Whilst I agree with the rest of your post, it's clear from the DVD commentary that Moore and Braga were very keen to get rid of the D, not liking various design elements, the families and claiming it was hard to film to look good IRRC other people involved in the show have made similar claims over the year, it's worth remembering that by the time you get to the films very few of the people involved in the D's design are still involved with Trek, so it's perhaps unsurprising that a lot of the thinking behind various parts of it had gotten a bit lost
Ent-D in the Next Gen movies - shoulda kept it?
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Whilst I agree with the rest of your post, it's clear from the DVD commentary that Moore and Braga were very keen to get rid of the D, not liking various design elements, the families and claiming it was hard to film to look good IRRC other people involved in the show have made similar claims over the year, it's worth remembering that by the time you get to the films very few of the people involved in the D's design are still involved with Trek, so it's perhaps unsurprising that a lot of the thinking behind various parts of it had gotten a bit lost
The Enterprise-E has only a few good angles on it...fewer than the D. It has a completely uninteresting profile silhouette. The D does have some awkward angles, but they're fewer than the E has. As to detail, the 6' D model is relatively smooth, but it's nearly the same size as the TMP refit and no one claims that has too little detail because the paintjob supplies it.
I had always read that it wasn't the exterior or model of the D that was the problem. It was the sets. They were all built (or rebuilt from old movie sets) for a smaller screen with lower resolution. In addition, they were built to be photographed in an almost square format. They were difficult to light for the film and, in fact, part of the darkened lighting effect was to hide set flaws. Mr. Probert's bridge did, however, look better than ever.
Still, don't see why they couldn't just rebuild the sets for film.
Still, don't see why they couldn't just rebuild the sets for film.
I think the destruction of the D was fitting. Don't get me wrong, I love the D with all my heart. That said, the destruction of the D kind of symbolized the end of the TV series. With the E, the movies moved toward more action oriented plots, which work better for Trek movies (at least as far as ticket sales are concerned) and for which the E was better suited.
antiquityscion
Commander
While I liked the Enterprise D, and was pretty ticked they blew it up when I saw Generations in '94, I really was pleased with the debut of E-E in FC. To me, it had a more classic, constitution-class like silhouette to it, while still keeping the basic shape of the E-D's saucer section (it is the same shape, just rotated 90 degrees). Also, in the context of the debut of Voyager, it seems a logical progression in starship design.
Probably the only thing I had a problem with about the E-E was that it had the Captain's Yacht gimmick. Also, it would have been nice if they had some throw away lines mentioning some pieces from Enterprise D having been salvaged from the wrecked saucer section, and were now on the E-Ehere and there (IE Picard's fish and desk from the E-D ready room, the 10 forward doors on the new 10 forward, The painting of the Enterprise D from the ready room in Picard's quarters, etc).
Probably the only thing I had a problem with about the E-E was that it had the Captain's Yacht gimmick. Also, it would have been nice if they had some throw away lines mentioning some pieces from Enterprise D having been salvaged from the wrecked saucer section, and were now on the E-Ehere and there (IE Picard's fish and desk from the E-D ready room, the 10 forward doors on the new 10 forward, The painting of the Enterprise D from the ready room in Picard's quarters, etc).
I agree that the sets were probably the main problem (aside from some of the TMP sets like the corridors). I do think that they could have kept the ship and trashed the sets, rebuilding the bridge and engineering along with designing new sets to make the ship come off as more of a warship (to suit the time period).
I would have liked for the Enterprise D's saucer section to have been salvaged but be heavily modified to Enterprise E.
Like the Enterprise A, it would retain the soul of the old ship but still look new.
They could have made a joke that what is now a storage area on Ent-D was once Commander Riker's quarters.
OR
Salvage the saucer section. Join it with a whole new lower half, since the lower half was destroyed.
Like the Enterprise A, it would retain the soul of the old ship but still look new.
They could have made a joke that what is now a storage area on Ent-D was once Commander Riker's quarters.
OR
Salvage the saucer section. Join it with a whole new lower half, since the lower half was destroyed.
antiquityscion
Commander
Not sure how they would have done that. The E-D saucer was probably destroyed via self destruct on the surface of the planet. Plus, the E-E saucer is a bit smaller.
BTW, the Enterprise and Enterprise-A were two separate ship.s
I always thought it would be to have the Enterprise survive Generations and then Picard would be forced to destroy the ship in 2063 to destroy the Borg aboard (especially if they hadn't introduced the concept of the Borg Queen (take her out, take them all out). Albeit, you'd need to come up with some way to get the crew back to the 24th century sans ship.
I feel the opposite. The Enterprise D looked great from certain angles, but I was instantly taken aback by how ugly and stumpy it could look from other angles that weren't shown often in the show. It does not look good at all from above with that wide saucer and tiny angled nacelles.
And as for the Enterprise E, I can't think of any bad angles. I'm not crazy about the secondary hull from behind (a bit too curvy and organic for my liking), but it doesn't have any ugly angles to me.
Mind you, I don't dislike either of them. I can definitely see the argument for keeping the D, especially with the focus on the ship in First Contact.
Definitely should've kept the Ent-D, though I would have felt a little uncomfortable with civilians and kids being caught up in the Borg events of FC.
To use a phrase you Americans are so fond of, the Ent-D "went out like a punk", and was really done a disservice during "Generations". It had gone through so much more than that and survived!
When the original Enterprise was destroyed in Star Trek III - it was an amazing moment. Kirk's broken "What have I done?"; McCoy's consolation; the shot of the ship going down in flames.... it was epic and dramatic, and I had no problem with it. The Ent-D crashlanding on some fake tree models just looks tacky in comparison.
To use a phrase you Americans are so fond of, the Ent-D "went out like a punk", and was really done a disservice during "Generations". It had gone through so much more than that and survived!
When the original Enterprise was destroyed in Star Trek III - it was an amazing moment. Kirk's broken "What have I done?"; McCoy's consolation; the shot of the ship going down in flames.... it was epic and dramatic, and I had no problem with it. The Ent-D crashlanding on some fake tree models just looks tacky in comparison.
Yeah, although my real issue isn't really their absence (which also kind of sucked) but the reason given by the producers: People would have freaked out over/gotten completely confused by the sight of one or even several Sovereign class starships on the small screen and in a DS9 context.
The D was smooth, curvy and massive, but more impressive in the six-foot model than in the four-foot one. The latter seemed to add more awkward angles and made the D look like a blotted chicken, which is where the stumpiness comes from.
But the six-foot model was gorgeous and looked good on the big screen whereas the E never really made an impression on the big screen. I felt it was more TV than the D was.
I think it would have been better to have a more epic battle in Generations where the Ent-D goes against a superior ship like a Negh'Var or upgraded Vor'Cha and have the Ent be severely damaged but not destroyed but enough so a lot of work is needed to fix the ship. This gives them a chance to rework the interior and exteriors of the ship like with the original Enterprise allowing them to keep the Ent-D and have a new ship of sorts at the same time and have Probert with help from Sternbach do the redesign (Eaves can stay far away from this one).
The Enterprise-E was designed for a widescreen presentation, while the Enterprise-D was designed with a full screen, television presentation in mind. I have no problem that the producers made the change.
It was a little illogical, however, that we never saw a Sovereign class during the entire Dominon War.
It was a little illogical, however, that we never saw a Sovereign class during the entire Dominon War.
He would be the expert, obviously, so I stand corrected.
I'm not sure where I first heard this bit of information, actually. A quick internet search has found nothing. Perhaps I was remembering that the Enterprise-E was designed with widescreen in mind, and simply assumed that the Enterprise-D was also designed with a specific aspect ration in mind.
I still find the Enterprise-D much better suited to the 1.33:1 frame than any widescreen ratio, although this may simply due to familiarity with the ship from seven years of the television show.
I'm not sure where I first heard this bit of information, actually. A quick internet search has found nothing. Perhaps I was remembering that the Enterprise-E was designed with widescreen in mind, and simply assumed that the Enterprise-D was also designed with a specific aspect ration in mind.
I still find the Enterprise-D much better suited to the 1.33:1 frame than any widescreen ratio, although this may simply due to familiarity with the ship from seven years of the television show.
You could just blow up the engineering hull and bring the saucer back to the future.
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