Dating Picard

[Christopher]

Interestingly enough, and something I just learned about, is that there is a deleted scene from A New Hope that mentions Vader being a Sith Lord sent by the Emperor. Obviously not conveyed in the film, but it seems Vader as just Tarkin's enforcer was not the original intention:

Oh, good grief, YouTube videos. It talks as though it's some big shocking discovery that the term "Sith Lord" was established in the original film, but it's in both the novelization and the Marvel Comics adaptation, both of which came out before the film was even in theaters. That scene is only "rare" to people who don't read. (The name Palpatine is established in the novel's prologue as well.)

Of course, what "Sith Lord" meant would not be established until the prequels. At the time, it was just an undefined sinister-sounding title like "Grand Moff." So just saying Vader was sent by the Emperor doesn't mean he was the Emperor's second-in-command; he could've been more like an enforcer, like a feudal daimyo sending a samurai to deal with a problem. Vader's helmet is blatantly inspired by a samurai kabuto, and samurai often went masked as well, so that's a credible analogy.

 

[fireproof78]

Of course, what "Sith Lord" meant would not be established until the prequels. At the time, it was just an undefined sinister-sounding title like "Grand Moff." So just saying Vader was sent by the Emperor doesn't mean he was the Emperor's second-in-command; he could've been more like an enforcer, like a feudal daimyo sending a samurai to deal with a problem. Vader's helmet is blatantly inspired by a samurai kabuto, and samurai often went masked as well, so that's a credible analogy.

Right, and I wasn't saying he was the Emperor's second in command. Only that his role at a different idea as part of the Emperor's command structure rather than just Tarkin's lackey.

But, it's not clear in the clip. I just found it interesting is all.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled Picard discussion, already in progress.

 

[Christopher]

Right, and I wasn't saying he was the Emperor's second in command. Only that his role at a different idea as part of the Emperor's command structure rather than just Tarkin's lackey.

Well, if Tarkin was a governor, it seems plausible that the Emperor sent him as well. Perhaps the idea was that Grand Moffs are served by Sith Lords. The terms were so undefined that they could've meant any number of things, aside from what the later movies have conditioned us to assume.

But yes, we're well off-topic here.

 

[Tosk]

If you want to go there, the more glaring issue is that Artoo shows no reaction

Artoo knows how to play it cool. But even so, he almost gave the game away. It's only because Luke didn't really know him yet that he didn't catch his obvious tells.

 

[Ronin'sCreamyCandle]

It's very telling that a thread talking of Picard's dating has gone off the rails to talk about Star Wars.

 

[Tosk]

Threads go off the rails all the time. Telling in what way?

 

[Christopher]

It's very telling that a thread talking of Picard's dating has gone off the rails to talk about Star Wars.

Not really. The thread had been dormant for a while, so there wasn't much else to say on that topic, leaving an opening for digression. Like Tosk said, it happens all the time.

 

[somebuddyX]

Interestingly enough, and something I just learned about, is that there is a deleted scene from A New Hope that mentions Vader being a Sith Lord sent by the Emperor. Obviously not conveyed in the film, but it seems Vader as just Tarkin's enforcer was not the original intention:

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

Hey, have you ever read "The Star Wars" comic by J. W. Rinzler? https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/The_Star_Wars
It's based on the original draft/concept for the first film and is pretty wild. Kinda a Star Wars Elseworlds. It has a dude called Darth Vader who is just a general and there is a separate Sith Knight who is like a foil to the good guys. It's my favourite Star Wars comic.

 

[Campe]

But they said last week that Frontier Day is only hours away

They’ve been saying Frontier Day was “hours away” since episode 6 or 7. (I think it was referenced as 48 hours away in 6 and merely “hours away” in 7, and repeated in 8.) Which is a problem I have with this season — no sense of urgency.

 

[Tuskin38]

Well, episode 9 clears this up

 

[Christopher]

Well, episode 9 clears this up

It locks down the date explicitly as 250 years after NX-01's launch, yes, but that only creates more problems. I mean, last season was explicitly said to be the end of the 2401 harvest season in LaBarre, which would be October 2401, but this season is in April 2401? And how can Jack be 24-25 if he was conceived after Nemesis in 2379, as he must have been, since Beverly left permanently as soon as she discovered she was pregnant? None of the timing this season makes any damn sense.

I mean, at least my conjecture that it was written to take place several years later but retconned back to 2401 in post-production for some reason would've accounted for the inconsistencies. If it really was planned as 2401 during production, then it makes the internal contradictions inexplicable.

 

[Tomalak]

I think you just have to accept some scripting errors.

Perhaps it's a tribute to Khan saying his reign was 200 years ago.

 

[Christopher]

I think you just have to accept some scripting errors.

But it's just so strange. There are just so many things that consistently suggest a later setting, which is why it seemed likely that that was the original intention. If they're just mistakes, why are they so consistent with each other?

 

[Tomalak]

No, I'm saying I agree it was probably originally set later, then they changed it during pre-production for some reason but didn't fix everything to bring it into line. Some things slipped through.

 

[Christopher]

No, I'm saying I agree it was probably originally set later, then they changed it during pre-production for some reason but didn't fix everything to bring it into line. Some things slipped through.

Even so, my response is the same: if that were the case, it's hard to believe so many mistakes would have slipped through and that they'd be so consistent with each other. No matter how you slice it, it's just very strange and sloppy.

 

[Tuskin38]

Picard says it's been 35 years since he was assimilated, which lines up with 2366.

 

[Christopher]

Picard says it's been 35 years since he was assimilated, which lines up with 2366.

Yeah, I caught that too, but later dialogue made it even more explicit.

 

[Jarvisimo]

It also would have been nice to imagine Picard and Laris had most of ten years together - that would have given Season 2's emotional thrust much more impact.

The season also seems to suggest Picard was much more social during his twenty years in isolation that season 1 presented, which is a shame - that talk to cadets feels more like something after season 1 than before it.

One can go on and on, but it feels like he would have spent the years following S1 reconnecting with his friends than not. Although some jokes in the season undercut even that - such as not recognising Ensign Laforge (but having spoken with her father).

Anyway, it's a mess of a season in terms of concrete plotting in many ways, the date quibbles are a small part of that

 

[Christopher]

Every season of Picard feels like it's in a different universe from the other seasons, even the parts of season 2 that are supposed to be in the same universe.

 

[Yistaan]

not recognising Ensign Laforge (but having spoken with her father).

That was sort of clarified when it was established that Sidney was barely on speaking terms with Geordi in recent years.