Deck Plans V: The Not-So-Final Go Around

[FrontLine]

Forbin said:
Only doing one deck on mine, 'cause I'm a lazy bastard, but I've scaled the turboshafts way back based on this discussion.

http://www.inpayne.com/temp/coeur_de_lion_cutaway_head.jpg

I wouldn't recommend a jogger cut thru the hangar deck during operations, but one could loop around the two outer corridors .

Dude, provide links to the rest of the drawings or Im stealing your Samoyed (beh, Ill steal her just the same). Seriously though, Id love to see the work you did on this

 

[Captain Robert April]

I think this should work...

 

[Bernard Guignard]

Nice work there.

 

[Brannigan]

April where are you putting sickbay? I was watching Amok Time and its stated sickbay is on deck 5. Kirk steps into a turbolift with spock and says Deck 5, followed by kirk telling spock to go to sickbay. I presumed that the turbolift was stopped on deck 5 when spock departed. Further, it seems deck 5 is also where Kirks quarters are.

 

[USS Mariner]

CRA, there's also the possibility of putting the main turboshafts corridors above on Deck 4, leaving just a few shafts to reach the middle areas of the saucer (between the core and the outer edges, where most of the crew is. This allows more accesible floorspace for the main deck (main as in it's the largest and has most of the crew there, plus the engines,) and because the turbolifts would be left on the edges of Deck 4, no workspace would be lost there. I assume your only putting labs above and below, correct?

 

[USS Mariner]

Brannigan said:
April where are you putting sickbay? I was watching Amok Time and its stated sickbay is on deck 5. Kirk steps into a turbolift with spock and says Deck 5, followed by kirk telling spock to go to sickbay. I presumed that the turbolift was stopped on deck 5 when spock departed. Further, it seems deck 5 is also where Kirks quarters are.

His sickbay is on Deck 5, that circular thing in the middle is the sickbay set repeated several times to fill up that area.

 

[Captain Robert April]

Actually, that's deck 6.

As for "Amok Time", Spock's a big boy, he can manage to make his own way one deck down (Kirk was on his way to his quarters, and he's the captain, why should he change direction? Spock's the one in trouble).

 

[Forbin]

Vance said:
And the engineers knew the ship was flawed when the shuttles kept crashing into the isolation wards!

When you're right, you're right -
http://www.inpayne.com/temp/coeur_de_lion_cutaway_head2.jpg

I also went even more minimalist with the turbolift runs. When you think about it, current naval vessels don't even have elevators, so why go crazy? If some crewman has to get from one end of the Nimitz to the other, he's gotta run.

 

[Captain Robert April]

When I get a chance, I'm gonna take another run at that little scaling exercise, with the sets and the deck. I remembered that I also tweaked the size of the FJ filler part, to fill out the confines of the hull, so that might be throwing off my estimation.

 

[ancient]

Forbin said:

Vance said:
And the engineers knew the ship was flawed when the shuttles kept crashing into the isolation wards!

When you're right, you're right -
http://www.inpayne.com/temp/coeur_de_lion_cutaway_head2.jpg

I also went even more minimalist with the turbolift runs. When you think about it, current naval vessels don't even have elevators, so why go crazy? If some crewman has to get from one end of the Nimitz to the other, he's gotta run.

But the turbolift is a great plot device because it allows you to cut from entering it toexiting onto bridge orwherever, or, if they need to do some exposititon, they can just stand around and talk while moving to their destination.

Still, I wish ENT-Ent had eliminated turbolifts. Maybe one lift for disabled guests, moving injured crewmen, etc, but it would have seemed more confined and lower tech.

 

[Forbin]

ancient said:
Still, I wish ENT-Ent had eliminated turbolifts. Maybe one lift for disabled guests, moving injured crewmen, etc, but it would have seemed more confined and lower tech.

Agreed! Simple elevators between decks at the most; stairs at the least. The show generally blew it with making things look 100 years behind what we've seen. They made a big deal out of "doors that you have to open manually!" But they were still push-button doors that went "swiish" when they opened. I was hoping for submarine hatches.

 

[Captain Robert April]

If I was in charge of the preproduction of "Enterprise", I would've kicked things off with a staff meeting with the art department and the costume designers, put up a slide of a still from "The Cage" and told everyone, in no uncertain terms, that they were to forget about alluding to TNG, DS9, Voyager, the movies, even TOS, and, pointing to the picture, "THAT, boys and girls, is what we're supposed to be leading up to!"

The other shows already progressed naturally from that point onward, so all Enterprise had to worry about was be a logical predecessor to "The Cage"; the rest of the franchise would take care of itself. Instead, what we got was a prequel to TNG, with occasional allusions to TOS, and in that respect, Enterprise was an utter failure.

 

[Irishman]

It's a good thing you weren't in charge, then, Captain.

 

[Warped9]

Captain Robert April said:
If I was in charge of the preproduction of "Enterprise", I would've kicked things off with a staff meeting with the art department and the costume designers, put up a slide of a still from "The Cage" and told everyone, in no uncertain terms, that they were to forget about alluding to TNG, DS9, Voyager, the movies, even TOS, and, pointing to the picture, "THAT, boys and girls, is what we're supposed to be leading up to!"

The other shows already progressed naturally from that point onward, so all Enterprise had to worry about was be a logical predecessor to "The Cage"; the rest of the franchise would take care of itself. Instead, what we got was a prequel to TNG, with occasional allusions to TOS, and in that respect, Enterprise was an utter failure.

That's really only the tip of the iceberg, but otherwise I agree with you.

 

[Forbin]

Irishman said:
It's a good thing you weren't in charge, then, Captain.

Because what they actually did worked SO well...

 

[ancient]

Warped9 said:

Captain Robert April said:
If I was in charge of the preproduction of "Enterprise", I would've kicked things off with a staff meeting with the art department and the costume designers, put up a slide of a still from "The Cage" and told everyone, in no uncertain terms, that they were to forget about alluding to TNG, DS9, Voyager, the movies, even TOS, and, pointing to the picture, "THAT, boys and girls, is what we're supposed to be leading up to!"

The other shows already progressed naturally from that point onward, so all Enterprise had to worry about was be a logical predecessor to "The Cage"; the rest of the franchise would take care of itself. Instead, what we got was a prequel to TNG, with occasional allusions to TOS, and in that respect, Enterprise was an utter failure.

That's really only the tip of the iceberg, but otherwise I agree with you.

Yes, I second that. I'm not even an old fan, I'm fairly new (been a fan about 10 years now...) But they really screwed everything all to hell. TOS is a brilliant show, including the design work. And ENT was dull and generic when it could have been...sigh. Oh well, back to the topic at hand...

 

[Ptrope]

Forbin said:

ancient said:
Still, I wish ENT-Ent had eliminated turbolifts. Maybe one lift for disabled guests, moving injured crewmen, etc, but it would have seemed more confined and lower tech.

Agreed! Simple elevators between decks at the most; stairs at the least. The show generally blew it with making things look 100 years behind what we've seen. They made a big deal out of "doors that you have to open manually!" But they were still push-button doors that went "swiish" when they opened. I was hoping for submarine hatches.

That's why I designed Endeavour with stairways and ladders, and the only lifts (2) were in vertical tubes and used solely to get through the height of the ship - they would never move sideways.

Captain Robert April said:
If I was in charge of the preproduction of "Enterprise", I would've kicked things off with a staff meeting with the art department and the costume designers, put up a slide of a still from "The Cage" and told everyone, in no uncertain terms, that they were to forget about alluding to TNG, DS9, Voyager, the movies, even TOS, and, pointing to the picture, "THAT, boys and girls, is what we're supposed to be leading up to!"

A hearty "Here, here!" Even allowing for improvements in production design and production values, there should've been more of an effort - okay, an effort - made to establish a viable visual timeline that ended with "The Cage," or even all of TOS, IMO, rather than effectively skipping over them entirely and going straight for TNG as the 'model.' That includes awareness of the responsibility to both the fans and to the franchise, and realizing that, with the continuing decline of the franchise, they should've expended extra care and concern on 'getting it right' and not just trying to make it 'familiar.' When it became clear that their in-house designers couldn't get past their previous history, someone should've said, "This is our last chance, folks, so it's time to look outside the gene (Gene?) pool and see if someone can create something both fresh and, at the same time, appropriate." I have no doubts whatsoever that those people existed and could've designed a show that wouldn't ultimately have needed the franchise name tacked onto it in a desperate effort to remind people what it was. Of course, they'd have still been saddled with the 'writers,' but that's another story altogether.

 

[Forbin]

Ptrope said:That's why I designed Endeavour with stairways and ladders, and the only lifts (2) were in vertical tubes and used solely to get through the height of the ship - they would never move sideways.

Ditto my pre-Kirk SS Reeses. Elevators fore, mid and aft, and lotsa walking.

http://www.inpayne.com/models/kitbash/reeses_cutaway.html

 

[Ziz]

John Eaves was a guest at WonderFest a few years ago and had some very interesting stories about what it was like dealing with B&B. They suggested the idea of the Borg Sphere in First Contact. Eaves said to them "It will look like the Death Star from Star Wars." Their reply: "That's a 20 year old movie...no one remembers it."

Eaves (among other people) also came up with original designs for the NX that were more chronologically correct and B&B nixed those too, telling him "Just re-work this {Akira} design. No one will notice."

So, in regards to Ptrope's contention that they needed new blood on the production staff, that the existing people couldn't think "retro", I have a feeling they may well have been VERY able to make ENT look more chronologically correct but were more often than not overridden and told to do otherwise, as B&B seemed to have final say on everything.

But we're going off on a tangent here.

CAP - when's the next update??

 

[Forbin]

I'd LOVE to see Eaves' orginal ideas for the NX.