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General Dune discussion thread (all books and adaptions).

Mage

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I think there was a general thread several years ago, but I know there's a rule for necro-posting. So I figured I'd start a new one.

With the two newest adaptions quite firmly in my mind, I decided to tackle Messiah, CoD and God Emperor of Dune as books. I'm pretty sure I read them as a teenager once, but it was the original novel that was always my favorite and I re-read that once every two years.
I also decided to re-watch the 1984 movie in the Spicedivers Edit, did that two days ago, and I'm currently tackling the miniseries from the early 2000's that cover the first three novels.

So far, it's quite interesting how alike and different all three versions of Paul are in the adaptions. Alec Newman seems to play young Paul quite childish at first, but slowly moving to the more reserved and cold character, as if to emphasize how young Paul really is at the beginning of the story . That same reservation is seen in Kyle MacLachlan's take, but it often seems to be fear, which is certainly a part of Paul's character when it comes to his visions and what his choices will do.
For me, Chalamet is the best interpretation of the character. He seems quite observing in his surroundings, noticing everything. Certainly most around his father and mother, and during rewatches, it seems as if he always has a slight mistrust of his mother. In his interactions with Duncan, you truly see him letting his guard down and allow himself to be a young teenager and talking about things that worry him. The commitment Paul has after taking the water of life in the novels is something Chalamet puts on screen in a terrifying way and sends chills down my spine, when you consider that impact his choices are having on the known universe.

It will be interesting, after knowing the stories well enough from the CoD miniseries, to really get back into the those novels again. I never read books 5 and 6 of Herberts original series, and I'll decide after finishing God Emperor if I will or not. I know there are fans who consider Herbert's later novels less great than his first, but I am curious. So we'll see about that after I finish those.
 
I was going to post in the main thread, but I forgot this thread existed so I'm going to post my thoughts here.

As I mentioned before, I tried to read Messiah years ago and I stopped after not getting far (I still don't know where I stopped after reading it again). This time around...well, I still didn't quite enjoy it but at least I finished it, if only for the sake of the upcoming film. Often times, it felt like a chore to get through the prose, which I felt like didn't flow well (no pun intended) as oppose to the original.

My biggest issue was how I didn't like how much of the dialogue (especially in the opening chapters) were constantly being interrupted with characters' inner thoughts, focusing on subtle movements on their part or observations of others' subtle movements, and thus planning five, six steps ahead of everyone. As a result, I rarely felt immersed in the actual conversations and when I went back and reread the opening chapter to find some particular information that was later referenced, I was amused and annoyed how little actual dialogue existed.

The conspiracy itself is interesting but only during the beginning and the ending of the novel. Everything else in between wasn't nearly as appealing, with the exception of everything with Alia. She was the only character I found engaging with a compelling story arc (although Bijaz also amused me). I was baffled how Irulan completely vanishes halfway through the story and she's only mentioned at the end having become remorseful (but we don't even get to see that moment!). Even Hayt disappears for a chunk of the second half until he's needed to move the conspiracy forward.

And then there's Chani. Hardly any characterization. She's robbed of her agency, robbed by Paul. And then she dies "off camera." Yes, Paul is remorseful for her death, but not for taking away her ability to chose her own destiny. He doesn't even ever consider telling her. Sure, that's part of his terrible burden of prescience and that further drives home that Paul isn't a good person, but it still sucks to watch it play out. I can only hope and pray that Villeneuve allows Chani to have more agency in the film.

On a completely different note, during the scene when Scytale pushes Edric to force Hayt to operate faster, I suddenly realized Edric reminded me a lot of Sil from Doctor Who, a recurring villain for The Sixth Doctor. Both are obnoxious, arrogant fucks who I could not stand and as a result I found myself hearing Sil's voice whenever Edric spoke. :lol:

I didn't expect to write this much about Messiah but clearly this wasn't an enjoyable experience. I rarely say this, but I really hope Villeneuve improves on the material and not just Chani's lack of agency.
 
I never read books 5 and 6 of Herberts original series, and I'll decide after finishing God Emperor if I will or not. I know there are fans who consider Herbert's later novels less great than his first, but I am curious. So we'll see about that after I finish those.
They're worthwhile. Lesser or not they still belong. I confess to having a soft spot for at least one of them if not both.
 
I never read books 5 and 6 of Herberts original series, and I'll decide after finishing God Emperor if I will or not. I know there are fans who consider Herbert's later novels less great than his first, but I am curious. So we'll see about that after I finish those.
I thought those novels were still good and it was interesting to see how the galaxy had developed. I would never recommend people don't read them.
 
Nor would I, it's just Dune was the peak for me. (edit) If I'd started with Heretics or God-Emperor, I don't know if I'd want to read Dune.
 
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