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DC Cinematic Universe ( The James Gunn era)

I'm not sure I agree, since he thinks the only Batman is the Dark Knight Returns Batman, and that was not intended to be a default template for the character, but an exaggerated extreme in an alternate dystopian future. (Although many Batman comics writers made the same mistake for decades after TDKR came out.)
He is absolutely influenced by The Dark Knight Returns and you only have to glance at Affleck's Batsuit to see that, though his style of cinematography is a good match for Batman in general. Or his cinematographer's style of cinematography at least.

And honestly, I think he could've pulled more from Dark Knight Returns.

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Like maybe some of this for instance.
 
What the fuck are you even talking about? I've went on record, in this thread, as someone that likes Man of Steel.
Translation: triggered. This entire thread is a case study of obsessive hatred of a man--as stated up thread.
How did you get past the complete absence of joy and wonder?

If only MoS had actually made that point somehow. Dang!
It needed more clouds, characters winking at the audience and probably a pimp stereotype as the only black character with dialogue featured in the film.
I still want to see Brosnan and Aldis Hodge in a Justice Society movie.
Same here. The JS often outshined Black Adam.
 
He seemed to be more influenced by this one:
dkr1.jpg
Snyder is on record as misremembering this scene as showing Batman shooting a male hostage-taker "right between the eyes" after taking his machine gun, but he's wrong about the details -- the person Batman fires at is not the same person who had the machine gun, and it's a woman (or a man with long, painted nails). And she (?) certainly is not shot "right between the eyes," since her visor and forehead are clearly intact. I'm not really sure what the panel after the shot is showing, but it's generally interpreted to mean that Batman shot her in the shoulder. It's ambiguous enough that how you interpret it depends on whether you want to see Batman as a killer, and Snyder clearly does want that. But I don't think that's supported by the rest of the text of TDKR. Batman won't even kill the Joker -- the Joker snaps his own neck when Batman won't finish the job. And the GCPD officers and media pundits denouncing Batman never say he killed the hostage-taker.
 
My recollection is a but fuzzy, but I remember that the scene comes an issue after showing Batman with a rifle... that turns out to fire a rope. Then later on Batman is thankful that he has a pistol... to detonate an explosive. He uses his tank and opens fire... with rubber bullets, honest. The comic continually plays with its readers, showing a old Batman that's maybe gone too far, who has broken his rule about using guns, before giving us that panel in the last issue of him snapping the shotgun.
 
Here's a filmmaker's comparison between the Snyder Cut and the Whedon Cut. He says that both cuts have their merits - he does favor the Snyder Cut more than the Whedon Cut, but he also says that Whedon was constrained by the footage Snyder shot and a studio mandated run time that hampered the pacing and that Snyder might have turned in a better film but not necessarily a good film.​

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Maybe one day, people will realize that Warner Bros was the true villain in the DCEU’s failure all along.

Quite unlikely, as many have a dangerus obsession with blaming / hating Snyder for "raping their childhood", or some such nonsensical blather.


Wonder Woman 1 was a success and positively received. Snyder worked on the story and executive produced it.

Ahhh, but notice how the usual suspects constantly attempt to separate Snyder from Wonder Woman's success, when all production details point to the film never going forward to the point enjoyed by millions without him. Nope it was all the director...until...


WW84 was all Patty Jenkins. From the story, directing and reception. Wonder Woman 3 was cancelled after WW84 flopped.

Indeed. Jenkins was on record repeatedly selling WW84 as being all under her control (IOW, unlike the first film with Snyder's direct input, guidance, etc.), and it was a disaster.


Suicide Squad 1 was a success financially. It even won WB an Academy Award for best Make-Up and Hairstyling. Thanks to Killer Croc, Harley and Joker. Snyder worked on that film as well. As it was more closely tied to his version of JL, before the execs at WB had it cut and edited to resemble Deadpool 1. Which also released that year.

Quite true.

James Gunn’s sequel was a box office bomb. A bomb so bad that even though Gunn is the head of DCU studios now. Gunn has said there are no plans to do another Suicide Squad film. Best we’ll get is Creature Commandos and Peacemaker season 2.

Once again, that was another example of the idiotic attempt to MCU-ise the DCEU (previously with the theatrical cut of JL) resulted in box-office catastrophe. The lesson here is that moving away from the Snyder influence over the DCEU was assbrained and creatively bankrupt.


Aquaman 1 was a high success. The only billion dollar gross in the DCEU, and the last movie Snyder had anything to do with before he was fired. What did WB decide to do to capitalize on this film’s success? Wait 5 years to release a sequel and tell the whole world the film didn’t matter to the rebooted universe going forward; before it hit theaters. Aquaman 2 was a financial disappointment but there are worse performing films out there.

Like the predictability of the sun rising, WB constantly made moronic decisions all on their own, when the Snyder-helmed DCEU was the exact creative direction the franchise needed to maintain.


Such as Shazam 1 and Shazam 2. Shazam 1 never had any thunder. Released between Captain Marvel and Avengers Endgame. The first movie was a modest hit. The second movie was a disaster. Losing money big time compared to the first film (a recurring pattern of DCEU films) and losing to Sonic the Hedgehog 2.

Ah, but if you recall, the Hate-Snyder obsessives squealed in joy over Shazam being the a silly, MCU-styled movie--the direction they wanted for all DCEU movies. The moviegoing audience did not agree.


Let’s talk about The Flash. A film James Gunn called one of the best comic book movies ever made. This was before he was officially the head the DCU. Gotta tow the company line. Outside of being stuck in development hell for years. Ezra Miller’s antics and criminal activity, put promoting this film in a real tough spot.The film was yet another box office bomb for the DCEU. As well as, being another character Gunn has said there are no plans to do a new movie for in the DCU.

A Snyder-free disaster heavily manipulated (much like Aquaman 2 to effectively kill all that had been built by the earlier, successful DCEU films, once again proving that the DCEU was a sinking ship without the right captain.

Hamada’s other ideas for CBM included:
A Wonder Twins movie. Pre-production was cancelled early because they thought it was too niche. Ya think?

Honestly, who on the face of the earth asked for a movie based off of a beaten-into-the-ground Hanna-Barbera gimmick from the Super Friends cartoon? No one.


JJ Abrams’ Black Superman movie with Ta Nehisi Coates. Announced back in 2019. This film still has not officially been cancelled but we all know it’s not happening.

It would seem so.

Lastly, we can talk about Justice League. Theatrical and Director’s cut. WB lied and denied that there was different version of the film we got in theaters for years. When the world did see Zack Snyder’s Justice League, it was met with critic approval and fan approval.

Forever punctuating not only his story arc for the DCEU, but ZSJL's success could not have been a better way to illustrate how everything outside of Snyder's direct guidance was a crushing failure.

ZSJL also came out at a unique time for cbms. In 2021, there were 3 Justice League type properties released. Mark Millar’s Jupiter’s Leagcy on Netflix, the Eternals by the MCU and ZSJL by HBOMax. Eternals and Jupiter’s Leagcy were both rotten with critics. Eternals was also a box office bomb for Marvel. Only WB had access to the genuine article. Only WB had the Real McCoy. And they did nothing to capitalize on that moment. Not saying that Zack Snyder needed to comeback, but there was life in the direction WB had abandoned to pursue their scattershot approach. People wanted Avengers level ensembles. People wanted to see the A-Listers they were familiar with. Instead we got the series of niche movies nobody asked for.

Next to Sony and their Spider-Man-Less Spider-Man movies. No other studio has dropped the ball as hard as WB has. Zack Snyder has been gone from WB since March 2017. Nearly 8 years now. I don’t think you can blame him for anything that happened after he left. It was all WB and they made the wrong call at every turn.

Insightful, but it still does not stop disinformation-dealing, history-challenged Snyder-haters such as Michael French (host of the YouTube channel Retroblasting) from going on rants/whine-a-thons. Very history challenged.
 
They weren't going to be immature and goofy, they were making grown-up movies for adults that took the setting seriously!
And boy, did some fans latch onto that narrative with the tenacity of a snapping turtle.

There's not actually anything more meaningfully adult about the early DCEU than most other superhero movies, just uglier violence, fewer jokes, and less lighting.
 
And here is another interpretation of the events that led to Snyder being removed from Justice League.

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I actually do like Snyder in general, I enjoyed Army of the Dead and the PG-13 cuts of the Rebel Moon movies, but I do think his style was a bad fit for traditional superhoes like Superman.
Honestly, he strikes me as one of those people who's idea what's cool is stuck in the mentality of a 14 year old, everything has to be dark, and gritty, and as violent as possible.
 
I liked Watchmen a bit. It wasn't great. I understood the need to change the climax substantially.

Okay, on to important stuff (this topic being about the James Gunn era, after all): Theory A about Princess Ilana is shot down.

Ain't Clayface.
 
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I actually do like Snyder in general
I don't like anything he's made in the last ten years, but I enjoyed most of what he made before that. The Dawn remake he did with Gunn, 300, Watchmen...heck, I even quite like Sucker Punch and I'm not ashamed to admit it. But only the director's cut. The theatrical cut annoys me so much.

Snyder is like Michael Bay to me. I don't know if they make worse movies now than they used to or if I just lost the part of me that can stand their worst impulses. But I liked a chunk of their filmography up to a certain point and then not so much afterwards.
 
Watchmen was really good, far better than I expected judging from how the earlier attempts to adapt it went. Snyder added some of his own style to it, glorifying the violence a bit, but he chose to do what others wouldn't and stay faithful to the source material, and he actually pulled it off.

I think part of the problem with his newer films is that he stopped using critically-acclaimed comics as a blueprint, and he's not quite as talented a writer as Frank Miller and Alan Moore.
 
Watchmen was really good, far better than I expected judging from how the earlier attempts to adapt it went. Snyder added some of his own style to it, glorifying the violence a bit, but he chose to do what others wouldn't and stay faithful to the source material, and he actually pulled it off.

I think part of the problem with his newer films is that he stopped using critically-acclaimed comics as a blueprint, and he's not quite as talented a writer as Frank Miller and Alan Moore.
Where there adaptations before Snyder?
 
Where there adaptations before Snyder?
No, nothing filmed. But it was stuck in development hell for two decades and from what I recall, everyone who produced a script always added some new twist. Like the script written in the 80s ended with the heroes getting transported to our reality.
 
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