Did pre refit constitution class ships have vertical warp cores?

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by WildManWizard, Jul 20, 2020.

  1. WildManWizard

    WildManWizard Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    as in they had them but we never saw them on screen?
     
  2. Spockskin

    Spockskin Commodore Premium Member

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    If you consider TAS, the Enterprise had an "Engineering Core" which we the see the top lid on several episodes. That kind of sounds like the beginning of the "Warp Core", but it is unknown whether it is a vertical shaft or not.
    [​IMG]
     
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  3. WildManWizard

    WildManWizard Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    could be. i have wondered if the tubes behind the mesh in engeneering was a horizontal core
     
  4. Spockskin

    Spockskin Commodore Premium Member

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    I head-canon the tube structure to be a plasma manifold with the matter/antimatter reactor chamber under it (based on the double-triangular-doohickey on the floor of the engineering room). The M/AM reactor energizes the plasma in ten lower power or "manageable" plasma conduits and the plasma manifold concentrates those into one highly energized plasma stream to power the warp drive and other systems on the ship. The M/AM reactor does not create the plasma, rather it only energizes the plasma to transfer the energy (electrons or more probable charged subatomic particles) to the engines. I guess the energy transfer device from the M/AM reactor and the plasma could be the "main energizer" or "the mains". The plasma itself is in a closed loop system and confined either by magnetic fields, force fields or gravitational fields. Looking at the TAS "engineering core", it could be an intermediary storage reservoir to hold excess energized plasma. YMMV :).
     
  5. AresB

    AresB Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I choose to go with this schematic in my headcanon, unless and until it's proven wrong. Horizontal core below the Main Engineering. The ship model has a red rectangle on the hull below shuttlebay, this configuration would make it the core ejection hatch.

    [​IMG]
     
  6. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    According to Short Treks "Ask Not", then yes.

    Otherwise, no.
     
  7. captain crow

    captain crow Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    To me warp core stuff is later (movies onward) tech.

    I've always kind of gone with the idea of M/AM reactors in the front end of the warp nacelles with fuel elements piped in from storage units in the engineering hull. The front nacelle domes are main power generators, instead of bussard collectors, on the exhaust end of the reactors. The blinkys we see are the reactor exhaust and the spinning blades are turbines.
     
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  8. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    The term "Warp core" started with TNG, so we can be allowed to assume earlier ships had a different system.
     
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  9. Shawnster

    Shawnster Commodore Commodore

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    The original intent was that power was made inside the nacelles. This is why the fanfic and fan art from the 70s sometimes hae ships with 3 nacelles (like Franz Joseph's Dreadnaught). The more nacelles, the more power. Trek's founding fathers were WWII veterans and the inspiration came from airplane propellers. The propellers generated the power for the plane. The more propellers, the more power. Big bombers had more propellers because they needed the extra power.

    This idea was abandoned in TMP when we are introduced to the vertical and horizontal warp core.

    So my head canon revised so that the orange/red polygon shaped area in engineering was the warp core.
     
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  10. Qonundrum

    Qonundrum Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Which then begs the question, TMP-onward, what do the nacelles do? Apart from looking like glorified flame decals? :devil: (Okay, the dilithium chamber is now in the warp core unit itself but the nacelles and warp coils therein could still be ramping up voltage, amperage, or whatever else is needed... I wouldn't be walking around in there while they were in use regardless... unless, at each nacelle's entrance, there's an alcove where one could bake a cake or turkey in 0.47 seconds' time... and irradiate it too...)

    Their being WWII veterans really brings into the show a ton more than just mechanics extrapolated from a Navy ship into space, but philosophy obviously as well.)
     
  11. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    In TOS designs, the nacelles are analogous to an aviation setup, where they both generate power and translate that directly into movement. A small amount of that power is tapped for other ship systems.

    TMP onwards the analogy is more akin to that of a naval vessel, with one or more engines inside the hull connected to outboard propellers which provide movement.

    So in answer to your question, the function of the TMP+ nacelles has been restricted to mere "make it go" devices.
     
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  12. hbquikcomjamesl

    hbquikcomjamesl Commodore Commodore

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    I vaguely recall a non-canon source (might have even been a formally deprecated book like Spaceflight Chronology or Mr. Scott's Guide) saying, in so many words, that in the pre-refit design, the nacelles were self-contained, with both the matter-antimatter reactors and the warp coils, but in the post-refit design, they contained only the warp coils, fed plasma from an intermix chamber in the secondary hull.

    And in the FJS drawings, the area behind the grille in main engineering was a big open space between the impulse engines.

    So far as I'm aware, none of this has been contradicted by any canon source.
     
  13. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well there is Day Of The Dove which strongly implies that the Engine Room is in the secondary hull...
    [​IMG]
     
  14. 137th Gebirg

    137th Gebirg Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    And there are several episodes that show the cast arriving at engineering after walking down a rounded corridor, implying that it's in the primary hull. I like to think (in my head canon) that there are two engineering decks, similarly designed, one for impulse operations at the aft of the primary hull and the other for warp in the middle of the secondary hull, just in front of the shuttle bay and engine pylon mount area, and we've seen both on-screen.
     
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  15. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    If we are to believe Mr Scott's lines over the tannoy in The Naked Time then are at least 2 Engine Rooms on board the Enterprise, possibly more!
     
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  16. 137th Gebirg

    137th Gebirg Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    Canon is satisfied! :)
     
  17. Xhiandra

    Xhiandra Captain Captain

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    But the NX-01, NX-02 and even the Phoenix had Warp Cores, so they existed prior Constitution class starships.
    Scotty probably didn't like the term.
     
  18. KamenRiderBlade

    KamenRiderBlade Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    He was the chief engineer, it's his perogative on what terminology to use.
     
  19. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Admiral Admiral

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    This schematic was used in 'A Mirror Darkly' so it is canon.
     
  20. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Well, sort of. A version without any of the legend text, and with fuzzier shapes and colors, was seen; it's not possible to tell if there's something like a warp core there or not.

    Personally, I'm convinced the warp core is a giant sphere right above the round yellow ejection hatch, an armored monstrosity that is accompanied by so much support machinery that the shape may be difficult to discern, and is served by a dumbwaiter system that delivers the dilithium in its articulation frames from the shirtsleeves control rooms, via a vertical shaft that some might mistake for "core", whilst pumping the resultant energies to places in glowing tubes one might also mistake for "core".

    Having the sphere there means the secondary hull, too, features its share of curved corridors. Also, fitting the sphere inside the hull cylinder leaves unused volume around its base, perfect for deployables such as ultraviolet satellites, universal cure dispensers, and cutesy repair robots.

    By the time of TMP, the sphere has gotten smaller and lost most of the supporting gear, freeing up space for whatever (Starfleet chooses cargo, but only because it can't think of anything else initially). And by the time of TNG, the sphere is the size of a jacuzzi and sits smack in the middle of the shirtsleeves workspace, now dwarfed by the ancillary systems such as matter and antimatter feed tubes.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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