Do we need more backstory?

Discussion in 'Star Wars' started by RoJoHen, Dec 27, 2015.

  1. RoJoHen

    RoJoHen Awesome Admiral

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    Granted, ANH just kind of dumps us right in the middle of the story. There's an evil Empire...there's a Rebellion. And it worked -- we accepted it -- because we didn't know anything about this universe.

    But now it's 30 years later and on the surface it really doesn't look like anything has changed. Leia is still running some kind of resistance movement against the current evil regime.

    It honestly makes the victory at the end of ROTJ seem like it never happened. They're still fighting the same fight.

    Do you think we need more information about what really happened over the last 30 years? Will that information be revealed in the next two movies as we deal more directly with Snoke?
     
  2. Ithekro

    Ithekro Vice Admiral Admiral

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    We didn't really get much backstory until the Empire Strike Back.

    In a Three Act play, you get such things in the Second Act, not the First Act.
     
  3. Venardhi

    Venardhi Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The difference between ANH and TFA is that the "known unknowns" are far more important to the story this time. Rather than a vague backstory to the universe that informs the plot and gives it dimension (there was a big war that Obi Wan and Luke's father fought in, the Empire has replaced an old Republic, etc), we're given a complex history between the two trilogies full of intentional holes.

    Star Wars has never been a mystery box and IMO it shouldn't be. Hopefully that was Abrams's influence and now that he is gone we'll see a lot more filling in the gaps than ripping open new ones.
     
  4. RoJoHen

    RoJoHen Awesome Admiral

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    True enough. I'm just hoping that they follow such a model.

    I'm having a difficult time judging this movie on its own merits because it's clearly just an introduction to a larger story.
     
  5. Skywalker

    Skywalker Admiral Admiral

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  6. Mage

    Mage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    No. I mean, the bulk of backstory for the OT came from the EU. The huge amount of details that fans want, were all from comics and novels and such.
    ANH gave us AS much backstory really as TFA did. Some more stuff was filled in during the sequels. What we NEED to know, we'll get from the other movies. What we'd like to now, we'll get from novels and such.

    These days, most people need info-dump. "OMG, this thing happened, I need to know what lead to that. NOW!"
    If we had lenghtly exposition scenes where Leia set Rey down and did a 5 minute monologue on where Snoke came from, how he rose to power and found Kylo, it would drag out the pacing.

    And, I mean, the Emperor wasn't actually scene untill ROTJ, with only a hologram communication in TESB. And he was mentioned in ANH. So that's two movies without what is basicly the antagonist of the series.
     
  7. BigJake

    BigJake Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I vote no. Star Wars is at its best when it's low-information and leaves most of the workaday details to the imagination. Trying to fill in all the blanks was Lucas' most understandable impulse and also possibly his worst mistake.
     
  8. Venardhi

    Venardhi Vice Admiral Admiral

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    You can't tell nearly as satisfying a low-information story with so much intentional mystery though. If Ben had simply run off and reappeared as Kylo it would be one thing, but it seems like Snoke actively converted him and only later did he lead the massacre upon Luke's temple/academy, which raises all kinds of questions. Likewise, we're given the distinct impression on multiple occasions that there is more to Rey than we are told. Plus whatsisname who Kylo kills early on, plus a bunch of other stuff that is left shrouded not in naturalistic "taken for granted within the story" low information, but intentional mystery.
     
  9. Rowan Sjet

    Rowan Sjet Commodore Commodore

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    Not really. We know the Republic is the main player in the galaxy now, while the First Order have carved out their own bit of space, while the Republic funds the Resistance to weaken the First Order from within and keep them in check. And that's all in the opening crawl.

    So the battles of Endor and Jakku weren't complete victories, but a lot has definitely changed.

    I think it would have been nice to have more information (and we will definitely get more information as the movies go on) but not strictly necessary. The more annoying thing though was, as Venardhi said, the mystery box aspect. As far as I can recall, there was only one mystery in the OT and that was what Yoda meant by "No, there is another." And that was nowhere near as prominent in the story as the mysteries in TFA. There was no mystery about Luke's father; we knew one thing and then we knew another.
     
  10. JarodRussell

    JarodRussell Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I only want to know how the fuck Ben Solo could turn evil being raised by Han, Leia and Luke. I mean seriously, that's quite a bit of a stretch.
     
  11. tomalak301

    tomalak301 Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    We don't need more backstory but it would be nice to get some. I'm hoping in Episode 8, we do get some backstory on the First Order.
     
  12. Serveaux

    Serveaux Boomer American Premium Member

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    Nope. Let them keep moviing.
     
  13. RoJoHen

    RoJoHen Awesome Admiral

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    Backstory doesn't necessarily need to be presented as lengthy exposition or a history lesson. It can be incorporated into stories while still moving the plot forward. It just takes a writer who knows how to do that.
     
  14. USS Triumphant

    USS Triumphant Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yes. Not a lot - having read the additional materials now, I can see where five brief bits of dialog would have helped immensely.

    I don't need to be spoonfed everything immediately, but in my opinion, the difference between ANH and TFA is that TFA left large matters very confusing and distracting. ANH didn't come close to explaining everything, but it explained enough to keep viewers from getting hung up on confusion.
     
  15. Hela

    Hela Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Why do we need anymore? Besides satisfying personal curiosity, I mean.

    We arguably got more in the way of world building than ANH. It certainly didn't explain anything about the Empire and the Resistance other than 'It is,' Kylo Ren is more fleshed out than 'a student of mine, until he turned evil', Han and Maz recap more about the Jedi and the war than Obi-wan even did, and unlike ANH we see flashbacks to mentioned plot points (the slaughter of the Jedi temple, Luke leaving, Rey being abandoned etc.)

    I have no doubt we will get more information (like finding out who Rey and Snoke are,) but I also remember people complaining about how the prequels, and even ROTJ, took away the fascinating ambiguity of certain things that were best left to the imagination (for eg. The Clone Wars. Which I liked, but was a big sticking point when AOTC came out.) I wouldn't blame the Powers that Be if they left most of the nitty gritty details for the super fans that read or watch the EU.
     
  16. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I'm okay with things like who or what Snoke is, what happened with Ben Solo/Kylo Ren and other stuff like that as they were shown and am fine with waiting out the sequels to explore them in more depth.

    It would have helped if the had given us more explanation regarding the Republic, Resistance and First Order. Hell, we don't even find out there is a New Republic until it gets blown up.
     
  17. Hela

    Hela Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    It's mentioned in the opening crawl that The Republic is supporting the Resistance.

    Or more specifically: Since the fall of the EMPIRE, evil has risen in the form of THE NEW ORDER. With the support of THE REPUBLIC, GENERAL LEIA ORGANA leads a RESISTANCE...

    It's not Star Wars unless the proper nouns are in all-caps.
     
  18. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Okay, but after that they aren't mentioned again until they get blown up.
     
  19. DWF

    DWF Admiral Admiral

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    That would depend on whether or not the movie is an even one or an odd one.
     
  20. Skywalker

    Skywalker Admiral Admiral

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    For me, it's more about context. Why is the Republic supporting a resistance against the First Order instead of just battling it themselves? This information is given in tie-in material but it should be in the movie. All it would have taken was a quick line of dialogue.