News Foundation Adaptation Series Officially Ordered by Apple

[Reverend]

Colour me skeptical, but even if the moon retained its integrity, the tidal interaction and atmospheric drag effects would soon cause it to deorbit and collide with Helicon. However, it was intended to look kind of cool, so I'm not bothered. One could simulate this in Universe Sandbox perhaps but I'm not going to bother. Foundation is more science fantasy than a science fiction entertainment as it stands anyway, like Star Wars. It would be ridiculous to nitpick painstakingly the depiction of orbital mechanics in a show that has a group of people with Jedi-like powers.

Yeah, I really can't see two planetary bodies being close enough for atmospheric contact without it causing major problems of the "earthquakes, tsunamis and hurricanes" persuasion for anyone living on either world.

That said; this is a show that has telepathy, precognition, 4th dimensional paperweights, faster than light travel, total negentropic stasis, and various other technologies that border on magic . . . so we should probably let it slide.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

I'm happy so long as I'm not bored. If I'm bored, I'll watch something else. Generally, I'm very pleased with Apple TV+ original content - Amazon Prime not so much...

 

[wayoung]

Anyone else feel like the money went to weird places on this show?

The CGI is mostly fantastic but some of the practical sets/effects remind me of The Expanse when the budget was down to nothing and the sets shook as people moved on them since they were made out of, like, cardboard. Same thing is happening here. And the "Young Hari" make up - oooffff.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Anyone else feel like the money went to weird places on this show?

The CGI is mostly fantastic but some of the practical sets/effects remind me of The Expanse when the budget was down to nothing and the sets shook as people moved on them since they were made out of, like, cardboard. Same thing is happening here. And the "Young Hari" make up - oooffff.

Wobbly sets and bad makeup take me back to the BBC TV drama series of my youth, such as I, Claudius (1976), which was saved by having an excellent screenplay written by Jack Pulman as well as an amazing cast and outstanding directing and camerawork. No amount of CGI VFX (which didn't exist then, of course) would have made up for a poor script.

 

[Marc]

Day is getting married and no one is happy about it, not even him.

better not be dissolving those extra clones just yet.

Though if Domion was to bear Day a child, I wouldn't give much for life expectancy afterwards.

Of course it also assumes that the genetic dynasty isn't shooting blanks or have any other fertility issues - after all as they're cloned it's probably not something that anyone's looked into.

 

[Morpheus 02]

better not be dissolving those extra clones just yet.

Though if Domion was to bear Day a child, I wouldn't give much for life expectancy afterwards.

Of course it also assumes that the genetic dynasty isn't shooting blanks or have any other fertility issues - after all as they're cloned it's probably not something that anyone's looked into.

Hmmm... but i wonder why the cloning was done in the first place (not kust the public reason, but the "real" reason

 

[David cgc]

Hmmm... but i wonder why the cloning was done in the first place (not kust the public reason, but the "real" reason

There's an episode later this season that's supposed to go into the founding of the Genetic Dynasty, but the stated reason seems reasonable enough to me. It's the same degree of egomania that goes into founding any monarchy, that you're intrinsically suited to lead and your offspring will be just as superior to the common folk, but now mediated by technology, so you don't have to worry about your perfect innate wonderfulness being diluted through the generations. Cleon thought he was the best Emperor ever, or at least definitely above the median, and decided it would be best if every Emperor after that him was exactly as competent as him.

 

[1987SpaceGuy]

this weeks episode finally revealed some of the secrets (we the audience knew) to the characters. About time.

• 
  
  Spoiler

  [*]I know you're a robot
  [*]You killed my family
  [*]the Cleon Dawn/Day cheating > betrayal is set up
  [*]the Spacers receive a independent freedom offer
  [*]the General/BF talk about options/outcomes if the would go against the Empire
  
  [*]Floating Harry
  [*]"Trapped" Salvor/Gal

 

[Snaploud]

So both Salvor and resurrected Hari are dead? What a strange plot.

We haven't seen Salvor die, and resurrected Hari might be a robot. I'm assuming either Gaal or robot Hari saves Salvor (which would fit with the vision of Salvor being around in the far future).

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

It would be pretty silly to resurrect Hari just to have him die on the next planet. We're meant to feel jeopardy for him and Salvor, but perhaps our minds are just being manipulated in a less subtle way than Tellem can achieve. Gaal appears to be potentially more powerful, so perhaps Tellem can also be deceived?

The series appears to be borrowing themes from Dune - the latest being the spacer navigators being genetically modified and needing a special substance to function that was thought impossible to synthesise. We'd already heard about the purge of robots, although not the reason. I don't recall how robots were meant to have disappeared in the novels. I think it was somewhat glossed over. Foundation and Earth revealed that robots hide their existence, and that they manipulate history to ensure the development of Psychohistory and the creation of the two Foundations.

 

[FPAlpha]

In itself the episode was interesting, the Queen to be finally has gotten confirmation that her family was killed intentionally, that Demerzel planned it on orders from Empire, i loved how Hober Mallow was a full on Trader and tried to convince the Spacers ( who just look awesome) that it would be best for them if they accepted his deal ( but basically just trading one master for another, who offers better terms) but once again the entire Mentalics storyline just isn't working for me because there simply is no apparent motivation for anyone visible, at least to me. Telem just seems evil for evil's sake and her reason is just to protect her people? Way too flimsy for my taste.

In the overall scheme i just don't understand where the show is going with all these storylines. In the books you could see progress happening with each new crisis as Terminus/The Foundation grew in power through all the crisis secretly supported and guided by the second Foundation. I don't see that happening here at all and while i love the Empire storyline, mainly due to Pace's scenery chewing it doesn't add much to the general direction of the show anymore.

I hope they can bring this together in the last 3 episodes of the season and get in any kind of track again, right at the moment it feels like the showrunners and writers think they're clever but are losing the plot so to speak.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Yes, there is absolutely no sense of the vast size of the Galaxy, the huge number of worlds involved, the vastly huger number of people, or the diminishing reach of Empire. In addition, Psychohistory might as well as not exist in this series as everything appears to rely on key individuals being present at critical nexuses in history. Both of these factors were somewhat evident in the original trilogy, but this adaptation appears to amplify rather than ameliorate them. However, what is presented is good enough for me to continue watching. It's not top tier, but it's nowhere near butt-clenchingly awful.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

The choice for Queen Sareth actress i found to be a hilarious one. She looks like she is about to stab Day any moment now. Which makes the whole plot with the Queen to be silly, because it obvious as day where this all going.

We've already seen Chekhov's (Mallow's) "gun" in action and one of the trailers suggested how it will be used.

Also i didn't found any signs that resurrected Hari is a robot. Where there any signs of it in the show that i missed? Cause to me it looks like he and Salvor( cause they showed her floating belly down) are dead.

I very much doubt they are dead. Various hints have been dropped that Hari's consciousness is not running on wetware. I expect Gaal and/or other mentalics will save the two of them.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Oh, I am probably wrong, but dramatically, it doesn't seem to make sense to kill off two main characters in a squalid way that doesn't advance the story.

 

[FPAlpha]

Oh, I am probably wrong, but dramatically, it doesn't seem to make sense to kill off two main characters in a squalid way that doesn't advance the story.

It is a cheap way to add drama and tension and has been done to death in shows and movies. Especially if it's done in a way that doesn't destroy the body or brain like a headshot, decapitation or something like it so after going out of their way to keep Gaal, Hari and Salvor in the show they will just kill the two of them by simple drowning? I just wish writers would finally drop this trope because it's tireseome.

If you want a character gone or reinforce the notion that your story has consequences really kill them. Game of Thrones became in part so popular because it was not afraid to dispense with plot armor early in its story. Fan favorite characters were gone like that, sometimes in really stupid ways but this is how people sometimes go, not in a blaze of glory. It only got bad when some of the characters got insane plot armor and the show turned into a typical Hollywood story with last minute saves.

So yeah, they're not dead or they will be resurrected by some technical or mentalic mumbojumbo so they can continue in the show. I wish i was wrong or they have something unique planned, i'm just not holding my breath that the writers are better than what they appear to be.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Yes, it's not the best writing to insert yet another The Perils of Pauline cliff-hanger that will be easily resolved with barely an inconvenience. This adaptation seems almost designed to be confusing, but perhaps that's me being dense - and I like to believe I'm relatively familiar with the original stories compared to the average audience member.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Hari cannot predict the goings on of an individual.

Hari has a hundred years early warning on the Mule.

The mule is not an outlier.

The Mule is a tool of Psycho History.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

In Asimov's original novel, Sheldon uses Psychohistory to predict that he and Gaal will be arrested with a very high probability. Given its stated theoretical basis, Psychohistory was problematic and used inconsistently as a story device from the start. Really, we give the concept far too much respect. It's always liable to come unstuck when it is applied at the micro rather than macro level.

 

[EmoBorg]

Spoiler: Episode 8

We might be getting the origin story of the Mule. cough....cough....Tellem. Her ability to transfer her conscious and abilities to the next host reminds me of the opening scene of the X-Men Apocalypse movie.

Demerzel being the true power is an interesting reveal. That feminine ability to manipulate men while appearing to be subservient to them has helped her out in her quest to be the forever empress.

The empire will fall eventually because Dawn is conspiring with the Dominion princess and as well as Dusk and his Dominion lover finding out about Demerzel's centuries old manipulations. Both couples will make their move against Day and Demerzel and the empire will fall as a result.

As for the horny cleric girl, the drunk old man and the con artist, i am hoping that empire executes them because i don't really like their characters but since they are the protagonists of the story, i guess that they will survive and continue to promote the voodoo mathematics of Hari Seldon.

As usual, Lee Paces continues to hit it out of the park with his great acting in this latest episode. A good story needs a good villain in order to be better . A bad story needs a good villain to rise above mediocrity.

The Day character is a good villain.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

@EmoBorg

Ahem, perhaps lay off on the spoilers until people in time zones to the west of you have had a chance to watch the episode? M'kay?

It doesn't bother me particularly as I had guessed them as likely possibilities, but it might annoy other people.

For me, a good villain is one who believes he is the good guy and who even justifies his reprehensible actions with reasonable arguments - albeit, from a restricted point of view, perhaps. We are all villains from some point of view, although we find it hard or impossible to acknowledge that fact. Hence Tellem's lecture about consuming other lifeforms - animal or plant - in a previous episode. We feel we need to survive so we do what we must.