DC Movies - To Infinity and Beyond
- Thread starter dahj
- Start date
Leaked looks at the characters for Batman Caped Crusader animated series are floating around the 'net
Looks like pretty golden age look to the characters.
Looks like pretty golden age look to the characters.
Zack Snyder thinks that not allowing Batman to kill makes him "irrelevant".
To me this just shows a completely misunderstanding of what characters like him are supposed to represent.
To me this just shows a completely misunderstanding of what characters like him are supposed to represent.
The character did kill at various points throughout his published history, including snapping a man's neck, punching another into a vat of acid (DET. #27), so the idea of Batman deciding to kill has never been a shocker.
I don't agree with Snyder but bad these are bad examples. Burton's Batman killed with a gleeful smile.
Nolan's Batman only didn't kill by the magic of plot. The car chases he was in should have resulted in multiple deaths directly attributed to him. But somehow there's always a "it's a miracle no one was hurt" line.
I always forget that Burton's Batman killed. Nolan on the other hand is debatable, as far as I can remember, we never actually saw him kill on screen. I know there was the whole "I won't kill you, but that doesn't mean I'll save you" thing in Batman Begins, but I don't really count that.
If only Snyder was describing a hero who never kills, but he was talking about Batman, so....
I'll just say this of Snyder...I'm glad he's gone. I no longer have to care or worry about what his opinions on superheroes are.
Strange that anyone did in the first place. He makes films. See them or don't. "Caring" or "worrying" about him or his opinions? Well that's on you more than him. I enjoyed his DC work for the most part. Still didn't care about his opinion on superheroes or anything else really.
There are many versions of Batman that don't kill. There are fewer versions that do kill but they also exist. I wish people who debated this thing would focus less on using precedence as some arbiter of the "right" version of the character (an utterly pointless argument) and instead discuss *why* they think it's more entertaining if he does/doesn't kill.
(Batman might have literally more published stories than any other English language fictional character. Any wild weirdo take you can think of will have at least some precedent somewhere, frankly.)
(Batman might have literally more published stories than any other English language fictional character. Any wild weirdo take you can think of will have at least some precedent somewhere, frankly.)
I think Snyder’s Batman only began to kill after the death of Robin. I think the ultimate goal was to have him return to a place where killing was not necessary (or far rarer—not my story) at some point, though we’ll never know as the narrative remains unfinished. C’est la vie. It’s simply one take among many others. I’m not a fan of essentialism, so I don’t mind if that’s one of the takes. But I also enjoy the Adam West version, so it’s not like I think Batman must be a killer. I just like seeing more than one version.
A Batman who kills...but for some reason doesn't bother to kill The Joker.
And I never said it was on him. I am not so deluded to think my opinion matters to him one iota.
I cared or worried because he was in control of characters that I want to see presented well. Ergo, now that he no longer is in control it doesn't matter to me what his take is.
And I never said it was on him. I am not so deluded to think my opinion matters to him one iota.
By saying Batman should be a killer, Snyder is just betraying a lack of imagination. Most movie heroes have always been killers. That's why so many nonlethal superheroes become killers when they're adapted to movies -- because it's just the expected convention of the medium for heroes to kill, and the characters are forced to conform to the routine, formulaic tropes of action movies. It takes imagination and the willingness to innovate to find a different ending than "hero kills villain." To hold up the cliche as the preferred ideal is just lazy.
As always, some clutch their pearls when a character is written to do--or is percieved to act in certain way which--if anyone ever bothered to familiarize themselves with a character's history-- would not trigger said pearl-clutching.
Batman kills when necessary, and its not some latter day invention, attempt to be "edgy" or any other notion born of misapplied criticism.
Batman kills when necessary, and its not some latter day invention, attempt to be "edgy" or any other notion born of misapplied criticism.
OK, fair point, I guess movie Batmans have killed a lot more than I realized. But I guess even more than whether or not Batman kills, it's just Snyder's whole attitude and approach towards these characters that bugs me. It's like he never outgrew the teenage idea of what makes characters cool.
Now to be fair, I have really liked some of Snyder's other movies like 300, Army of the Dead, and Rebel Moon, but his approach to the DC characters just was not how I like to see these characters presented.
