Donny's Refit Enterprise Interiors (Version 2.0)

[Workbee]

Well. Here's the next wrench to be thrown in the machine. The interior set is far shorter than the exterior model, matching everything up with the docking ring. I was hoping I wouldn't have to fudge things this time around (like my TOS shuttle required). Hmm....

Does this need to be a problem? Seems like there are often times that the physical dimensions of a set or structure differ from the “in universe” size of the object it’s depicting. Often for example an exterior will be built at 3/4 scale to allow for more dynamic camera angles and cost saving (e.g. Rohan from LOTR) Different lenses and camera angles help complete the intended scale effect. We pretty much see this interior from a head on front shot which makes it hard to see the depth. I don’t know if this was the reason, but they would have needed the interior to “read” as “short and cramped” instead of “longer and cavernous”. I think the limited exposure of the set gives you wiggle room to stretch the interior out to better fit the dimensions. In other words - the set is not the travel pod interior, it is just one of the many artificially produced elements that work in concert together to present the illusion of the “travel pod interior”, Which of course is nothing you don’t already know.

 

[Donny]

Hmm I wonder if you have that right. Screenshots show that the top of the door is the same height as the top of the long panel with the "finish as dir..." label in it. And the lights are above the door.
http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=578&pid=63326#top_display_media

Hmm. I’ll have to do a more detailed study tonight. I admit I threw together that comparison image pretty quickly. Even still it’s going to take some fudging to get things all lined up properly. The extent of which I’ll have to determine.

 

[BK613]

Hmm. I’ll have to do a more detailed study tonight. I admit I threw together that comparison image pretty quickly. Even still it’s going to take some fudging to get things all lined up properly. The extent of which I’ll have to determine.

No criticism intended. You did an amazing job on the pod.

Just being an extra set of eyes.

 

[Christopher]

Maybe you've already seen this, Donny, but I came across this interior shot of the travel pod on Doug Drexler's Facebook feed:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151714602346104&set=a.10151714601931104&type=3&theater

 

[Donny]

No criticism intended. You did an amazing job on the pod.

Just being an extra set of eyes.

Oh no I really appreciate it!

Maybe you've already seen this, Donny, but I came across this interior shot of the travel pod on Doug Drexler's Facebook feed:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151714602346104&set=a.10151714601931104&type=3&theater

Yeah! As far as I know, this is the only shot we see from this pov.

 

[Lt. Washburn]

If you stretch the set proportionally, would it be that noticeable, especially from the angles you see it from in the movies?

 

[Noname Given]

First they build a shuttlecraft you can't fit the interior in, now a travel pod that's smaller on the inside.

Well, at least you've got room for a transporter pad in the extended TVH version of it now...

Hey the start of Starfleet TARDIS tech.

 

[Norsehound]

Might this be what you're referring to?

That's them! I like the angular look a lot more than the red and ringships they had going on since, erm... First contact started the trend and Enterprise ran with it. Fans get butthurt about Discovery not being consistent with TNG, but also don't get outraged that things like this are passed up for the red ringships?

 

[Christopher]

That's them! I like the angular look a lot more than the red and ringships they had going on since, erm... First contact started the trend and Enterprise ran with it. Fans get butthurt about Discovery not being consistent with TNG, but also don't get outraged that things like this are passed up for the red ringships?

Oh, fans back then got exactly as upset about ENT's perceived inconsistencies as they do today about Discovery. And before that they got upset about TNG's inconsistencies, and before that about TMP's inconsistencies. There have always been people who refused to accept a new artistic interpretation of the Trek universe, and their objections always get forgotten by the time the next new interpretation comes along and the next new crop of complainers starts up about it.

Although I don't see what's inconsistent about a civilization having more than one spacecraft design. A helicopter isn't shaped like an airliner.

 

[K1productions]

Oh, fans back then got exactly as upset about ENT's perceived inconsistencies as they do today about Discovery. And before that they got upset about TNG's inconsistencies, and before that about TMP's inconsistencies. There have always been people who refused to accept a new artistic interpretation of the Trek universe, and their objections always get forgotten by the time the next new interpretation comes along and the next new crop of complainers starts up about it.

Although I don't see what's inconsistent about a civilization having more than one spacecraft design. A helicopter isn't shaped like an airliner.

Even in the present day on our own little planet, there are numerous variants of almost every class of vessel you could name. Some clearly distinguishable from each other externally. Naturally the same would be true for an empire spaning thousands of light years, especially if you had different facilities run by different species (Andorian, Vulcan, and Tellarite for example). I have no problem at all with such variants, and acknowledge the only reason we never saw them was television production budget. That being said, we've seen numerous variants of the Miranda-class (standard Miranda like the Reliant, no rollbar like the Lantree, or added X-wing like attachments on the sides like the Saratoga) yet still called Miranda.

The problem is, when it comes to fiction, most people want some kind of familiarity to cling to. Think of it like a narrative version of the Uncanny Valley. You can either be stylized to the point of charming, or completely 100% accurate, but the second you move between the two, no matter how close to the original it looks, the differences will stand out far too much and it gets negative reaction. Some fans have a gentler curve to their valley dip than others, but I've seen some fans whining that the grated walls on the Defiant in "A Mirror Darkly" (ENT) was made of hexagons instead of circles... and that is when you go WAY too far.

 

[Christopher]

The problem is, when it comes to fiction, most people want some kind of familiarity to cling to. Think of it like a narrative version of the Uncanny Valley.

The same mentality that leads to entire alien species having the same tailor and the same haircut.

 

[K1productions]

The same mentality that leads to entire alien species having the same tailor and the same haircut.

Absolutely. There should at least be as much variation of hair styles, skin colors, facial structures, and body types of alien species as there are for Humans.

 

[Christopher]

Absolutely. There should at least be as much variation of hair styles, skin colors, facial structures, and body types of alien species as there are for Humans.

Not to mention languages, naming conventions, cultures, and religions.

 

[K1productions]

Not to mention languages, naming conventions, cultures, and religions.

Oh yes, absolutely. I was pleased to hear them mention "All three dialects" in 2009, implying multiple different forms of the Romulan language. I would imagine multiple times as many for Klingon languages, as it was a far less strict and rigid structure of uniformity within their empire. Romulans I can see enforcing more of a status quo. Vulcans too, for completely different reasons, but they would have separate dialects as more of ceremonial matters rather than different cultures. That, and Vulcans are essentially isolated to their homeworld and a few other planets for monestaries and such.

Bajor, despite having one world, would have numerous dialects across its different provences, not only harkening back to the old cast system days, but their more agricultural and spiritual focus rather than uniformity. Hell, probably the only time Bajor ever united in any way was to kick the Cardassians out. Speaking of whom, Cardassians too would have had multiple dialects until the military took over and enforced more rigid structure, so while different cultures may still exist, they are pushed to the background and thus not often seen.

I think I'll stop here, this will go head first into a novel-form of Trek discussion, which is fun to have, but not pertinent to this thread LOL

 

[Norsehound]

Oh, fans back then got exactly as upset about ENT's perceived inconsistencies as they do today about Discovery. And before that they got upset about TNG's inconsistencies, and before that about TMP's inconsistencies. There have always been people who refused to accept a new artistic interpretation of the Trek universe, and their objections always get forgotten by the time the next new interpretation comes along and the next new crop of complainers starts up about it.

Although I don't see what's inconsistent about a civilization having more than one spacecraft design. A helicopter isn't shaped like an airliner.

I had the feeling this was the case, I just can't resist letting off a little steam over a perceptively unloved and obscure part of the saga

The issue I have with this is how this suddenly new element overrides everything that came before it, going forward. So I expect in the future artists will reference FC/Enterprise and not look at the Warp sled / T'plana Hath (Apollo class?) models when defining future Vulcan ships for something like Brave New Worlds. Would be nice to see them jump between the different styles to establish them in parallel.

The same mentality that leads to entire alien species having the same tailor and the same haircut.

An element in my own headcannon... and it would be nice for official trek to recognize this... is that there are multiple species of Klingon from the same planet. The TOS, TMP, TNG, and DISC Klingons all have legitimate claim to being "real Klingons", but competition from their world sees a constant churn of leadership and infighting over what they consider racial purity. I grouse about the TNG Klingons, but honestly it's because of how overriding they are, and would rather have the others stand as equals next to them.

They did this kind of detail for the Romulans in Picard (forehead ridges vs not), and I can't tell you how grateful I was to see them handle this aspect in that fashion. Not one overriding the other or makeup changes, but that there's an in-universe hand wave that actually works to unify different eras of Trek production holistically.

 

[K1productions]

An element in my own headcannon... and it would be nice for official trek to recognize this... is that there are multiple species of Klingon from the same planet. The TOS, TMP, TNG, and DISC Klingons all have legitimate claim to being "real Klingons", but competition from their world sees a constant churn of leadership and infighting over what they consider racial purity. I grouse about the TNG Klingons, but honestly it's because of how overriding they are, and would rather have the others stand as equals next to them.

They did this kind of detail for the Romulans in Picard (forehead ridges vs not), and I can't tell you how grateful I was to see them handle this aspect in that fashion. Not one overriding the other or makeup changes, but that there's an in-universe hand wave that actually works to unify different eras of Trek production holistically.

I actually do like that idea. With the Klingon Empire, there are always power struggles between the great houses, some in vastly different areas of the Empire and with different views on what being Klingon means. So it makes sense that we would see this shift manifest physically during these struggles. There is also no indication that during TOS we were dealing with the Empire proper, or a fringe group on the territory closest to the Federation. The kind who were content to look like Humans, but were encouraged to change back with Chancellor Gorkon's reign, as I see him as someone who could foster peace between warring factions

 

[Norsehound]

In this model I believed the TNG klingons are the frat bros of the Klingon race; boisterous and consuming much energy with wasteful displays of machismo strength. The real bones of the empire were laid by the Discovery 1 Klingons' conquests before they wandered off into deep space. The TOS Klingons, the most intelligent of the three, stepped in to manage the empire into a legitimate threat to the Federation before the TNG Klingons decided to "Make Quo'nos great again". The reason they haven't prevailed over the Federation is because the TNG Klingons keep seizing power and being totally ineffectual with it. Blowing up Praxis is but one display of their inability to manage things successfully. Another is the fact that in 100 years, the only new ship design in the empire is the Vor'cha.

....anyways.... Donny, any thought to making a variant of the travel pod with the continuous latitude spotlight?

 

[DEWLine]

Digressive comment: I'm sure there are other ship designs scattered across the spaces claimed by the various Great Houses of Qo'noS. (Now, there's another subject for a two-page spread in Star Charts v.2!)

 

[K1productions]

Digressive comment: I'm sure there are other ship designs scattered across the spaces claimed by the various Great Houses of Qo'noS. (Now, there's another subject for a two-page spread in Star Charts v.2!)

Oh absolutely. I would go one step further as to claim each of the great houses with their own bases and fleet yards have their own variants of ship classes, if not some custom ship types of their own. Custom paint schemes, custom weapon layout, again difficult to do on a TV production budget of the time, but much more possible today. It might also explain the difference between the D-7 and the K'Tinga. While essentially the same hull structure, they are different enough to be called a different class, so perhaps the ruling house come TMP put K'Tinga's on the forefront over the D-7 of the previous Chancellorship.

 

[Donny]

Spent the evening getting the pod into Unreal (the renders yesterday were from a renderer called Marmoset), properly rigging the lights and created a script which blinks the running lights and beacons when running the game. I can now turn off any group of lights on command. I also tweaked the headlights a bit to make them more realistic. Now, to figure out that interior...