. There weren't as many fancy sounding words available. Power's off in the galley? Make coffee with a hand phaser.

 

[Guy Gardener]

But every time someone does that, the alarm goes off.

 

[T'Girl]

It's because of Rand that Starfleet put the alarm in.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Warp particles!

I never got the rage against warp particles. We're talking made up, magical technology. It can generate live unicorns as a waste product, if they want.

 

[Mytran]

TOS had the advantage of never being too far out of range of a Starbase though, much easier to replace crew and supplies than being in the middle of the Delta Quadrant!

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Warp particles!

I never got the rage against warp particles. We're talking made up, magical technology. It can generate live unicorns as a waste product, if they want.

Only on the Shore Leave planet though. There are rules.

 

[Guy Gardener]

It's because of Rand that Starfleet put the alarm in.

In her defence, that was a lot of hair to straighten.

 

[Lance]

The problem with the theory that VOY just kind of builds/replicates replacement shuttles and equipment whenever they need to, is that the earliest episodes are always telling us that the ship has to conserve power, and that it's always scrounging around looking for alternative things to keep them going so they don't deplete their power reserves. The basic premise is that without Starfleet around, these guys have to fly by the seat of their pants a lot more, which is why we got things like 'Replicator Rations' and so forth. So, it ends up just being disappointing when the format then basically has them replicate all sorts of shit later on, and just handwaves it all away (or ignores it entirely).

That's one of the things I really quite liked about the first few seasons, they didn't just pull answers to these sorts of problems out of their ass like they did later on. Or if they did, they at least offered *some* explanation.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Personal use must be less than a hundredth of 1 percent, and luxuries a tiny percentage of that still.

What the crew spends on booze in a year is probably still uses less power than one phaser burp from the ships forward battery.

Although in an early episode, they "explained" that the power grid for the holodeck was incompatible with the power grids on the rest of the ship which is loser talk, and is later what is said then proves no longer to be the truth because the incompatibility was resolved off camera.

 

[Lance]

I can buy anything, just so long as we get a bullshit explanation for it.

I'm very susceptable to bullshit explanations.

If we were told that Tom Paris was building the DF out of scrap parts they found on some planet somewhere, that'd be enough for me. Anything would be better than "I've just pulled this new ship right out of my ass".

I think what does disappoint me a little about VOY as a series is that all that early stuff with the gell packs and the relicator rations and the ship only having a limited quantity of torpedoes and shuttles, is that it was all excellent universe building. It was setting the parameters in which the show was supposed to operate.

Later on we were just supposed to accept that, meh, they can just build new stuff because.

I mean, maybe Seven brought a shitload of expertise with her that let them solve all their problems over-night? That'd be a great bullshit explanation. I could buy that. Borg nanoprobes meant Captain Kate never had to go without coffee ever again.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I've always assumed that Voyager traded with friendly aliens they found along the way, to get new torpedoes, energy reserves, emergency food rations, etc. That's why they had enough power to run, say, the holodecks: a 'transfusion' from a passing alien ship gave them the reserves to do it.

 

[dub]

Warp particles!

I never got the rage against warp particles. We're talking made up, magical technology. It can generate live unicorns as a waste product, if they want.

Can a man say "warp particles" without being accused of showing rage?

I just found the scene itself annoying. And it felt contrived. YMMV. Nothing against magical technology. Or unicorns.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Can a man say "warp particles" without being accused of showing rage?

Warp particles are the new bitch.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Warp Particles were used in what? the third episode of Voyager ever, and never mentioned again, and NOW they're the bitch?

What we seem to have here is a sleeperbitch.

Waiting quietly till just the right moment when you least expect it.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

As soon as they come out people start throwing around slurs. Because apaz they are supposed to just be all quiet and dutiful in the warp core.

 

[Guy Gardener]

We'd have been better off if they'd all stayed in the closet where they belong.