Does Janeway hate Harry Kim?

[Satyrquaze]

You know, promotions take a good amount of time anyway. For the amount of years humanoids seem to live in the Trek universe, 7 years is a drop in the bucket as far as time goes. For all we know, it could take a decade before one is even considered for a promotion.

Tell that to Chris Pine's Kirk.

Or, for a less totally insane example, I think Nog ended DS9 as a lieutenant, five years after starting the academy.

Indeed, also theres Geordi LaForge who went from Lieutenant Junior Grade to Lieutenant to Lieutenant Commander in two years(!)

Course, Janeway had as many personalities as I have socks... so it could be multiple reasons.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Out of roughly 150 officers and crew, Janeway gave one promotion - Tuvok. I don't think she hates Harry or any of the other 148 people.

And Tom in the pilot, the whole Maquis crew really, and B'Elanna in the second episode (What was she before she was Chief? Ensign or noncom?) and Tom again when he made it back to Lieutenant after his stint as an Ensign for being a terrorist.

Maybe there's a set a mount of recommended promotions a captain is allowed to give every seven years with out seeming oblique and frivolous? maybe she used up that "number" on the first day promoting the Maquis from terrorist scum to houseslave?

 

[exodus]

Yes, everyone hates Harry Kim.

Is that narrated by Chris Rock too?

 

[exodus]

Nog may have had better luck climbing the ranks, but the situation mandated it. The Federation was at war, and he was in the thick of it. Not only were positions constantly opening up, but the ranks were continually expanding. More ships and more crewmen meant more officers to manage both -- not to that mention battlefield heroics are more noticeable than seven years of able service. Harry's got nowhere to go. Sure, Janeway could make him a lieutenant, but what does that mean for a ship stranded years from home with a smallish crew?

Exactly.
Plus, if you go back over Voyager most of the eps that had mulipule crew deaths happened in reset eps. So not as many crewman died on Voyager as folks think. I think LT. Carey's death might have allowed Harry to move up though because Harry according to "Non-Sequiter", was a gifted in shuttle design. Wasn't that Carey's last job on Voyager before his death? Besides, not everybody can be a LT. You'd still need Ensigns to do the grunt work.

Then think about Sisko.
How many years before "Emissary" was he ranked Commander?
How many years after did it take him to be promoted to Captain?
It was way more years than Harry was Ensign.

 

[Angel4576]

Then think about Sisko.
How many years before "Emissary" was he ranked Commander?
How many years after did it take him to be promoted to Captain?
It was way more years than Harry was Ensign.

By contrast, you had Nog, who went from petty thief and general rogue to enlisting in Starfleet, going from cadet to ensign, and then ultimately to Lieutenant all in the space of 4 years.

But then, Sisko didn't hate Nog!

 

[Avon]

as an insane psychopath, i'm sure janeway hates all her crew equally.

 

[Shazam!]

The best Harry Kim moment is when Paris gets his promotion and Harry wonders when he'll get his and everyone just looks at him like he's a dick.

 

[exodus]

Then think about Sisko.
How many years before "Emissary" was he ranked Commander?
How many years after did it take him to be promoted to Captain?
It was way more years than Harry was Ensign.

By contrast, you had Nog, who went from petty thief and general rogue to enlisting in Starfleet, going from cadet to ensign, and then ultimately to Lieutenant all in the space of 4 years.

But then, Sisko didn't hate Nog!

Yeah, he did.
He was dead set against Jake being friends with him for the first 2 years.
He wasn't even happy with the ideas of recommending him to Starfleet, remember?
Anything involving Nog, Jake had to talk Sisko into.

 

[Angel4576]

Yeah, he did.
He was dead set against Jake being friends with him for the first 2 years.
He was even happy with the ideas of recommending him to Starfleet, remember?

That wasn't hatred though. Sisko had him pegged as a bad influence, but I doubt he'd indiscriminately hate someone on that basis.

The fact that he ultimately let Jake make his own choices around befriending Nog, and later still eventually did recommend him to Starfleet would suggest that he still kept an open mind, probably because he realised that Nog, ultimately, was a victim of circumstance, in that he fell under Quark's (bad) influence.

 

[exodus]

Yeah, he did.
He was dead set against Jake being friends with him for the first 2 years.
He was even happy with the ideas of recommending him to Starfleet, remember?

That wasn't hatred though. Sisko had him pegged as a bad influence, but I doubt he'd indiscriminately hate someone on that basis.

Vic Fontaine?
Didn't he hate Vic & his place for what he felt it represented in African-American history too him?

 

[Angel4576]

Vic Fontaine?
Didn't he hate Vic & his place for what he felt it represented in African-American history too him?

Depends on whether or not you consider Vic to be 'real'. At the time, Sisko didn't, however, soon corrected that view when he realised that Vic actually was self-aware.

 

[exodus]

Vic Fontaine?
Didn't he hate Vic & his place for what he felt it represented in African-American history too him?

Depends on whether or not you consider Vic to be 'real'. At the time, Sisko didn't, however, soon corrected that view when he realised that Vic actually was self-aware.

Actually I think it had more to do with Kassidy telling Sisko the only prejudices we have are the ones we set ourselves and how it's wrong to hold on to bad feelings of a time in history long past. I really don't agree it had anything to do with seeing Vic as real or not.

 

[Angel4576]

Actually I think it had more to do with Kassidy telling Sisko the only prejudices we have are the ones we set ourselves. I really don't agree it had anything to do with seeing Vic as real or not.

It doesn't really matter, it's clear in the episode that Sisko's resentment is towards the establishment rather than Vic. You could possibly forge the tenuous extension that Vic represents the establishment, but that's a stretch. Either way though, completely different scenario to the one he found himself in with Nog.

 

[Captrek]

<looks at thread title>

No. Because Janeway is dead.

She's not dead, she's restin'. With Q.

She’s pining for the fjords.

 

[PrimaryAdjunct]

I was watching the episode where seven confronts janeway over the loss of crew member, and along qith losing a dozen or so crewmen and ensigns, she lost multiple commander two lieutenant commanders an a few lieutenants, and she upgraded tuvok and chako, i think theres room for harry to go up, considering paris got demoted and re-promoted in a year or so

 

[LeadHead]

The only shows where people got promoted like they should have were TNG and DS9

I always thought it was a crime that they never got Paris to Lieutenant Commander, Torres and Kim to Full Lieutenant and The Doctor, Neelix and Seven some official rank.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Carter from Stargate, went from captain to major, to colonel, to SG team leader to the Military governor and mission leader of Atlantis to Starship captain...

Starship Colonel or Starship Captain?

There's 10 episodes of Universe left.

Maybe, just maybe we might see General Carter?

 

[exodus]

I always thought it was a crime that they never got Paris to Lieutenant Commander.

Not too me.
Tom never learned the refined art of shutting the fuck up.

 

[Angel4576]

Carter from Stargate, went from captain to major, to colonel, to SG team leader to the Military governor and mission leader of Atlantis to Starship captain...

Starship Colonel or Starship Captain?

There's 10 episodes of Universe left.

Maybe, just maybe we might see General Carter?

10 episodes? Surely enough time to make Imperial Intergalactic Overlord Warrior Princess.....?!

 

[Guy Gardener]

I always thought it was a crime that they never got Paris to Lieutenant Commander.

Not too me.
Tom never learned the refined art of shutting the fuck up.

But he's got such a pretty mouth.