DS9 = WORST Star Trek Series EVER

[MacLeod]

To be fair to DSN's it's first two season where better overall than the first two of TNG.

 

[Paradon]

It explore the characters in depth more than any other series IMO.... i think that's what makes it unique and special, but obviously some people find it boring. I love it, though...especially when it's about alien cultures.

 

[Deckerd]

To me, the more removed we are from when all of the shows were made (later TNG excepted) the less relevant they become. However it's strange to see someone who's never seen them before making a spot decision. I think you should persevere because it does definitely get more entertaining, although the depth everyone is talking about is largely illusory. It was first and foremost entertainment and you should view it as such.

 

[Ln X]

A lot of DS9's first season bordered on average to mediocre, the show tried to find direction but the writers hadn't figured out the story arcs, so they had to write on the spot TNG-like episodes. Season 2 was a bit more focused, and a bit better than season 1, but again it suffered from a lack of general direction.

You're right Tidus79001 when you say VOY is better than TNG, VOY is a refined TNG, however both VOY and TNG are more or less in the same calibre of format and style. DS9 though sucks you in, in a different way. The characters are a bit less important than the general story and the worlds and races that DS9 explored. Whereas in TNG it was the other way around, and there were way to many Picard-centric episodes.

Whereas no character in DS9 really stood out, like Sisko was sort of complimented by Kira as kind of leader/command figures, Bashir and O'Brien were friends with one exceptional the other your 'average' jo bloggs, Odo and Kira, Jadzia and Quark, Odo and Quark. All these characters complimented each other, and I personally like that.

Whereas TNG was all Picard, Data and Worf. Plus Picard went through so much shit (let's recall now: assimulated by the Borg, tortured by Cardassians, resurrected by Q, trapped on a dying world for over 30 years, turning into a child again, losing all his family, hypnotized by Damon Bok and Beverly Crusher) and he acted virtually just the same as from season 1 to season 7, I just didn't buy it.

In fact the only two characters who seemed to really change were Data and Worf (yeah Worf was the most DS9-like character on TNG). Data emulated humans better, and Worf restored honour to his family's name and learnt how to deal with Alexander. Worf did go through a journey in TNG, whereas nearly every other TNG character did not.

At least with the DS9 characters they went from point A to point B, and changed, they all did. That gives me a nice sense of completion and that is the lure and appeal of DS9. Stick with it Tidus79001, and when you reach season 3 you may actually like it.

 

[Photon]

It is the only Star Trek series that I turned off during the pilot episode because it was so awful. I never watched the series after that. I have only seen a handful of DS9 episodes. I saw the finale when it aired & it was insultingly dumb, and it wasn't just me who had that exact same sentiment. Every time I watch DS9 it makes me cringe & not want to see more of it.

They had no ship, and just sat on a space station. Sitting of the Station week after week was big turn off. That worked out so well for the series that by season 3 they added the Defiant to help out the serious flagging DS9 series. DS9 was so awful it was the first & only Star Trek series that hired an actor from a previous series (Michael Dorn) to reprise their character role (Worf) as permanent cast member addition. I was shocked that the writers felt that a Star Trek show didn’t need a real ship for exploration & wasn’t surprised that by season 3 they introduced the Defiant as a ship permanently assigned to Deep Space Nine (the runabout idea was a really seemed like someone’s idea of a bad joke since it really wasn’t designed for long range deep space exploration nor was it capable of real defense of the space station).
Now that DS9 is on Netflix I have tried to watch it again. I have gotten 12 episodes in & they are just awful. Even mediocre would be a huge improvement for DS9.
I will give Deep Space Nine credit that once the Defiant was introduced they did encounter more new alien races & explore more that The Next Generation.

Wow that's what I felt about the first 3 seasons of TNG

 

[USS Intrepid]

I always found DS9's pilot to be the strongest and most engaging of all the series. The criticisms the OP lists seem to have more to do with personal taste than any quantifiable quality.

 

[Angel4576]

DS9 bad, VOY good?

Nope - not worth my effort.......

 

[Finn]

Tidus, you are taking this too seriously. Like someone said upthread, it is meant to be a form of entrainment. Who cares if DSN did something none of the other Trek shows did.

 

[Amaris]

It is the only Star Trek series that I turned off during the pilot episode because it was so awful. I never watched the series after that. I have only seen a handful of DS9 episodes. I saw the finale when it aired & it was insultingly dumb, and it wasn't just me who had that exact same sentiment. Every time I watch DS9 it makes me cringe & not want to see more of it.

They had no ship, and just sat on a space station. Sitting of the Station week after week was big turn off. That worked out so well for the series that by season 3 they added the Defiant to help out the serious flagging DS9 series. DS9 was so awful it was the first & only Star Trek series that hired an actor from a previous series (Michael Dorn) to reprise their character role (Worf) as permanent cast member addition. I was shocked that the writers felt that a Star Trek show didn’t need a real ship for exploration & wasn’t surprised that by season 3 they introduced the Defiant as a ship permanently assigned to Deep Space Nine (the runabout idea was a really seemed like someone’s idea of a bad joke since it really wasn’t designed for long range deep space exploration nor was it capable of real defense of the space station).
Now that DS9 is on Netflix I have tried to watch it again. I have gotten 12 episodes in & they are just awful. Even mediocre would be a huge improvement for DS9.
I will give Deep Space Nine credit that once the Defiant was introduced they did encounter more new alien races & explore more that The Next Generation.

Hey, I know how you feel, except instead of DS9, for me it's Voyager. A month or so ago, I started watching VOY via Netflix, and it has been a long, arduous slog up to Season 4, which is where I am now. I had watched ENT all the way through for the first time before that, and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I figured I was completely wrong about my first impressions of VOY, and so dove right in. Oh my, what a mistake. I was completely unready for the massive amounts of empty dialogue, aimless direction, and poor characterization.

I mean, there are some really decent characters in VOY, but are written so inconsistently (especially Janeway), that it takes away from the overall quality of the show. The aliens are your standard "forehead of the week" fare, the stories are often padded with unnecessary technobabble, the goal of the show, to get the Voyager home, meanders from week to week, and then there's the reset button, which drives me up the wall.

The show is milquetoast in every respect, and mediocrity seems to be the show's hallmark. What good episodes there are, are few and far between, and I feel more like I'm just wasting time than I am enjoying a Star Trek series. This show is the only one that produces that feeling. I enjoy TOS, TAS, TNG, DS9 and ENT, but I'm not finding VOY to be anywhere near as appealing as the other series'.

That said, to each their own.

 

[Tora Ziyal]

Continuing to watch and post about a show one hates seems to me an odd use of one's time.

Doesn't it!

I watched three or four episodes of Voyager back in the day and found them boring, so I stopped watching. I can think of a lot better ways to use my free time than to force myself to watch a boring show. Or to complain about said boring show online.

(Note to self: Don't expect everyone else to behave the same way I do. )

 

[Cyke101]

Considering that the finale was supposed to wrap up a 2 season arc and tie up as many plot threads from the past 7 seasons, I find it kind of odd to judge the finale in any way while watching only a few episodes.

 

[Tidus79001]

It is the only Star Trek series that I turned off during the pilot episode because it was so awful. I never watched the series after that. I have only seen a handful of DS9 episodes. I saw the finale when it aired & it was insultingly dumb, and it wasn't just me who had that exact same sentiment. Every time I watch DS9 it makes me cringe & not want to see more of it.

They had no ship, and just sat on a space station. Sitting of the Station week after week was big turn off. That worked out so well for the series that by season 3 they added the Defiant to help out the serious flagging DS9 series. DS9 was so awful it was the first & only Star Trek series that hired an actor from a previous series (Michael Dorn) to reprise their character role (Worf) as permanent cast member addition. I was shocked that the writers felt that a Star Trek show didn’t need a real ship for exploration & wasn’t surprised that by season 3 they introduced the Defiant as a ship permanently assigned to Deep Space Nine (the runabout idea was a really seemed like someone’s idea of a bad joke since it really wasn’t designed for long range deep space exploration nor was it capable of real defense of the space station).
Now that DS9 is on Netflix I have tried to watch it again. I have gotten 12 episodes in & they are just awful. Even mediocre would be a huge improvement for DS9.
I will give Deep Space Nine credit that once the Defiant was introduced they did encounter more new alien races & explore more that The Next Generation.

Wow that's what I felt about the first 3 seasons of TNG

I agree with you are TNG or should I say Star Trek: TNG TOS-lite.

My brother & me used to say the mission statement was "to boldly bore you like now one has ever done before" as opposed to "to boldly bore you like no one has ever done before". DS9 was just too painful to watch & Star Trek in name only. Voyager was the first series since the Original Series to really recap the Star Trek them of exploration of the unknown, and true sense of adventure (I was hooked before the series premiere episode "Caretaker" had finished airing).

 

[Tidus79001]

It is the only Star Trek series that I turned off during the pilot episode because it was so awful. I never watched the series after that. I have only seen a handful of DS9 episodes. I saw the finale when it aired & it was insultingly dumb, and it wasn't just me who had that exact same sentiment. Every time I watch DS9 it makes me cringe & not want to see more of it.

They had no ship, and just sat on a space station. Sitting of the Station week after week was big turn off. That worked out so well for the series that by season 3 they added the Defiant to help out the serious flagging DS9 series. DS9 was so awful it was the first & only Star Trek series that hired an actor from a previous series (Michael Dorn) to reprise their character role (Worf) as permanent cast member addition. I was shocked that the writers felt that a Star Trek show didn’t need a real ship for exploration & wasn’t surprised that by season 3 they introduced the Defiant as a ship permanently assigned to Deep Space Nine (the runabout idea was a really seemed like someone’s idea of a bad joke since it really wasn’t designed for long range deep space exploration nor was it capable of real defense of the space station).
Now that DS9 is on Netflix I have tried to watch it again. I have gotten 12 episodes in & they are just awful. Even mediocre would be a huge improvement for DS9.
I will give Deep Space Nine credit that once the Defiant was introduced they did encounter more new alien races & explore more that The Next Generation.

Hey, I know how you feel, except instead of DS9, for me it's Voyager.

That said, to each their own.

Agreed to each their own. You like DS9, and I respect that.

 

[TheGodBen]

Firstly, I just want to make it clear that I'm not here to insult you or criticise you or tell you that your opinion is wrong, you're fully entitled to express your dislike of DS9 as a Star Trek fan and not be attacked for it. However, I do take exception to this:

Worst is such a relative term. TNG was boring and the cast for the crew was bland. DS9 on the other had was just painful to watch (it was Star Trek in name only), and the crew was just plain annoying & unlikeable. I would rather be subjected to 7 seasons of TNG as opposed to watching even half a season of DS9.

I've been a Star Trek fan for as far back as my memory allows. Many others on this site have been fans of the franchise longer than I, some going all the way back to when the original series aired in the 60s. We are, the vast majority of us, Star Trek fans. You are not the sole arbiter of what is and what is not "true" Star Trek.

For whatever reason, on this site of Star Trek fans, DS9 is a very popular show and it typically wins out in the favourite series polls that pop up every few months. Now, this is only one site, and DS9 is certainly not the most popular Star Trek series amongst the general population, but on this site of Trek nerds DS9 is not only considered a "true" Star Trek series, it is considered a rather fine example of one.

Why is this? The consensus among Niners seems to be that we like the fact that DS9 developed established races rather than creating paper-thin new races all the time. I care about the Klingons, I care about the Cardassians, I care about the Dominion and all the other major races, I don't care about the Quelquags of Quelquag IV. In fact, I care so little about the alien-of-the-week races that I didn't even bother to remember a real one, I just made up a funny name instead.

Anyway, if you want to debate why you think that the alien-of-the-week style is superior then feel free to make a rebuttal. But please, cut out the crap about DS9 not being a true Star Trek show.

When major changes are made to revamp a series such as adding a new ship, or hiring a actor from a previous series (Michael Dorn) to reprise their character role (Worf) as permanent cast member addition that is a sign the a show is flagging.

You're absolutely right, bringing in Worf was a ratings stunt that attempted to shore up DS9's flagging ratings, there's no point in denying that which is true. However, the introduction of Seven of Nine was the exact same thing, a ratings stunt designed to shore up Voyager's flagging ratings. Both stunts were ultimately a failure as the ratings for both shows continued to slide, but I believe that both stunts were dramatically successful.

But it is interesting how you choose to criticise DS9 for its ratings stunt while commending Voyager even though it did the same thing.

 

[Tidus79001]

You're absolutely right, bringing in Worf was a ratings stunt that attempted to shore up DS9's flagging ratings, there's no point in denying that which is true.

Finally some intellectual honesty

However, the introduction of Seven of Nine was the exact same thing, a ratings stunt designed to shore up Voyager's flagging ratings. Both stunts were ultimately a failure as the ratings for both shows continued to slide, but I believe that both stunts were dramatically successful.

But it is interesting how you choose to criticise DS9 for its ratings stunt while commending Voyager for doing the same thing.

You are comparing apples to oranges. Like I start previously

DS9 was so awful it was the first & only Star Trek series that hired a actor from a previous series (Michael Dorn) to reprise their character role (Worf) as permanent cast member addition.

Adding, or replacing a cast member with one from a previous series is & remains a DS9 exclusive.

Nuff said!

 

[RoJoHen]

But why is that a bad thing? The Enterprise had just blown up, and Worf needed a new job. Given the events of "The Way of the Warrior," his introduction to the series made perfect sense.

 

[Tidus79001]

The writers are right you don't need a fancy ship to explore...

Everyone seems to be says skip to the 2nd season, or even 4th. Those are after the introduction of the Defiant. The Defiant was necessary for the serious flagging DS9 series.

The Defiant was introduced for plot related reasons - they'd introduced a threat capable of taking out a Galaxy class starship, which at the time was considered the best ship Starfleet had to offer, and all DS9 the station had as a defense were three dinky little runabouts. It was give them something with some teeth or completely defang their new villain before they'd managed to do anything with them by letting them be defeated essentially by fleas in comparison.

Plot reasons being reshaping the show from sitting on a space station that was totally boring. They revamped the show by adding the Defiant so that there could be adventures off the space station. You can only go so far with episode that are on the space station each week.

Skip ahead to "The Way of the Warrior" and watch from there.

Skip forward past seasons 1, 2, and 3 all the way to season 4 episode 1.

The first two seasons or so are perhaps less than riveting, but I think that they figure the show out sometime in season three. You learn what to look out for, I guess. Any episode that gives decent screen time to Quark, Garak or Dukat tends to be well worth the watch. Also, bear in mind that this was basically disposable TV. With 26 episodes a year, a certain amount of padding and the odd misfire are to be expected. In my experience, DS9 aficionados are quite happy to acknowledge the show's shortcomings.

Skip seasons 1 & 2.

Indeed season 1 and Season 2 were not that good

Still I have watched I think every episode of all Star Treks except the TOS far too young for that so I only got odd reruns but TNG, DS9, Voyager, even Enterprise have seen them all. And I must say I find it hard to rate shows with so many episodes but Enterprise was definitely the worst.

I rest my case.

 

[Tidus79001]

But why is that a bad thing? The Enterprise had just blown up, and Worf needed a new job. Given the events of "The Way of the Warrior," his introduction to the series made perfect sense.

Worf wasn't added because of those events. Those events were intentionally written as a excuse to bring Worf onto DS9.

 

[nightwind1]

Maybe Voyager is more your speed, then...

Yep you got it right. Voyager is among some of the best Star Trek ever produced. Right up the with the likes of the Star Trek: The Original Series.

Oh, wait, you were trying to be serious...

 

[Satyrquaze]

It sends a mixed message to be sure. You title this thread "DS9 = WORST Star Trek Series EVER" Yet, in the thread you admit having never given DS9 a real chance. Oh, sorry, the three random episodes that you almost sat through didn't turn you on. But, you say you will watch DS9 from start to finish.

Does that mean if you actually begin to enjoy DS9 you'll request that the thread title be changed?

Some points you raise trouble me (and others it seems). You point out that DS9 finally added a starship in the third season due to 'flagging ratings'. I do have to point out that at the start of the third season, the ratings were higher on DS9 than they would be throughout all 7 seasons of Voyager.

I, personally cannot tolerate Star Trek: Voyager. I've watched the vast majority of the episodes, but for me it is the reason Star Trek died. Sure, Enterprise ran afterward, but damage was done. The cancer had spread too far by the time Enterprise first aired.

It did have it's good points: I enjoy the characters of Kes, The Doctor, and Tuvok. Janeway was a worthy foil for Q. But, it's also the series that has the most continuity errors, plot holes, and erratic character depictions. Seriously, you didn't know which personality of Janeway would be getting this episode or the next. One episode she'd treat the Prime Directive as her most holy scripture, and the next she's discard it at the first oppourtunity without explanation. In related news: Robert Beltran hated his job, and it showed.

Voyager lost more shuttles than it could possibly hold without explanation. They built the Delta Flyer from scratch (twice) when a) matter replication was at such a premium that only replicated food in very limited amounts. b) apparently had the Aeroshuttle docked on the underside of the primary hull the entire time. Couldn't modify a pre-existing shuttle? Weird, since Voyager seems to have dozens to spare.

Yes, all Star Trek series have their faults, but for my money Voyager's faults outnumber the things good about the series. I feel strongly about this, and yet I've managed to not log into the Voyager forum thread and post a thread titled: "Voyager = WORST Star Trek Series EVER". And I say that having given Voyager more of a chance than you've ever given DS9.