Or it could be the Enterprise bridge, but just set between TFF and TUC...
Donny’s Late TOS Movie Era Interiors
- Thread starter Donny
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Or it could be the Enterprise bridge, but just set between TFF and TUC...
I guess that would make sense. Return home after the Great Barrier Hijack to finish shakedown of systems and to get a last minute safety decal pass
It's definitley a return to form as far as the continuous banks of consoles go. Less of the "fantasy" design of Phase II and more practical and uniform. No more oval monitors!
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but oval monitors 
So... A refresher, please? ST 1-4 are all the same bridge with various changes? ST5 is a new bridge and the first post-TNG bridge, right? Is 6 another new build or is it mostly based on 5?
I think most of my not knowing 5 and 6 as well is a combination of a diminished lack of interest as well as less exhaustive documentation (fan produced or otherwise) post TNG.
I think most of my not knowing 5 and 6 as well is a combination of a diminished lack of interest as well as less exhaustive documentation (fan produced or otherwise) post TNG.
1-4 are all the same with slight changes between each like moving consoles and greebles. They tore down the bridge and used it as the battle bridge in TNG season 1, but then something happened to it before V and they brought in the TNG designer to revamp it although parts of the bridge are similar to the 1-4 bridge. For Trek VI they re-arranged the V bridge and made more changes to it but it's more or less the same bridge set.
ST 1-4 is the same set with various changes (as well as being redressed to serve as the bridges of Reliant, Grissom, and Saratoga in 2, 3, and 4).
ST 5 is a mostly new set, with the turbolift alcoves, bridge railing, helm console, and soffits (those curved pieces along the top of the ceiling between the tops of the stations and the central ceiling with the lights and the big cross-beams) being reused from the 1-4 bridge.
ST 6 is the ST 5 set, but redecorated to give it a much more worn, militaristic feel. The palette becomes more gray, and physical buttons and switches are worked into the Helm/Nav, Science, and Communications consoles (whereas in 5 they were all Okudagrams). The soffits were replaced with different ones, an additional railing (that doesn't match the rest of the railing) is put at the front of the "pit," and the carpets are replaced with tiles with a raised diamond pattern (meant to suggest metal flooring). This set would be redressed to serve as the bridge of the Excelsior in the same movie, parts of it would show up on DS9 as various "bridge of the week" sets, then it would be pressed into service again as the Enterprise-B bridge and Armagosa Observatory control room in GEN. Subsequently, the turbolift alcoves and perimeter stations were repurposed for the Enterprise-E bridge in FC, INS, and NEM.
ST 5 is a mostly new set, with the turbolift alcoves, bridge railing, helm console, and soffits (those curved pieces along the top of the ceiling between the tops of the stations and the central ceiling with the lights and the big cross-beams) being reused from the 1-4 bridge.
ST 6 is the ST 5 set, but redecorated to give it a much more worn, militaristic feel. The palette becomes more gray, and physical buttons and switches are worked into the Helm/Nav, Science, and Communications consoles (whereas in 5 they were all Okudagrams). The soffits were replaced with different ones, an additional railing (that doesn't match the rest of the railing) is put at the front of the "pit," and the carpets are replaced with tiles with a raised diamond pattern (meant to suggest metal flooring). This set would be redressed to serve as the bridge of the Excelsior in the same movie, parts of it would show up on DS9 as various "bridge of the week" sets, then it would be pressed into service again as the Enterprise-B bridge and Armagosa Observatory control room in GEN. Subsequently, the turbolift alcoves and perimeter stations were repurposed for the Enterprise-E bridge in FC, INS, and NEM.
All correct. It should be noted that the floor pie wedge structures are the same throughout the 6 TOS films as well, including the metallic steps into the pit. The conn platform changes a few times however. It’s slightly altered from 1 for 2, and the same from 2-4, then a new one for 5, and then a new one for 6.
Perhaps I’ll write an article once I get them all fleshed out in 3D and submit it to Ex Astris.
Really? I could have sworn they built new floors for the "wedge" segments; in Lisbeth Shatner's book about the making of 5, I remember there being something about how the floor on the 1-4 bridge would squeak because of the wild segments constantly being moved in and out.
I could be wrong. I do know that my studies have concluded that the floor segments are the exact same shape and dimensions across all 6 films, albeit some slight modifications to the area underneath the pit rim, between 4 and 5 and 5 and 6
To be fair to Lisabeth Shatner, these are the kinds of details that may enthrall us to no end, but aren't really crucial to the narrative of the book she was writing.
OK, I don't know how I managed to miss this one:
Makes me suspect someone other than "whoever built this new Enterprise" was responsible for all of its mechanical woes...
Makes me suspect someone other than "whoever built this new Enterprise" was responsible for all of its mechanical woes...
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Ahhh, so it was Styles' revenge? Man, that guy knows how to hold a grudge!OK, I don't know how I managed to miss this one:
View attachment 23559
Makes me suspect someone other than "whoever built this new Enterprise" was responsible for all of its mechanical woes...
On Friday, I realized I made even more critical errors in angles of the console segments (the specfics I'd rather not drag everyone through). Basically, these console segments don't line up at nice even numbers like you'd think. I thought I had it figured out, but @Rekkert pointed out that the double consoles looked a little too long, and after I checked some figures, he was correct. This means the narrower, single consoles were too short. And I had the support braces lined up incorrectly as well. So I went back to the drawing board and did test after test to make sure I've got it all bullet-proof. And even made sure my pieces will work with the alternate layouts seen in the later films. So, I'm glad I caught it earlier than later. It took a few days to adjust everything to suit the new console dimensions and angles (like the soffits above and the carpet below, and I had to widen both the turbolift and viewscreen alcoves).
After I got everything back, I focused on detailing the consoles and getting some of my existing TUC graphics on for now. The console banks themselves change between TFF and the later films (the rounded lower edge of the upper monitor banks are replaced by a sharper edge in the next film, as well as the location and number of CRT monitors being changed around heavily) and these require different graphics anyway. So I stopped after getting the temporary "keyboards" in and some blank LCARS panels just to give them some life at this point. I also made the padding under neath the consoles a bit puffier and dialed in the colors a bit more.
Yesterday and today I focused on the conn platform (this one being unique to this film) relying heavily on the TFF Press Conference video (the only good thing to come from that is the extra views of the platform) and the helm console, in which I refined my existing TWOK console (it was more accurately shaped than my previous TUC attempt) and generated the simpler, stubbier astrogator. I also (fingers crossed) loaded up the previous RTX features that were causing so many Unreal crashes just to bake lighting with GPU lightmass and turn on ray-traced reflections for the shots below:
Next up I'll be finally modeling the crew chairs and captain's chair, which I never got around to for my TUC build 3 years ago.
After I got everything back, I focused on detailing the consoles and getting some of my existing TUC graphics on for now. The console banks themselves change between TFF and the later films (the rounded lower edge of the upper monitor banks are replaced by a sharper edge in the next film, as well as the location and number of CRT monitors being changed around heavily) and these require different graphics anyway. So I stopped after getting the temporary "keyboards" in and some blank LCARS panels just to give them some life at this point. I also made the padding under neath the consoles a bit puffier and dialed in the colors a bit more.
Yesterday and today I focused on the conn platform (this one being unique to this film) relying heavily on the TFF Press Conference video (the only good thing to come from that is the extra views of the platform
) and the helm console, in which I refined my existing TWOK console (it was more accurately shaped than my previous TUC attempt) and generated the simpler, stubbier astrogator. I also (fingers crossed) loaded up the previous RTX features that were causing so many Unreal crashes just to bake lighting with GPU lightmass and turn on ray-traced reflections for the shots below:Next up I'll be finally modeling the crew chairs and captain's chair, which I never got around to for my TUC build 3 years ago.
So there was me, thinking for a couple of days that I'd not seen any of Donny's wonder-threads for a while, so decided to check your profile and discover *this.*
Really glad to see(or at least assume) that you're well, and producing again
and these are wonderful. I adore that helm/nav console.
If it's not too inconvenient for you, I'd be fascinated to see your separate pieces, well, separate. How closely do your pieces match the physical on-set pieces (and how deliberately have you done that)?
dJE
Really glad to see(or at least assume) that you're well, and producing again
and these are wonderful. I adore that helm/nav console.If it's not too inconvenient for you, I'd be fascinated to see your separate pieces, well, separate. How closely do your pieces match the physical on-set pieces (and how deliberately have you done that)?
dJE
On Friday, I realized I made even more critical errors in angles of the console segments (the specfics I'd rather not drag everyone through). Basically, these console segments don't line up at nice even numbers like you'd think. I thought I had it figured out, but @Rekkert pointed out that the double consoles looked a little too long, and after I checked some figures, he was correct. This means the narrower, single consoles were too short. And I had the support braces lined up incorrectly as well. So I went back to the drawing board and did test after test to make sure I've got it all bullet-proof. And even made sure my pieces will work with the alternate layouts seen in the later films. So, I'm glad I caught it earlier than later. It took a few days to adjust everything to suit the new console dimensions and angles (like the soffits above and the carpet below, and I had to widen both the turbolift and viewscreen alcoves).
Next up I'll be finally modeling the crew chairs and captain's chair, which I never got around to for my TUC build 3 years ago.
The reason I've had so much difficulty is precisely because I'm trying to get as close to the on-set pieces as possible. But there are no accurate construction blueprints of these pieces available (save for the profile of the consoles seen on the Ent-E bridge blueprint). With my previous TUC build, I favored changing things so everything lines up on nice and even numbers. Which worked for just one bridge, but for a variety of reasons, this caused problems when trying to use the same pieces for the other bridges, hence my desire to go back and redo the consoles rather than use what I'd generated years earlier. So I've been trying to figure out exactly how wide these bridge consoles were and how they were offset or rotated, so that they line up properly with the spacer ribs and support beams in between them, in all the different configurations we saw from the three films covering this era. I can try and demonstrate some of these issues graphically when I have some time.
I don't know if you'd call what I do "camera matching"
Definitely not to the extent that I've seen you employ.Spent last night crafting the crew chairs. Special thanks to @Rekkert who sourced the patent, commercial brochure, and dimensions for the chair not too long ago, and for providing me with orthos of his chair model to give me a good starting point. AND for putting up with me constantly sending him screencaps of my WIP model for his feedback and approval
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I wish I could like this post a thousand times. IMO the coolest chair in all of Trek, even moreso than the Burke chair.I don't know if you'd call what I do "camera matching"
Spent last night crafting the crew chairs. Special thanks to @Rekkert who sourced the patent, commercial brochure, and dimensions for the chair not too long ago, and for providing me with orthos of his chair to give me a good starting point. AND for putting up with me constantly sending him screencaps of my WIP model for his feedback and approval
Amazing job as usual Donny!
I have to say, this was my least favorite bridge, but seeing these renders make me really like it. I realize now actually a pretty good design. I think a problem was how it was lit in the movie, coupled with the number of "unused" screens. In the film, the displays had a sort of washed out look, with the colors looking more like a faded turquoise and light green, instead of the more saturated blues and greens of TUC. I think it actually works for the narrative of the ship not quite working right. But with the light colored carpeting this set is much brighter than the previous bridges, so they may not have been able to dial in the lighting to read the screens well. This issue is especially present once they hit the great barrier. It looks better in some parts than others like when they were en-route to Nimbus III. But many of the scenes just look like they are lit from the front (viewscreen side) without much fill lighting. You can see actors casting shadows on the walls in many of the scenes.
The other issue was the that many of the displays appeared "off" or empty. Not sure whether this was due to a lack of available artwork, or a conscious choice, or if they actually were on but completely washed out by the light. I could see a lack of artwork being an issue - this set had so many more "screens" then the previous set, so even if they could reuse artwork that Okuda made for TVH it wasn't enough to fill the whole set. This was an issue to differing extents for all the previous films. Ironically, many of Okuda's designs were images that would work with now abandoned circular/oval displays of the older bridge set.
Probably the biggest issue is that many of the displays are actually monochrome in either a sickly clinical light green-teal or just black and white. Even though they are kept mostly in the background for brief shots, its enough to register. When other displays are so washed out, seeing a bank of solid monochrome displays stood out. This probably is was most led me to remember the displays in TFF being "colourless." This appears to have been solved by TUC. To be fair, this was an issue with the previous movies - probably the biggest offender were those TSFS computer graphics with huge pixels. And of course, TOS with screens filled with just a couple colored lights. But when entire wall is a bank of screens like a 90's newsroom, then the look is going to be defined more by what is or isn't on those screens. My gut is that the art department and cinematographers just were not prepared for what challenges this new set brought - relying on the previous films to inform their scheduling. TFF came out in 89, so I think most of the displays would still have to be done in camera. Which means that save for a handful of insert shots, artwork had to be completed in advance of filming the bridge scenes.
Much of these issues were addressed in TUC, however at the expense of completely changing the aesthetic. I would have like to see how this bridge could have looked - if they had more time to prepare and figure out how to light the set.
I have to say, this was my least favorite bridge, but seeing these renders make me really like it. I realize now actually a pretty good design. I think a problem was how it was lit in the movie, coupled with the number of "unused" screens. In the film, the displays had a sort of washed out look, with the colors looking more like a faded turquoise and light green, instead of the more saturated blues and greens of TUC. I think it actually works for the narrative of the ship not quite working right. But with the light colored carpeting this set is much brighter than the previous bridges, so they may not have been able to dial in the lighting to read the screens well. This issue is especially present once they hit the great barrier. It looks better in some parts than others like when they were en-route to Nimbus III. But many of the scenes just look like they are lit from the front (viewscreen side) without much fill lighting. You can see actors casting shadows on the walls in many of the scenes.
The other issue was the that many of the displays appeared "off" or empty. Not sure whether this was due to a lack of available artwork, or a conscious choice, or if they actually were on but completely washed out by the light. I could see a lack of artwork being an issue - this set had so many more "screens" then the previous set, so even if they could reuse artwork that Okuda made for TVH it wasn't enough to fill the whole set. This was an issue to differing extents for all the previous films. Ironically, many of Okuda's designs were images that would work with now abandoned circular/oval displays of the older bridge set.
Probably the biggest issue is that many of the displays are actually monochrome in either a sickly clinical light green-teal or just black and white. Even though they are kept mostly in the background for brief shots, its enough to register. When other displays are so washed out, seeing a bank of solid monochrome displays stood out. This probably is was most led me to remember the displays in TFF being "colourless." This appears to have been solved by TUC. To be fair, this was an issue with the previous movies - probably the biggest offender were those TSFS computer graphics with huge pixels. And of course, TOS with screens filled with just a couple colored lights. But when entire wall is a bank of screens like a 90's newsroom, then the look is going to be defined more by what is or isn't on those screens. My gut is that the art department and cinematographers just were not prepared for what challenges this new set brought - relying on the previous films to inform their scheduling. TFF came out in 89, so I think most of the displays would still have to be done in camera. Which means that save for a handful of insert shots, artwork had to be completed in advance of filming the bridge scenes.
Much of these issues were addressed in TUC, however at the expense of completely changing the aesthetic. I would have like to see how this bridge could have looked - if they had more time to prepare and figure out how to light the set.
