"First Contact" - The rape of Riker

Discussion in 'Star Trek: The Next Generation' started by Ragitsu, Jun 26, 2022.

  1. Ragitsu

    Ragitsu Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    ?
     
  2. Vger23

    Vger23 Vice Admiral Admiral

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  3. Herbert

    Herbert Commodore Commodore

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    You name it and someone here will come up with it.
     
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  4. Oddish

    Oddish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I normally enjoy "First Contact", but yeah. Not sure whether it was rape or not, but it was creepy as hell.
     
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  5. Ragitsu

    Ragitsu Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    It is in the context of the present discussion that I am curious about the "nonsense".

    I wonder what classification that act would fall under (concerning US law, anyhow).
     
  6. Herbert

    Herbert Commodore Commodore

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    I'm curious what is your motivation for bringing this up at all. It's one event that took place on a TV show 31 years ago. We all know the episode in question. Nothing can be done to change it. Is this just a social justice windmill to tilt at?
     
  7. Serveaux

    Serveaux Mediocre Old White Man Premium Member

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    So, the "Lilith bags Riker" scene wasn't part of our draft nor, IIRC, was it in the Moore/Menosky version. I'm pretty sure that Michael Piller came up with it.

    We all were aware of the parallels in the story with flying saucer contactee stories and worked little references in, here and there, but I think Piller was the only writer who really took the license to really go for the humor that everyone knew was inherent in it. Yeah, the scene is written and played for laughs.

    I've no observation about the rest of this, but I do know that this scene is how most people I've encountered over the years remember the episode.

    "Which one is 'First Contact?'"

    "You know, the one where Lilith bags Riker in the alien hospital."

    "Oh, yeah, I remember that one."
     
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  8. Ragitsu

    Ragitsu Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    As far as I am aware, no one has called for the abolishment of current Star Trek or for this thread's episode (i.e., "First Contact) to be removed/censored.
     
  9. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I dunno if it's rape or not, but it is definitely sexual coercion.
     
  10. Oddish

    Oddish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Maybe they should retitle it "Earth Guys are Easy".
     
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  11. Ragitsu

    Ragitsu Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    It's funny how certain people say much when they think they're saying little.
     
  12. Serveaux

    Serveaux Mediocre Old White Man Premium Member

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    It's a commutative property of conversation.
     
  13. David cgc

    David cgc Admiral Premium Member

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    Why are we talking about anything here, in that case? Should we ask the admin to close all the forums except for shows that are actively airing episodes that week?
     
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  14. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Not going to deny that there might have been a bit of coercion or exploitation of Riker going on in this episode, but also, not having seen the episode in a long time, I don't recall Riker especially seeming to have a problem with it, which is perhaps the most important aspect to consider?

    I grant it may have elicited stronger reactions if it was Troi or Crusher in place of Riker here, and if Lanel was presented as male (I don't think we get much specificity about the genders of the aliens here?), but again, if they go along with it willingly then I'm not sure it's our place to make a fuss over it if the involved people themselves aren't doing so. This of course assumes that the reactions we're witnessing are sincere on their parts, versus being faked for their exploiter's benefit.
     
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  15. Ragitsu

    Ragitsu Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Even if the nurse had been female (in that hypothetical Troi scenario), the coercion still would have come off as bizarre at the minimum.
     
  16. Ryan Thomas Riddle

    Ryan Thomas Riddle Screenwriter | Award-Winning Journalist Premium Member

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    STAR TREK is filled with consent issues, such as this one played for laughs. As someone who has been assaulted, it's a bit hard to watch at times.
     
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  17. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    When do we stop talking about Star Trek?
     
  18. Maurice

    Maurice FACT TREKKING across the universe... Premium Member

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    Ummm...have you met the TrekBBS? People are still complaining about "The Cage."
     
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  19. Oddish

    Oddish Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Maybe if they didn't give us such a big target...
     
  20. Arpy

    Arpy Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I feel a little gross defending it (maybe I should rewatch it) but a couple thoughts that come to mind. One, Lilith didn’t seem like a bad person. If Riker made a case for why this was really problematic for him, she might have let her kinky dream go and just helped him. Played for laughs, Riker felt it would just, uh, “be faster” to indulge her fantasy and move on. Two, in a truly egalitarian future, would it have made a difference if the sexes were reversed? Contextually, the show aired in our society in 1991, not in a future egalitarian utopia. But if it were say Ro and a male nurse, well, I can picture her annoyed but getting to point b. The male nurse calling out, “Can I give you my number?” as she disappears around the corridor.
     
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