Dukat character - writer's mess?!

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Deep Space Nine' started by Dal Rassak, Feb 4, 2013.

  1. kkt

    kkt Captain Captain

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    It's possible to be unhappy with some aspects of the character but still pleased with it overall. How many people who have worked at the same job for seven years are happy about every single thing about the job? Or who have been married have been delighted with every single thing about their spouse and the marriage?
     
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  2. Six of Twelve

    Six of Twelve Captain Captain

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    Oh, yes, he's very much like Trump and that has caused me to back off sharply from my fascination with him, which was more of a fascination with the actor, rather than the character, per se. But, the really bad stuff he did, didn't really come to light until the later seasons, and if it hadn't been written in, he could have been redeemable.
     
  3. Armus

    Armus Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I always thought having Dukat side with The Dominion in Season 5 destroyed the credibility of his character. Didn't he know Starfleet always wins?
     
  4. Six of Twelve

    Six of Twelve Captain Captain

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    Not so much that Starfleet "always" wins, but, rather that aligning with the Dominion was a totally naive move if he thought they'd treat the Cardassians like equal partners, rather than subjugating them, like every other race they dealt with. Dukat was a lot of things, but I never took him to be naive.
     
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  5. kkt

    kkt Captain Captain

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    Working for the Dominion made sense, if he'd rather be the head of the puppet state instead of just another Gul of an independent Cardassia.
     
  6. Voth commando1

    Voth commando1 Commodore Fleet Captain

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    Yeah Dukat is supposed to be an intelligent savvy guy yet somehow he thinks the dominion would treat the Cardassians as equals when their basically depending on the dominion for: survival(food supplies), winning its wars(Klingons and Maquis), and what not else.

    Heck Sisko says as much in "Ties of Blood and Water" and Dukat says something to the effect of "it's so much more complex than that rube!" Which I couldn't help but laugh I was like that's so stupid.
     
  7. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Commodore Commodore

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    Dukat's brief redemption was likely only a consequence of the emphasis on the Klingons as a threat in season 4. Absent that, he was a complete dick.

    You are making mountains over mole hills.
     
  8. Voth commando1

    Voth commando1 Commodore Fleet Captain

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    I just think it's curious allegedly most every DS9 actor/actress was mad/upset/dissatisfied with something or another at the end of the show.
     
  9. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Curious in what way? I'd be amazed if any Trek regular said that they agreed with and loved every beat of their series from go to woah.
     
  10. Voth commando1

    Voth commando1 Commodore Fleet Captain

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    I'm not saying the actors would naturally love every twist and turn but for most of the cast to have a complaint or another is truly striking.
     
  11. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Having a difference of opinion is not the same thing. And as far as I know, Avery objected to one aspect of the finale, which they altered to accommodate his concerns...which is hardly unique.

    Also, Rene and Nana, whilst not initially wanting the relationship to go in that direction, don't seem too bent out of shape about it...

    Rene:
    Nana:
     
  12. Bad Thoughts

    Bad Thoughts Commodore Commodore

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    Mad how? Alaimo wanted the character to go one direction, but it didn't. He was never mad.

    Brooks wanted a slightly different spin on the explanation of his character's disappearance. It was changed. He was not mad.

    Visitor did not want her character to fall in love with the co-worker with whom she had the greatest mutual respect.However, she was elated to have more scenes with Auberjonois. You can see their professional admiration for one another in their numerous joint convention appearances. Neither was mad.

    Siddig hated being turned into another Data. Through various acts of resistance he got his message across to the writers. He was ultimately satisfied with the direction his character took. He was not mad.
     
  13. Spot261

    Spot261 Commodore Commodore

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    I wonder how much of the dissatisfaction with the character's developments could be down to the format. Previous trek shows didn't really DO character development, you could almost literally lift any TNG character from season 3 and out them into a season 7 episode and no one would really notice the difference. Yes, even Data, although Wesley is an obvious exception.

    When people signed on for DS9 did they do so on the tacit understanding that this would be the case here? That they would be portraying a largely static character throughout on an episodic basis, rather than a more fluid one throughout a story arc?

    I hope not given some of the talent on display, Alaimo being a prime example, but it's an interesting thought.
     
  14. Prax

    Prax Commodore Fleet Captain

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    TNG had a great deal of character development, just not a lot of character growth. There was more growth given the characters in the later shows. Quark, Sisko, Bashir(kind of), Odo, Paris, B'elanna, EMH, Seven, Trip, Archer, and T'Pol all had a lot of growth. They changed throughout the show. We get to learn more and more about Picard, Riker, Data, etc. They gain more depth, but remain more or less the same people.
     
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  15. Navaros

    Navaros Commodore Commodore

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    Dukat did not have "progression." He had the polar opposite of progression. They degraded him from a complex, three-dimensional, largely good but sometimes bad, incredibly deep character, into a one-dimensional cartoon caricature.

    Of course Alaimo was dissatisfied with the writers ruining his character for no good reason, just like many DS9 fans were/are too. The fubaring of Dukat is one of the worst & most bone-headed storytelling decisions of all-time.

    That would have been much better than what they actually put in the series, but...

    Alternatively, the series would have been better still if they didn't ruin Dukat's character starting with when they had him stay on the station to be captured as if he were an idiot. That was totally OOC for Dukat and the first of many fubars. Dukat never should have been on that planet with Sisko because he never should have been a Federation prisoner in the first place.

    I'm sure Dukat didn't think that. Dukat was man enough to hold his own vs. Weyoun. It didn't matter to Dukat if the Dominion couldn't be trusted, because Dukat knew he was smart enough and strong enough to deal with complications that may come up later.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2017
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  16. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    [​IMG]
     
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