First-Timer's Impressions of Enterprise

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by Jimmy Bob, Jul 6, 2009.

  1. commodore64

    commodore64 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I can't believe I'm going to type this, especially since I'm suck a nerdy TOS fan, but: I never cared. I read Rodenberry wanted different makeup and just -- in my mind -- associated all the other Klingons the same way. It's kind of like, to me, seeing ET without the guns by the police or some added scenes to Star Wars. Both an unneeded modification in my opinion.

    On the scene, ha! You're right. It must be the next episode. I lumped all the Klingon episodes together. It's more convenient than me watching them again. ;)

    It's kind of that way with the whole series. We never know what happens with the Federation, how the Federation enters the Romulan war (other than Balance of Terror and fanon), what happened to the characters, etc. I mean, the most we know about any of the characters is Archer (partly thanks to the latest Star Trek movie where Porthos got killed) and Trip.
     
  2. HopefulRomantic

    HopefulRomantic hyperpolypyroferricist redux Moderator

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    Actually, Porthos dematerialized...and was still MIA at the point where Scotty tells the story in the movie.

    (The question of what happened to Porthos is answered more specifically in the novelization.)
     
  3. Guardian Bob

    Guardian Bob Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    How could it be Porthos? That dog would be so old and probably have died of age. Might be another beagle.
     
  4. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    You know what's funny? I actually don't remember that episode anymore.

    It feels so weird to see my earlier posts again and even weirder getting either called on them or just a random observant in-universe comment like that.

    And only now am I truly realizing just how much the show has changed from season 1 to season 4.
     
  5. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Bound

    I'm an Orion Slave Girl fanboy. And this was pure heaven.

    It was lighthearted fun. I loved it. The plot? What plot? This episode is about staring at those beautiful green girls and thinking about important things.

    For example, do I like that Orion girl in Borderlands more or do I like Navaar more?

    [​IMG]

    or

    [​IMG]

    Eh, it's fun and no harm. I laughed at all the small antics. I enjoy this kind of stuff. It's all I really have to say. Fun.

    Trip's tale of leaving comes to an end... wish there would have been more of this. It was a bit too easy.

    Oh, and Happy New Year!
     
  6. bluedana

    bluedana Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    My only problem with Bound is that it would have made much more sense for the female crew and MACOs to save the day, perhaps along with Trip, who's unaffected (and has to be as part of the plot). They lost me when they had male security guarding the Orions in the brig. Corporal MacKenzie would have pounded Navaar into the ground if she'd tried anything. That part of the plot was a contrivance I couldn't really get past.
     
  7. commodore64

    commodore64 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, I'm with you, Blue. I thought they missed some potentially great plot points:
    * Hoshi and T'Pol have to team up to put those skanky Orion women in their places
    * T'Pol not only sees the captain is effected, but ... uhm ... DOES SOMETHING ABOUT IT!
    * The women of Enterprise don't have to rely, as they squeal and/or fret, on Trip; they can do some butt kicking on their own
    * Yet again, the dude who used to be in charge of Engineering, Kelby, emerges as a massive tool
     
  8. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    The Pilot for the aborted MU Enterprise: Empress Sato Mini-Series

    This is probably the greatest thing Enterprise has ever done. As I understand it, this was supposed to continue on in season 5 as a series within the series. And what a great series it would have been.This two-parter really creates really interesting and delicious characters. I guess it might have turned out to be something similar to nuBSG in tone.

    We have Commander Archer, a delusional man suffering from an inferiority complex bordering on insanity. I got a certain Gaius Baltar vibe from him, when he was speaking with the "respected and succesful Archer from the other universe". Really broken man.

    Then we have Phlox. A second-class citizen trying to be as truly Terran as possible, twisted inside, sexually deprived to a point of perversion, enjoying torture. And like all people in this universe, he just hungers for a little respect and safety.

    Reed - A deliciously perverted military guy. Would like to be trusted and makes a lot of good suggestions, but always goes unheard due to captain Archer suffering from a very delusional inferiority complex.

    T'Pol - a broken second-class citizen, letting herself be sexually used to survive, discovers hope when reads that in the other universe humans and aliens work together, and wants to witness that world herself. Like everyone else, she too is just after some safety and love.

    Trip - the disfigured creepy engineer, who's only hope for a physical contact is a desperate vulcan in her biological cycle that despises him to the core.

    This would have been wonderful. And let's not forget Empress Hoshi Sato, the deliciously manipulative woman who climbs from bed to bed to become the most powerful woman ever. This two-parter just made love with Linda Park. And so did everyone else. Man she was just so great in this.

    This "series within the series" would have been a real love-fest with these actors. They would have gotten so much to do. Truly, we've been robbed. Just one more frikking season, god dammit, was that too much... if anyone stumbles through a hole delivering him back in time to early noughties, feel free to change history. I wouldn't mind. In fact, anyone know the nearest hole through the fabric of space-continuum?

    Although, as always Anthony was just an extra. But at least he got to do "owned bitch!" scene to Archer in the end. And who knows, perhaps in season 5 he would have gotten to be very deliciously abused by Hoshi.

    Truly great byzantine plot... in fact I was just reading about Byzantium before watching this episode, and I was like "whoa, this is just like Byzantium."

    You get a whole new respect for these actors. At least they got to enjoy themselves in such a way. And with all the major Enterprise characters getting killed, the minor ones would have had much more spotlight.

    Great episode. Just brilliant. Pure fucking genius. God, someone invent a time machine already!

    Long live the Empress Hoshi Sato!
     
  9. commodore64

    commodore64 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Glad you liked it! I liked it, too. I thought the characters were nice mirror images of themselves. I mean, none of them were too far afield from the regular character, which makes it so much better. Kudos to Sussman who wrote it. I thought the way Archer died was, in short, brilliant. Yeah, Empress Sato was fun.

    I don't know if it was intended to "live on" in season 5. I think Coto talked about a great many things, some of which would never come to pass and some of which were pipe dreams. From reading interviews, I read everything from how Archer was going to be moved to a minor character, Shran in more episodes, how Trip ... well, I'll save that until you watch TATV, and how we'd have some more TOS copies (not homage) on episodes that were kinda painful the first time (like Cloud Miners). I'm not sure they knew other than hoping beyond hope that they'd make it to season 5.
     
  10. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Demons

    OMG Buffy failed! The Mayor is still alive! Don't trust him Archer! He only seems nice because... he is very nice, but he's also very very evil.

    Verdict?

    It's not gritty enough. I think Peter Weir's great, but the whole thing just has an unnecessary Bondish vibe to it. Moonrakerish to be exact. Multibillionaire who hates aliens, builds a super-duper spacebase and then flies with it to Mars. Cliffhanger. Just very Moore-era Bond (to be honest, I should actually say Connery-era, because films like From Russia weren't a majority while films like Finger and Live Twice were).

    There's also this gap. There they were just out there, getting missions and solving them, going through some personal stuff... and-and, already an universal translator and Federation founded (kinda)? I feel... I get it, the series is ending... but just one more regular episode? Doesn't feel right.

    And don't you just love those out-of-body pregnancy experiences that make life much more easier for everyone? No offence to Trip/T'Polers out there, but the writers are really mishandling it. I like it that they have this unhappy relationship... but, but not that interesting much. Sorry. Could have used more drugs and more soul destroying sex.

    But a baby from nowhere?

    Travis got lines. I was wondering what was up with that. It was like "omg the show is cancelled but we still haven't had anything for Anthony to do! I know, let's pull out an old girlfriend we've never seen or heard about from our asses!" And we have Peter Weir doing his regretful racist thing, and Travis doing some monologues while a pretty girl is watching... and it was just sad. Tragical. Funny, in that desperate sad way. Travis is a tragedy. Just sad. 4 years... and nothing. Just some lines in almost the end, that aren't even that interesting.

    So the girlfriend is a spy? Big deal.

    Personally, I was interested in those racist moments and thus would have prefered a more gritty look into racism. So having this out-of-body pregnancies and bondish villains....

    Perhaps Terra Prime will blow my mind.

    So how am I going to finish this thread? I'll watch TP and do an usual episode impression, then I'm going to do a season analysis. Then there will be a little break and then I'll watch TATV and do this big epic final post where I analyze the series and compare it to the other series (except DS9 which I haven't seen).
     
  11. Bones2

    Bones2 Commodore Commodore

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    You haven't seen DS9? You should definitely go through that. Wish I had the opportunity to watch 7 seasons of DS9 anew.
     
  12. commodore64

    commodore64 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I thought you were far too kind. I thought it was miserable.
    1. T'Pol and Trip have a baby for some unknown reason. And Trip acts like a jerk when he finds out about it. If he had been in love with T'Pol, you'd think he'd try to understand what was happening first.
    2. Neither of them go under cover. I mean, are you freakin' kidding?! Whoah, what a big surprise someone recognizes them.
    3. Poorest use of Peter Weller ever. I thought, as you did, the character wasn't very understandable. And his use is the very thing that really annoyed me about season 4: fanwank TOS references. If Col. Green had never been mentioned, the character would've still had as much (which means none) impact.
    4. Travis finally has a purpose, but it's incredibly boring. And the girlfriend was really awfully predictable.

    Very little around to save this one.

    And I couldn't agree more about your assessment of Trip/T'Pol.
     
  13. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    One day I will. There are after all 28 Trek seasons. I saved DS9 for the last.

    Could try amnesia. You know, tattoo a message like "watch DS9" on your body, then lose all of your memories... and voila! Completely anew watching experience.

    Yeah. :guffaw:She didn't even cover her ears.

    I wonder why I kept saying Peter Weir. :confused:

    I'm thinking that if this is really the end then season 4 isn't very complete. While I love the structure and the episodes, it just seems to lack that satisfying oomph that season 3 had.
     
  14. commodore64

    commodore64 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Couldn't agree with you more. I love TOS, but I would've loved less pure fanwank in season 4. What I liked about season 3 best is the sheer desperation of the characters and the depths to which they sunk in order to eventually triumph. I didn't feel like any character, other than Archer, grew in season 4. Instead, it felt a little like the characters devolved. Unsatisfying.
     
  15. indranee

    indranee Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Jimmy Bob, love your assessment of the series. looking forward to your take on TATV ;)

    btw, we did hear "son of a bitch" in Trek before. in TVH.
     
  16. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Terra Prime

    Well that was... lacklustre. I must say it followed so immediately from Demons that it would have been better if I had viewed them together like I did with most of the episodes from this season. I mean, there's just this action and the big bad gets killed halfway through the episode.

    And then there's the speech.

    The End.

    I can appreciate it's intentions. "The final threat is humanity itself!" "It's the full circle! The mildly xenophobic crew of first season must now face the same evil and ignorance they so long left behind them!" „Xenophobia is always the same!“

    But...

    I can appreciate that it tried to give every member of the cast something to do in this episode. But...

    What was up with that random traitor commiting a random suicide in a random dramatic scene? That was just so random.

    And thus it made Travis's great detective discovery of the century! also quite random. And the whole girlfriend thing was just rendered meaningless. And Hoshi's great thing is just waiting before she shoots. And Malcolm's great thing is meeting with Section 31. And... it's all rather artificial.

    Couldn't they just sit down and talk with each other. That would have been also quite celebratory.

    I liked Trip's punch and the lines before it - his great contribution to the episode. But what was up with that 80's synth music when he did his MacGyver thing? So random.

    I liked that the ending had a somewhat bittersweet tone. Can't say T'Pol really loves Trip. It's more like growing together.

    But Travis's scene with his random girlfriend from his random past was just sad on so many levels. Plus Anthony's acting was just random. Did we really need to see that?

    I'd rather they had a camping trip together and just reflecting on past four years. Travis would probably have gotten more lines. And probably better too.

    Season analysis following soon. Then TATV and The Big Epic Final Post.
     
  17. ialfan

    ialfan Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I have to say I'm kind of surprised. In my opinion Demons/Terra Prime is right up there with "All Good Things..." And "What You Leave Behind" as far as series finales go. But it's always interesting to see different opinions. I've really enjoyed your reviews. :)
     
  18. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Concluding thoughts about Season 4

    I liked this season. I liked it a lot. All the episodes were rather enjoyable. But it kinda ditched the characters. Season 3 had a strong character conflict, a sense of journey. And I missed that feeling in this season. It's all cool, mission-based and everything, but I just didn't get that satisfying feeling of oomph.

    When watching this season I often found myself thinking that they should have done this from the beginning. Like those scenes in Demons/Terra Prime where Malcolm meets with that Section 31 guy. I realized that the first three seasons didn't actually build a world. Season 4 did a lot of brilliant worldbuilding. And I'm thinking that the show would have been better if this worldbuilding was in the beginning already. Certainly Malcolm's "pulled-it-out-from-our-ass" Section 31 past in season 1 would have probably given him much more to do.

    I didn't actually think of this worldbuilding stuff in season 1, but only because I had no idea what I was missing. And now I'm really longing for more of this world.

    Let's talk about the characters now.

    Archer - Archer in this season is a different man than he was in season 1. But I can't exactly pinpoint the differences. It's more about the way he carries himself, his attitudes, his reactions. Minor details. But he feels different. However in this season he somewhat turned into a minor character. He didn't grow in this season, the result of his change was the work of previous 3 seasons. He was just the experienced guy solving important missions professionally in this season.

    T'Pol - T'Pol is also a character that has changed a lot from season 1 to season 4. Remember when T'Pol last smiled? In season 1 she was this innocent very curious vulcan girl. She also had quirky sense of humor. She was cute and sunny and everyone loved her. Now she's this broken damaged unhappy woman walking around with a look that says "I am dead inside." Exhausted from sadness.

    I liked T'Pol's scenes in Terra Prime. I can't think of anything bright to say about them, but I'm just thinking of scenes where she was with the baby and the end when she was with Trip.

    I remember when I feared that crazy Kir'Shara thing might turn her into something weird... but that was more akin to a sad woman trying to find peace in Jesus, so to speak. Didn't really work. Because the key to faith is self-imposed brainwashing and I guess she's not that disciplined yet.

    She's one of the saddest characters in Trek. I mean literally sad, not in that smug criticizing way.

    Trip
    - I don't think that Trip/T'Pol really worked to the benefit of Trip's character. Sure their stuff is one of the few character-related stuff that spans the entire season... but, being the unloved man was all he was about in this season. I was hoping for him to get something cooler to do. Man stuff. Blow someones brains out or something.

    I do admire that their relationship is an atypical one. It's not in love, it's not star-crossed lovers. It's an unhappy relationship where two sad people make themselves more miserable. And T'Pol doesn't really love Trip. Or unless that's the way vulcans love, in which case I'm seriously reconsidering the thought of getting myself a vulcan girlfriend.

    Phlox - Oh he got a lot of cool episodes where he is involved in the action - That Klingon Jesus duology, and one of those Augments episode where we met his friend, and other things I can't think the names of. But in a way, he was also rather travisified in this season. Doctor has never got any really personal stuff do to, but in this season he was just there. Played masterfully by John Billingsely, but just there.

    Malcolm - In a way, this season was the best season for Malcolm. He got personal conflict, sins of the past, conflict with Archer - the whole deal. He needed something like this a long time to break that stoic dull characterisation. Remember, in season 3 Malcolm was just a guy who shot things.

    Hoshi - Travisified. Completely travisified. Unjustly undeveloped character. The only thing that Hoshi got in this season was like something out of season 1/2 with her still waxing poetical about Brazil. However, this season pretty much made love with Linda. In A Mirror Darkly was basically a tribute, with almost every cast member making love with Linda... hmm... Doesn't sound that tributy when I say like this, but it was a Linda Park lovefest.

    Travis - "OMG the show is cancelled and we still have no idea who this guy is?!? I know, let's give him an old love that's completely pointless and laughable!" Desperate roll against travisification. Failed. Oh well. When people talk that Chakotay and Harry Kim were underdeveloped it means something completely else. Chako and Kim at least got to make jokes... hell they at least had lines and episodes. They interacted with other people. Travis got nothing. :(

    I'm starting to think that the way this season was done didn't leave much room for the characters. The structure of season 3 was much more character-friendly. Well, it is possible give characters attention with this mission-based structure, but Trek writers have never been very character-friendly. I'm seriously thinking that Archer, T'Pol and Trip are the best developed Trek characters (that I've seen so far) purely by accident alone. So when we have character-unfriendly writers and then we give them a mission-based structure that encourages to focus on the mission... in a way, it is the most impersonal of seasons.

    I love the mission-based structure, I love the missions, the plots, I think many things were rather brilliant in this season... but our crew was more in the background and spotlight mostly went to guest characters. Which isn't a bad thing, but you want something for the main cast too. The people you are following from episode to episode.

    So that's what I'm thinking right now.
     
  19. Bones2

    Bones2 Commodore Commodore

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    Umm, you missed an episode out. A true classic at that.
     
  20. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    :)

    Didn't miss, just doing it a bit differently.