Enterprise as a prequel to the reboot movies?

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by borgboy, Jul 20, 2014.

  1. borgboy

    borgboy Commodore Commodore

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    I often have heard ENT referred to as a prequel to the reboot movies. Now, obviously there's the Archer references, which I loved, but I'd think the ENT of the reboot universe wouldn't technically be exactly the same as the ENT tv series, if for no other reason than the Borg episode being a prequel/sequel to Next Contact. Or would the same events have unfolded in the reboot universe too? I do think at the very least, the characters and events of ENT would be very similar in both universes, but are they exactly the same?

    Is there any other evidence for or against ENT being a true prequel to the reboot movies?
     
  2. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    No one in ST09 or STID seems to be aware that the Xindi almost destroyed Earth.
     
  3. Captrek

    Captrek Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Huh? Just because the events aren't referenced in the film doesn't mean they didn't happen. You could just as easily say nobody in ST09 or STID seems to be aware of World War II.
     
  4. borgboy

    borgboy Commodore Commodore

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    I don't see any reason why the Xindi would be referenced though. It's ancient history by the 23rd century, and so not a normal topic of discussion.
     
  5. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    I think the real problem I'm having is I'm still trying to make ENT somehow evolve into TOS Trek, and now we're being asked to make it fit the JJ Verse. It's a major disruption to my personal timeline.

    Not sure if the Xindi event is "ancient" history though, since it's only a hundred years earlier. It might explain Adm. Marcus' paranoia though.
     
  6. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk The Ghost of Tom Joad Premium Member

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    Enterprise is a prequel to all Treks. It takes place prior to the split in 2233 (the arrival of Nero)
     
  7. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    Perhaps the Temporal Cold War is the major branch, one universe going to Shatner Trek, the other to Pine Trek.
     
  8. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk The Ghost of Tom Joad Premium Member

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    Nope. We know when the Pine Branch sprouted. The TCW was about getting to "Shatner Trek" after Future Guy tried to get things off course.
     
  9. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    The TCW also has already started before "Broken Bow" opens, so there may be yet another version of prequel events following Vulcan first contact.
     
  10. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk The Ghost of Tom Joad Premium Member

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    Its been happening all through time before and after "Broken Bow". The version that Kirk knows is the one from "Broken Bow".
     
  11. AirCommodore

    AirCommodore Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I would like to see a temporal rift open in the mid 22nd Century, and out comes the wreckage of the Narada and the Jellyfish. A computer reconstruction of the debris shows and immense ship with Romulan markings and, the remains of it's crew (and their very Vulcan like traits) and a Vulcan ship that shows evidence of having crashed into the larger craft, and weapons damage on both.

    This could be made a departure point from the historic 22nd century and the beginning of a new future.
     
  12. Captrek

    Captrek Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I have a pet theory that in IAMD, Cochrane fires on the Vulcans because, in that timeline, Montana has previously been visited by Romulans.
     
  13. Lance

    Lance Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The oft quoted theory is that ENT doesn't exist in all universes, at least not as we saw it.

    Basically we have Trekverse 1 (TOS >> FC), where there is no NX-01 Enterprise and if Archer was in any way involved in the founding of the Federation then it was under very different circumstances. Also Cochrane made his faster-than-light flight in the warpship Pheonix on schedule without any involvement from either the 1701-E crew nor from being disrupted by the Borg. This is the version which is the original backstory of TOS, TNG etc.

    The Borg incursion seen in 'First Contact' creates an alternative Trekverse 2 (which eventually ripples into VOY, with Seven saying she recalls fragments of a Borg incursion into 21st century Earth while Harry Kim expresses surprise at this -- one might suppose perhaps that the first 3 seasons of VOY happen in Trekverse 1, while the last 4 seasons happened in Trekverse 2?). In this theory we account for why NX-01 is so advanced compared to TOS: it was a splinter universe where humanities path took a slightly different tack following a Borg incursion which never actually happened in Trekverse 1. The NX-01 was launched under the name 'Enterprise' (rather than perhaps being called something else in the other unvierse), etc. Papering over all the cracks and explaining where this previously hithero unknown Enterprise suddenly came from... ;)

    So the widely theorised idea is basically that ENT exists in Trekverse 2, but not in Trekverse 1.

    And then we get the reboot movies, which further splinter off Trekverse 2 and create a Trekverse 3. One where the events of First Contact happened, and the NX-01 existed, and Nero then changed things again. But it was effectively already a different universe to TOS to begin with, even before Nero's incursion.

    All of this is supposed to explain why Kirk/Picard/Sisko/Janeway never mentioned anything about this supposedly pioneering Warp Ship named Enterprise, but JJScotty and the Picard from NEM both mention Archer as if he's some Top Dog Five Star Admiral Kickass.

    For the purposes of TOS through First Contact, as far as this above theory goes, ENT never even happened. At least not like we saw it.

    As a theory it's a little messy on the whole but it is still pretty self-consistent for the most part. What we as viewers 'see' of the whole Star Trek tapestry is not one single, flowing timeline; but rather we see fragments of lots of different ones. :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2014
  14. Oso Blanco

    Oso Blanco Commodore Commodore

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    I also think that the Enterprise timeline (created by the events in First Contact) leads us to the AbramsVerse, and not to TOS/TNG. At least that would explain the leading zero in the Kelvin's registry number ... ;)
     
  15. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    According to the Powers That Be and the novel DTI: Watching the Clock, the timelines were one at the same until Nero appeared in 2233. TOS is "what if the Kelvin got to Earth without incident" and ST'09 is "what if a gigantic deathship appeared from the future?" stuff like the Temporal Cold War happened in both timelines, but the changes made to history are what led to the universe of TOS (and nuTrek from 2233 onwards), not away from it. Episodes like "Azati Prime" show how large the Delphic Expanse grows post-ENT (it fills the entire quadrant), and since it's never seen nor mentioned in TOS/TNG/DS9 we know the reason is because the Enterprise crew destroyed it in "Zero Hour"

    Look at Admiral Marcus' desk in the scene where Kirk and Spock are given their mission to Kronos - there are models of the Aries IV (VOY: "One Small Step"), the Phoenix (ST: FC), the Enterprise XCV-330 (ST: TMP and background art in ENT) NX-alpha (ENT: "First Flight"), the Enterprise NX-01. All direct references to prior events in the Trek 'verse.
    "In a Mirror, Darkly" directly links ENT with TOS: "The Tholian Web" and "These Are the Voyages" directly links ENT to TNG: "The Pegasus". I think those are pretty irrefutable evidence that ENT is the same history as TOS, TNG, DS9 and Voyager. Don't get me wrong, there are continuity errors but no more so than between the other series' (biggest IMO being how the TOS/movie Enterprise effortlessly zipped around the galaxy when for Voyager crossing it was a lifelong journey)

    The reboot movies have gone to great lengths to explain how events stem from Nero's arrival - be it Khan being found and woken early after Vulcan was destroyed, Section 31 building a massive facility beneath the USS Kelvin Memorial Archive, or even why Kirk didn't join Starfleet until his 20's.

    As for ENT-new movie links, I love how the "Borderland"/"Cold Station 12"/"The Augments" Augment trilogy works just as well as a prequel to Star Trek Into Darkness as it does for "Space Seed"/Wrath of Khan. The effortless Klingon-whupping and Soong's comment about how easily Henry Archer's illness could have been cured (much like the little girl is) work as excellent foreshadowings to events in Into Darkness.
     
  16. Oso Blanco

    Oso Blanco Commodore Commodore

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    I don't think that's a good example. Apart from Troi's completely different hairstyle, the TNG parts of TATV don't fit into The Pegasus at all. If anything, that's even more proof that Enterprise did NOT evolve into TOS/TNG!
     
  17. Khan 2.0

    Khan 2.0 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    earth...but when?...spock?
    Yes I also noticed this
    http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?p=8687203#post8687203
     
  18. Shazam!

    Shazam! Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    LOL
     
  19. Melakon

    Melakon Admiral Admiral

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    If this is referring to the comic book series, I wouldn't credit the films to going to great lengths at all.
     
  20. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    Hey, poorly conceived and badly executed canon is still canon!
    Nope, it's 100% from the movie itself. I haven't read the comics.

    Also, the "Mudd Incident" ship has the same silhouette as Harry Mudd's ship from "Mudd's Woman" - is it the same ship, but with it's shields down? I like to think so.
    [​IMG]
    (the ID ship is upside-down in this shot)

    They even filmed a scene where Carol explains why she has a British accent (it was part of Kirk and Carol's walk to the shuttlebay) but it was cut.