Enterprise as a prequel to the reboot movies?
- Thread starter borgboy
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Over the past few years I've been watching the series in Stardate order, so I started with "Broken Bow" and I'm currently up to TNG Season 7/DS9 Season 2. And so far I've found that Enterprise is really on it's own in terms of continuity with the TOS to Voyager continuity, while it has a lot stronger continuity with the Abramsverse films. "These Are The Voyages" and "The Pegasus" have so many differences in terms of the story (not to mention why does Riker tell Troi about the events of 12 years earlier when Pressman specifically told him to discuss it with no one---and I would assume that would include medical staff---, not even Captain Picard! Plus in "The Pegasus" Pressman seems to be keeping a close eye on Riker), that the two episodes could be in two different episodes (I saved watching TATV till I was upto "Pegasus" as the two episodes are suppose to occur on the same Stardate).
With "The Defiant" from "The Tholians Web", it did cross over into a Mirror Universe, so how do we know that it is the Mirror Universe that's the opposite of the universe in Enterprise. It could've been a completely different Mirror Universe where by the 24th Century we still had a Terran Empire. And the Defiant was just like the Prime Spock in the Abrams movies.
But it also didn't help that Enterprise had so many episodes in the first 3 seasons that don't even deserve to be called filler episodes, as they used up 98% of their plot within the first 5 minutes of the episode and then spent the other 40 minutes just going from this scene to that scene, with no reason, just to fill up screen time. And the first three seasons really did not attempt to connect the series to TOS (at times they seemed to throw TOS out the window and make stronger ties to Ztng/DS9/Voyager, while saying TOS did not exist).
With "The Defiant" from "The Tholians Web", it did cross over into a Mirror Universe, so how do we know that it is the Mirror Universe that's the opposite of the universe in Enterprise. It could've been a completely different Mirror Universe where by the 24th Century we still had a Terran Empire. And the Defiant was just like the Prime Spock in the Abrams movies.
But it also didn't help that Enterprise had so many episodes in the first 3 seasons that don't even deserve to be called filler episodes, as they used up 98% of their plot within the first 5 minutes of the episode and then spent the other 40 minutes just going from this scene to that scene, with no reason, just to fill up screen time. And the first three seasons really did not attempt to connect the series to TOS (at times they seemed to throw TOS out the window and make stronger ties to Ztng/DS9/Voyager, while saying TOS did not exist).
I think all of the shows, including TOS, are supposed to be extrapolations into the future. It's not like the goal of 60s Trek was to "look 60's". If the décor does bear a 60's flavor that is because the set designers were living in the 1960's. I think the goal should be futuristic, not retro. Having a 60's style in the 60's was not being "retro", it was being contemporary.
If in later years some people think the Enterprise sets look very "early 2000's" I don't think it would therefore be fair to say that that should be or was the goal. Should a prequel to Enterprise have 80's style? Isn't that a little silly?
The ships and tech should look far more advanced than our own. We cant help it if modern day sensibilities and style elements creep in. We should be aiming at something vastly more advanced than present day Earth no matter what TOS looked like. It has to have backward continuity too. To not be or seem less advanced than what we have now. Or inexplicably copy the style of 50's SciFi.
If in later years some people think the Enterprise sets look very "early 2000's" I don't think it would therefore be fair to say that that should be or was the goal. Should a prequel to Enterprise have 80's style? Isn't that a little silly?
The ships and tech should look far more advanced than our own. We cant help it if modern day sensibilities and style elements creep in. We should be aiming at something vastly more advanced than present day Earth no matter what TOS looked like. It has to have backward continuity too. To not be or seem less advanced than what we have now. Or inexplicably copy the style of 50's SciFi.
What continuity does it have with the Abramsverse? At best it might share some SFX tech with ST09, because they were made with in 5 years of each other.
Some TOS-VOY continuity in Enterprise
Broken Bow shows and directly references Zephram Cochrane from TOS and TNG. Mayweather mentions the Vega Colony from TOS.
Fight or Flight is about Axenar from TOS
Terra Nova mentions the New Berlin Colony also mentioned on TNG and DS9.
Andorian Incident is of course about the Andorians, first seen in TOS. Plus there are references to Surak and kohlinar
Unexpected mentions the Tellerites first introduced in TOS and features the Malurians, also from TOS, as the badguys.
Should I go on?
Because there would be no point to the episode other wise.
Here's some continuity with a Enterprise in the Abramsverse movies:
The maldeveran mud fleas that McCoy injects Kirk with come from "Canamar".
The Klingons head jewelry in "Into Darkness" is connected to the ending of the Klingon arc in Season 4 where it was suggested the Klingon doctor should get into forehead reconstruction/plastic surgery.
Spock was born prior to the Narada's entrance into the timeline.
A Cardassian was first seen in the repair station episode---Uhura orders a couple of Cardassian sunrise drinks in the 2009 movie. As far as we know, in the Prime universe the Federation did not know of the Cardassians till sometime in the early-24th century (the Cardassians occupied Bajor for 50 years, so that would've been from 2318/9-2368/9, so the Federation knew of the Cardassians from at least 2318). (Just like the Federation did not know of the Ferengi and Borg till 2364 and 2365 aside from rumours and false truths).
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In some areas of Trek it is suggested that the Vulcan captain seen in "First Contact" is Solkar, great-grandfather of Spock. Depending on when Skon was born, if in the Prime universe it was after the events of FC, then Sarek and Spock should not exist in the Mirror universe.
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Yep, for that matter, TNG has started to feel very much a product of the 1980s.
I totally forgot about this ENT - ST'09 link. A D'Kyr-class Vulcan ship zips by just before the school scene!
Well, we have no idea how old Solkar is in this scene, or when Skon's birth took place. It is entirely possible that Skon has already been born.
That model Into Darkness seemed pretty good evidence as was the references to Porthos in ST09.
Also didn't JJ say Enterprise was considered cannon for the reboot?
That huge trench in Iowa the car falls into from ST09 I always assumed was from the Xindi. Granted the Enterprise eposide stated it went from lower Alabama/Florida gulf coast to South America...
But also over time people forget attacks, how often do you hear "Remember the Maine" in the USA today.
I think that trench is the foundation for the shipyards that would one day be built on that site.
Actually, it is a prequel to both timelines. The aforementioned NX-01 model in Admiral Marcus' office is proof Enterprise existed in the JJverse.
Also, in In a Mirror Darkly, the Defiant, sent from the Prime Universe 23rd century into the 22nd century Mirror Universe, had a clear database entry for a Jonathan Archer that was captain of the Enterprise NX-01, Ambassador to Andoria and President of the United Federation of Planets, thereby establishing Star Trek: Enterprise as a canon part of the Prime Universe.
Also, in In a Mirror Darkly, the Defiant, sent from the Prime Universe 23rd century into the 22nd century Mirror Universe, had a clear database entry for a Jonathan Archer that was captain of the Enterprise NX-01, Ambassador to Andoria and President of the United Federation of Planets, thereby establishing Star Trek: Enterprise as a canon part of the Prime Universe.
The Maine blew up because of a dust explosion in one of her coal bunkers, hardly a "attack."
So the absense of the NX-01 from the display wall in the conferance lounge abard the Enterprise Dee mean there was no NX starship named Enterprise in that time line?
Just to chime in, and this has been said before earlier, but there really needs to be a suspension of belief & acceptance of production realities when thinking about this.
Considering we're dealing with almost 50 years of often very shaky canon, it ties up remarkably well as long as you factor in the different eras each show was made in. For me, since the TNG-era, continuity has been a consistently well managed staple of Star Trek, and ENT was very well retrofitted into that while cherry picking bits of TOS it *had* to skim over, simply because of when it was made (not to mention the realities of how the technology looked).
Not just because it's been canonically confirmed by producers (which really should be where the debate ends), but to me it's quite obvious the reboot movies are in the exact same timeline as ENT was. There are some great theories about two or three timelines branching off but it's just over thinking (and for people who don't like the reboot verse, wishful thinking), when in reality the connective tissue is perfectly clear. The timeline of ENT gives birth to Prime & reboot - to me personally, that's a fact above facts.
Considering we're dealing with almost 50 years of often very shaky canon, it ties up remarkably well as long as you factor in the different eras each show was made in. For me, since the TNG-era, continuity has been a consistently well managed staple of Star Trek, and ENT was very well retrofitted into that while cherry picking bits of TOS it *had* to skim over, simply because of when it was made (not to mention the realities of how the technology looked).
Not just because it's been canonically confirmed by producers (which really should be where the debate ends), but to me it's quite obvious the reboot movies are in the exact same timeline as ENT was. There are some great theories about two or three timelines branching off but it's just over thinking (and for people who don't like the reboot verse, wishful thinking), when in reality the connective tissue is perfectly clear. The timeline of ENT gives birth to Prime & reboot - to me personally, that's a fact above facts.
I just assume it was left off for the same reason the old-time sailing ship Enterprise, the space shuttle Enterprise, and the ring ship Enterprise were left off the Enterprise-D wall
^ Yep. Decker says (in TMP), "All those vessels were called Enterprise." He does NOT say "Those were all the vessels called Enterprise."
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