Do Rebellious Child/Teen Characters Have to Be Disliked?

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by VulcanMindBlown, Aug 26, 2017.

  1. VulcanMindBlown

    VulcanMindBlown Commander Red Shirt

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    I've noticed that child/teenager characters are some of the most hated characters in Star Trek.

    Wesley Crusher is king, if you take a scientific poll among all Star Trek fans probably. I personally think that Jake is more so and much more annoying. There are also the children from TOS and many other child actors in Star Trek. However, sometimes I think that they are necessary to move the plot and need to show realism. However, we use art to escape reality into something more entertaining...

    Thoughts....????!!!
     
  2. Janeway’s Girl

    Janeway’s Girl Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I liked Naomi Wildman from Voyager. I didn't find her annoying at all.
     
  3. Hades Temperature Checker

    Hades Temperature Checker Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    No, they don't. Especially if they grow up and mature.
     
  4. Timewalker

    Timewalker Cat-lovin', Star Trekkin' Time Lady Premium Member

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    I actually didn't find Wesley the most irritating child/teen character on TNG. That honor goes to the super-neat-groomed kids who found themselves orphaned. They're like little Stepford kids - polite, clean, totally composed, with hair meticulously combed, spit & polish clothing... when a normal kid would have fallen apart and needed an adult around, or at least a damn teddy bear. These TNG kids were just creepy.

    Wesley was annoying, yes - but he got a bit less annoying as the years went by.


    I liked Naomi, Icheb, and Mezoti (I'm currently reading a fanfic about Mezoti, in which she didn't leave the ship, but rather was legally adopted by Seven when they got back to Earth). The twins and the Borg baby were basically pointless characters.


    Picard's nephew was a likable kid.
     
  5. Large Gathering of Unmasked People

    Large Gathering of Unmasked People Mih ssim, mih ssim, nam, daed si Xim. Moderator

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    And also good as young Picard in "Rascals".
     
  6. Silvercrest

    Silvercrest Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    What's the question? Rebellious child/teen characters or ANY child/teen characters?
     
  7. Timewalker

    Timewalker Cat-lovin', Star Trekkin' Time Lady Premium Member

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    Yes. Or no.

    Since the conversation has already covered all of the above, feel free to offer whatever opinions you may have about the child/teen characters.

    Weren't most of them rebellious or disobedient or obnoxious or unlikable at some point? There were times when I thought even Naomi was a brat, and I generally liked her.
     
  8. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Super genius children (ie Wesley) are annoying. Don't have any issues with the other kids in DS9 or VOY.
     
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  9. Greg Cox

    Greg Cox Admiral Premium Member

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    Part of it is post-traumatic "Will Robinson" syndrome. Fans worry that the kid will end up taking over their favorite SF show, and that the show will then be dismissed as "kid's stuff." And that's bad because SF is serious, grown-up business, damnit. :)

    So when there's a kid on a bridge and saving the ship on occasion . . . this does not go over well.

    By contrast, I don't recall people having the same objections to Jake and Nog, who were written as ordinary teens, hanging out on the Promenade, instead of child prodigies like Wesley .. ..
     
  10. 137th Gebirg

    137th Gebirg Admiral Premium Member

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    Yes Wesley was horrible, but he actually started getting interesting towards the end of his tenure, when he began shirking the responsibility that was both implied and forced upon him by his mother, Picard and the memory of his dead father. There was also the bitterness he started experiencing over what happened to him at the academy. The minute he started flipping the bird to all that unreasonable bullshit, I finally wanted to see more of him and then he went away for good. :shrug:
     
  11. dswynne1

    dswynne1 Captain Captain

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    I seriously doubt it. Personally, I liked Will Robinson (Penny was the more annoying character, IMO), because he actually was interested in wanting to learn new things. However, he was not critical in "saving the day", which was the complaint concerning Wesley Crusher. But that is all subjective. Also, I think that the problem was that including Wesley was a radical departure within the 'TREK fandom, with the introduction of a family element in TNG. Plus, no one liked the idea that a teenager could solve the problems trained adults could not do. As much as I like Wil Wheaton, his character should have been recurring from Day One, and only be seen as the story permits (like the Naomi Wildman character). And furthermore, I could not relate to any of the kids/teens on TNG, because, unlike Jake and Nog on DS9, they were too perfect (TNG's "When the Bough Breaks..." was particularly egregious in this regard). Still, I don't think that kids in SF is a problem pe se, IMO.
     
  12. sbk1234

    sbk1234 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I think it's an issue with kids who are written as being "perfect." It's bad enough to have an adult character who is too good to be true, without flaws, but one could rationalize that it took that character years of experience and life to attain that level of flawlessness. For a child, they need to have a chance to live, screw up, and learn from their experience before they can be so wonderful, IMHO.
     
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  13. Sad Kelpian Child

    Sad Kelpian Child Admiral Admiral

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    Rebelliousness is less the problem than being smarter than the grown ups. Especially when they have the make grown ups miss obvious things so the child can notice them.
     
  14. Timewalker

    Timewalker Cat-lovin', Star Trekkin' Time Lady Premium Member

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    It's the obnoxious tone of voice and the ":rolleyes: Adults are so stupid! :rolleyes:" attitude.

    It wasn't charming on Dallas with Charlie (Jenna Wade's daughter) and it wasn't charming with Wesley (the two teen actors had basically the same facial expressions and tones in these scenes).
     
  15. Nightdiamond

    Nightdiamond Commodore Commodore

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    This is Wesley being rebellious ;

    WESLEY: You've only got one microfusion interrelay in there? Your converter interface'll never hold up
    LAFORGE: Hey, I ran these diagnostics myself. This little baby will withstand over five hundred Cochranes of warp field stress.
    WESLEY: I don't think so. You better put a secondary phase inverter in there. Look at your subprocessor matrix. It needs an overhaul.
    LAFORGE: Well, that may be your opinion, Cadet, but I stand by my work.
    WESLEY: Read the latest paper from Doctor Vassbinder. He has brilliant new theories on warp propulsion inter-relays. He's say all this stuff is obsolete.
    LAFORGE: I don't know what's gotten into you, Wes.
    WESLEY: Look, do you want my help or not?
    LAFORGE: With this kind of an attitude, absolutely not. You're dismissed.


    :lol:

    Later on he ascends to a higher level of existence and begins exploring reality or something.
    TNG was just too nice and perfect to show a rebellious teen.

    DS9 also tried to portray Alexander as one, but it was kind of botched too. I know he was supposed to be angry, but he came off as really stiff and wooden. He seemed almost emotionally disturbed.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2017
  16. USS Triumphant

    USS Triumphant Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yes. They do. It's mandatory, and if you think you like one, you're wrong.

    Next question.

    ;)
     
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  17. FreddyE

    FreddyE Captain Captain

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    If this is a real scene from an episode...then the only person beeing annoying here is LaForge...beeing all mighty "I stand by my work"...and not open to ANY of Wesleys suggestions at ALL.
     
  18. Spot261

    Spot261 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    It was more meaningful in context bear in mind, Wesley's tone of voice and body language aren't evident from this exchange, nor is the fact that an apparent subplot throughout the episode which gains prominence later is the deterioration in his grades and behaviour.
     
  19. C57D

    C57D Guest

    Wesley was annoying for me because in order for him to be boy wonder the rest of the crew had to be portrayed as total idiots. As Buzz Lightyear said "Years of academy training,wasted!"
    That, and the "Mary Sue" factor - Eugene WESLEY Roddenberry - Come on !!!!

    My only other ST child dislike are the Midwich Cuckoo looking kids who didn't mourn their parents. Creepy or what?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 29, 2017
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  20. Greg Cox

    Greg Cox Admiral Premium Member

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    Well, if we're talking the kids from "And The Children Shall Lead," they were supposed to be creepy in their lack of reaction to their parents' death. And the scene where they finally break down and experience their grief is one of the better scenes in the ep.