Giving Kelvin another chance

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies: Kelvin Universe' started by Ricky, Feb 22, 2019.

  1. Ricky

    Ricky Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I'm resolutely not a fan of the Kelvin movies generally, when ST 09 came out I was a bit of a canon head (I'm cured now I've realised that things like that are less important than I originally believed). Strangely I really liked Star Trek: Beyond (I felt like standing up and cheering at the end and the cinema doesn't often make me feel like that). I can't really stand Into Darkness, chiefly due to not liking Cumberbatch but...

    Has anyone who was initially against the Kelvin movies managed to go back to them and do a turnaround? I'm itching to watch a bit of Trek between new episodes of Discovery and I'm incredibly curious to give the Kelvin movies a spin again.
     
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  2. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    I would be curious to hear what you do think if you do rewatch it. I know many who are ardently opposed at first but make some peace but I'm one who enjoys Kelvin Trek a whole lot, so not the best source ;)
     
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  3. Ricky

    Ricky Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I'm curious due to how my relationship with canon has changed since 2009. I was in my late twenties then and quite newly anal about it having just finishing marathoning everything from TOS through to ENT. The Enterprise finale was for me the kick in the balls it was for many and then ST09 was just... I don't know. I was angry about it and that says something for what a rematch may reveal.

    Because the thing is, now I'm bordering on my 40th birthday, I just don't get angry about things like Star Trek anymore. Like, I would have been one of the canon keepers deriding something like Discovery ten years ago. These days I love Discovery and don't really give a fig about how it fits into the TOS aesthetic and so on.

    II think I will return to at least ST09 over the weekend. Don't know if I ca stomach Cumberbatch though.
     
  4. Smellmet

    Smellmet Commodore Commodore

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    This 44 year old fan loved them from the start. They're worth revisiting, no question. I think all three are flawed (all in different ways) but hugely slick, entertaining blockbusters and I rewatch them as much as any other trek film.
     
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  5. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    I truly think you will be presently surprised. ST 09, among the 3, is the best, though I think an argument can be made that Kirk's arc is best served from all three films.
     
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  6. Ricky

    Ricky Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    One thing I really do like is the Kelvin Enterprise. I guess that's not a popular opinion. Nevertheless the Enterprise has never felt as grand to me as it did in those movies. I like the general look of the interior too excepting the Engine Room.

    How are the movies generally viewed by wider fandom? I know there's no consensus but there must be a general feeling towards them. For me, though I wasn't at the time, I'm really glad they exist now. The main cast throughout are strong and I think they serve their purpose. As Smellmet said, hugely slick, entertaining blockbusters.

    Thanks guys. I'm a massive Trek fan who's never made contact with fandom. Hello. I've got to make 14 posts before I'm deemed not to be a robot so I wanted to use them constructively. I'll watch the first one and it's nice to see some positivity directed towards a very creative and unique slice of the franchise.
     
  7. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

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    My feelings were complicated early on, my idea of canon and "what Star Trek is" versus really enjoying the movies. Early on I was a real fire and brimstone type (and a real asshole, which I apologize to anyone I might have offended back then), then settled down and started enjoying things for what they were.

    Heck, I've even been know to enjoy an episode or two of Discovery. :rofl:
     
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  8. Kor

    Kor Admiral Admiral

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    I had been burnt out on the Trek franchise for quite a while due to the sheer mediocrity of the brand in the 90s and early 2000s, though I still cared a great deal about TOS. Kelvin Trek made me love Star Trek in general again.

    Kor
     
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  9. USS Firefly

    USS Firefly Commodore Commodore

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    I think the Kelvin movies where good, I liked Beyond except for the new look of the Enterprise and how she was destroyed.
    But I loved how the crew worked together
     
  10. Pubert

    Pubert Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I've watched them all about 2 times. Didn't like them anymore the 2nd time around. Its finally done but now discovery is another abomination trek fans have to endure. In my opinion anyway.
     
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  11. TrickyDickie

    TrickyDickie Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Born 2 weeks after 'City' was first broadcast in '67, TOS was a big part of my growing up, watched TAS in first-run.

    I expected to hate TNG....ended up feeling it was so-so. Haven't seen the last few seasons yet. Haven't seen all that much of DS9, don't care too much for it. Have seen very little of VOY, not impressed. Have seen maybe half of ENT, with mixed feelings and plenty of apathy.

    I do like:

    "Yesterday's Enterprise"
    "Trials and Tribble-ations"
    "Flashback"
    "In A Mirror, Darkly"

    I am rather split down the middle with Discovery, thus far. On the whole, I do like it better than any series since TAS.

    I have a love/hate thing going with the first 6 movies. Elements that I really like and other things I can't stand.

    GEN: Hated the ending, in particular.
    FC: My favorite TNG Trek.
    INS: A hum-drum weekly episode on a larger screen.
    NEM: Like that better than most people do.

    So, there's some personal context prior to commenting on the Kelvinverse.

    I was prepared to hate the new movies to an extreme degree....and was very pleasantly surprised. I like them. I like the acting. They have a fine ensemble cast. Urban is my favorite. They say he apes Kelley. I think it's an homage and I think he does a hell of a good job.

    Of the 3, I like Into Darkness best. I don't even care that it 'recycles' TWOK in the way that it does. I feel that the plot of Beyond could have been stronger, but there is still a lot to like. I want more. I hope they get things smoothed out in the next year or two.

    And let's not be hatin' on ol' Cucumberpatch. :hugegrin:

    [​IMG]
     
  12. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    Endure what? Not watching it? :shrug:
     
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  13. Ricky

    Ricky Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Endure... Abomination... the hyperbole is strong in this one.
     
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  14. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    Sadly, I've seen it a lot discussing the Kelvin films and DSC.
     
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  15. Ricky

    Ricky Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    No, you know what, I've been pleasantly surprised by how nice it is around here.

    I come from bad places.

    Still haven't watched Star Trek but I have been watching little documentaries about it. I like stuff like that. About how the Enterprise bridge evolved or how the Kelvin's bridge is worn and used.

    I used to really rag on Abrams as trying to make a Star Wars movie with Star Trek window dressing but it's clear a lot more thought went into things than that. I dunno. I saw some clips while watching the documentary and saw things like the Enterprise being built on the ground... that really used to grind my gears but now... this Enterprise was built on the ground. The enthusiasm from the cast is clear, it's nice to see Nimoy bless 'im...

    I think I was very reverent of TOS at the time this movie came out and I couldn't decide between wanting the cast to do their own thing or go full homage. It's clear just from clips that we get both at times though and... Pine is really good. Even just in little bits. And Quinto as well for that matter.

    Another surprise for me was just browsing around here and finding that in 2009 Star Trek was pretty widely praised on here with people ranking it amongst The Wrath of Khan or First Contact. I suppose being able to enjoy them fully just needs a bit of time and distance. Kind of like how for a long time TAS was brushed under the carpet until finally we could watch it and enjoy it for what it is rather than pick it apart for the sake of 'canon'.

    A surprise for me ten years ago. As a Doctor Who fan primarily I was always slightly jealous of what I perceived to be a largely consistent canonical universe in Star Trek. Until I watched quite a lot of Star Trek and released parts of it aren't eve clear about what century they are set in. 'Canon' is less a collected set of rules that define a universe and what happens in it and more like a frantic scramble to fix all the leaks in Star Trek that inevitably spring up as soon as you even try to start rationally joining it all together.

    So yeah, bit of a rant but I feel it's slightly on topic because of the pleasure with which some regard the term 'Kelvin' as being synonymous with 'Doesn't Count'. If anything the fact that it's allowed to step outside of the chains of canon are (still) what make Star Trek an exciting prospect.
     
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  16. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    Well said overall, but I really appreciate this. There is a book at my local library (I might have to run copies today for the quotes) but Abrams was not as haphazard as the internet fandom has made him out to be. He had an understanding of the material that many fans do not just due to closeness or familiarity with the material.
     
  17. Khan 2.0

    Khan 2.0 Commodore Commodore

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    almost the same for me - meh on TNG until s3..then no seen all of the latter TNG seasons 6/7 (except the important eps Relics/AGT etc) seen barely any DS9/VOY and no care to do so, watched all of ENT via dvd when they first came out although can barely remember any of season 1/2 aside the notable EPs (pilot/Borg)..thought alot of s3 and esp 4 was pretty great. was expecting to hate DISC due to all the negativity until finally saw it on dvd and thought it was quite fun and certainly more appealing than DS9/VOY..(its basically like a continuation of ENT, like a s5 set about 100? years on)
    became a fan of Trek via the TOS movies II onwards in cinema and couldn't get enough of them even V (and around the same time became a bigfan of TOS via bbc2/vhs) and by VI/25th ann Trek was a huge deal to me but then tuned out somewhat with the end of TOS (around the time was discovering all the R rated SF - T2, Aliens, Predator, Blade Runner etc) before the prospect of 'Trek VII' reeled me back in.. was sad they botched the crossover but temporarily righted course with FC (trek was 'cool' at last) before watching with horror as they nose dived the series with the last 2 TNGs. was very hyped for ST09 and couldn't believe 'original' Trek was getting the big screen treatment again with Nimoy and a cool director after the demise of BermanTrek only bigger than ever (or at least as big as TMP was 30y prior) on the same scale as the current blockbusters Xmen, Terminator, Transformers etc and think STID is the best of the 3 (or at least on a par with ST09) its still crazy to me now to think theres a 200m budget Star Trek movie (and is a near remake of TWOK as well which I think was pretty fun).. but was very disappointed in Beyond aside the cool stuff (i.e. the Trek V photo scene - which I imagine Orci's Beyond would've been like for the whole movie:()
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2019
  18. TrickyDickie

    TrickyDickie Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    'Relics'....thanks for reminding me. :techman:
     
  19. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    Home of one of the best lines ever to be retconned ;)
     
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  20. XCV330

    XCV330 A Being of Pure Caffeine Premium Member

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    the Abrams movies are a lot of fun, and ill rewatch them again sometime. Into Darkness is my least favorite of them, even though it has some of the best "world building" in trek, but I like them all. My opinion on Into Darkness has improved a lot over time. ST09 and Beyond I loved right from the start.
     
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