Could Equinox have turned Voyager around?

[Riley]

I mean in terms of the show, not the titular ship's voyage.

I know it's been discussed here and there over the years, but Ron Moore has said that he wanted to explore concepts on BSG that he wasn't allowed to on Voyager. I have always thought about this and how retaining not just the crew but also the Equinox herself might have helped the show become something other than the dull TNG clone it ultimately is.

Ransom would have to go for sure, but keeping the Equinox around would have created a ton of new narrative possibilities. Let's say Janeway assigns Chakotay to take command of Equinox and he chooses Voyager crew members to join him. Who does he take? How does their absence affect Voyager and its command staff? Is Tuvok Janeway's new XO? Does Chakotay take Harry with him and perhaps puts in a word for a promotion?

There wouldn't be any issues with sets for two ships since DS9 went off the air as the first episode of the Equinox two-parter aired. Two ships would have expanded the series' potential and maybe would have ultimately helped it to develop its own identity instead of what it became in the end.

 

[Oddish]

Let's say Janeway assigns Chakotay to take command of Equinox and he chooses Voyager crew members to join him. Who does he take?

Probably B'Elanna, because he'll need her creativity to get the engines repaired. And Neelix, because with the replicators down, they'll need a cook more. Harry's a toss-up... his abilities at building and design would be useful on Equinox, but Janeway might want to keep him around.

How does their absence affect Voyager and its command staff?

Not too much. Carey can take over engineering, and Tuvok as acting first officer, with Ayala as security chief. Any redshirt can take over for Harry.

Does Chakotay take Harry with him and perhaps puts in a word for a promotion?

Given that the second ship will juice the command structure, Harry could get promoted either way.

 

[Dukhat]

I mean in terms of the show, not the titular ship's voyage.

I know it's been discussed here and there over the years, but Ron Moore has said that he wanted to explore concepts on BSG that he wasn't allowed to on Voyager. I have always thought about this and how retaining not just the crew but also the Equinox herself might have helped the show become something other than the dull TNG clone it ultimately is.

Ransom would have to go for sure, but keeping the Equinox around would have created a ton of new narrative possibilities. Let's say Janeway assigns Chakotay to take command of Equinox and he chooses Voyager crew members to join him. Who does he take? How does their absence affect Voyager and its command staff? Is Tuvok Janeway's new XO? Does Chakotay take Harry with him and perhaps puts in a word for a promotion?

There wouldn't be any issues with sets for two ships since DS9 went off the air as the first episode of the Equinox two-parter aired. Two ships would have expanded the series' potential and maybe would have ultimately helped it to develop its own identity instead of what it became in the end.

Wasn't Ron Moore already gone by the time Equinox premiered?

Berman and Braga were just UPN's bitches, and UPN didn't want anything like a gritty serialized story arc. They just wanted an episodic show that anyone could pop into in any season and not be confused by what's going on. In effect, a show that gets reset back to the status quo after every episode. Which was why there were never any long-lasting effects from the ship getting blown to bits every episode, or how many shuttles or torpedoes they lost, or any problems with power consumption, food, water, or any kind of danger at all.

So no, Equinox would not have changed the show in any way.

 

[Oddish]

So no, Equinox would not have changed the show in any way.

Indeed, it didn't. Voyager absorbed five new crew, and they were instantly forgotten.

Equinox was just one of many opportunities for it to become a more interesting show... and like all the others, it was passed up. They couldn't even handle naming the Doctor, promoting Kim, or explaining where those extra 57 torpedoes came from. So forget about adding in another ship.

 

[FredH]

Let's say Janeway assigns Chakotay to take command of Equinox and he chooses Voyager crew members to join him. Who does he take? How does their absence affect Voyager and its command staff? Is Tuvok Janeway's new XO?

I always thought it was a shame we didn’t get much more of Janeway’s relationship to Tuvok. The implication early in the series as aired was that they were, or had been, Kirk/Spock close — and that seemed to be immediately shunted aside by the Janeway/Chakotay dynamic. Separating them as you say might have allowed that to come back a bit, or else to deal with how it had changed.

 

[The Wormhole]

UPN wouldn't have gone for it, so it's a moot point anyway. Besides, when Ron Moore got the chance to do his own variation of the story on BSG, he only kept the Pegasus around for approximately a dozen episodes or so anyway. So if the Equinox had stayed beyond the two parter, it likely would have still been gone by the middle of S6 anyway.

 

[Riley]

Wasn't Ron Moore already gone by the time Equinox premiered?

Berman and Braga were just UPN's bitches, and UPN didn't want anything like a gritty serialized story arc. They just wanted an episodic show that anyone could pop into in any season and not be confused by what's going on. In effect, a show that gets reset back to the status quo after every episode. Which was why there were never any long-lasting effects from the ship getting blown to bits every episode, or how many shuttles or torpedoes they lost, or any problems with power consumption, food, water, or any kind of danger at all.

So no, Equinox would not have changed the show in any way.

Memory Alpha states that "Equinox Part One" was the last story he was involved with before leaving the show and suggests that his frustration with the show had to do with how the episode was written.

 

[Dukhat]

Memory Alpha states that "Equinox Part One" was the last story he was involved with before leaving the show and suggests that his frustration with the show had to do with how the episode was written.

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Oddish]

Given how frustrating VOY is to the Trekkies, it's easy to see how it would frustrate the writers.

 

[Anwar]

Well, anytime Moore made "big changes" to thing in NuBSG he almost always chickened out and reset things anyways. If he'd stayed and Equinox stayed, it would've been destroyed eventually too.

 

[Starflight]

I'm never sure why people want Voyager to have "gritty arcs", the whole appeal of the show is that it's a mostly-lighthearted vehicle for whatever kind of big science fiction idea or exciting adventure a writer might want to tell, same as TOS, except with the hook of being in a distant region of space with none of the usual "let's call Starfleet command" or "this story takes place on a starbase/colony" stuff.

Might be an unpopular view but, especially nowadays when we're drowning in long-running story arcs and gloomy overly-serious fiction, I'm incredibly relieved that Voyager held out against the turning tide and gave us seven more seasons of amiable, imaginative Star Trek. That's not to say that you couldn't do more with the premise and open up new narrative avenues, but I'm glad Moore didn't get his way, especially since I'm not a fan of nuBSG at all.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Considering the OP presented this as a "what if" and not a "why not" I thought I'd get into the spirit of the thing. @Oddish has a couple of good suggestions.

I could picture Equinox sticking around for one season - or at least half - and destroyed by the climax of the story. The background arc could explore the ramifications to splitting the crew and then sending Voyager off course and lost and the Equinox crew - only commanded by Chakotay but still operated by the original crew - rebelling and not wanting to waste time searching that they could be using to get home (I forget how many original Equinox crew were left alive, but they could have changed that for the purposes of this exercise). Chakotay and B'Lanna begin thinking like Maqui again in order to survive and try to make things work. They gain control but at a compromise to their ideals.

Obviously the budget would have to allow new semi-regulars to the show for a bit and some time could be split between the two ships, giving some of the leads time off.

In the end, Voyager is reunited, Equinox is destroyed, some of their crew come over and Chakotay, etc have to settle back into their old roles but there's a bit of a shift. Janeway and Chakotay don't mesh like they used to as Chakotay isn't as willing to just get back to the starfleet way of thinking. Eventually, he and Janeway meet in the middle and things are a little different going forward.

This arc would give Beltran less time to sit around and bitch and more time doing some interesting bits of business.

Meanwhile, in Real Life, UPN was like "nah we want warm milk and flat Papsi."

 

[somebuddyX]

I think RDM was kidding himself if he thought he could change the show. He was coming in off DS9's multi episode arc, not to mention the semi-serialisation threaded through the show from the beginning. Did Voyager even want to change? Did the other guys even think there was anything wrong with the show? This wasn't a situation where the show needed a retool and someone is brought in to fix things. This was Ron thinking he knew best. I would have loved it for it to have worked out and he stayed but I think it was always going to go that way. And thank god, because I think we got better content overall because of it.

 

[Anwar]

I mean, right from the start the show kind of showed it wasn't thinking it's own premise through.

It had the crew almost all be folks from the Alpha Quadrant, when most of the crew should have been Delta Quadrant aliens instead of just Neelix. That way you'd have a hook for making the Delta Quadrant more of an actual place and not just empty areas of space Voyager was coasting through. Internal connections to it via most of the crew being its inhabitants.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

@Anwar you mean either replace the Val Jean with an alien DQ adversary, or add a third alien ship to Voyager and the Maquis (a rogue trader ship with multiple alien species crew) Then it wouldn't just be a matter of different opinions, which can and were smoothed over in nothing flat, but new species entirely.

 

[Anwar]

@Anwar you mean either replace the Val Jean with an alien DQ adversary, or add a third alien ship to Voyager and the Maquis (a rogue trader ship with multiple alien species crew) Then it wouldn't just be a matter of different opinions, which can and were smoothed over in nothing flat, but new species entirely.

I was thinking more that instead of Voyager being a Starfleet ship, it should've been some alien ship they got from the Caretaker that he had on the Array before he died and that he had been keeping several DQ Species on the Array with him who all escaped when he died and the Array was destroyed.

So the crew would really be a hodgepodge of several DQ species mixed with a few Starfleeters trying to organize themselves into something resembling a crew and not used the Maquis at all.

 

[Blip]

I was thinking more that instead of Voyager being a Starfleet ship, it should've been some alien ship they got from the Caretaker that he had on the Array before he died and that he had been keeping several DQ Species on the Array with him who all escaped when he died and the Array was destroyed.

So the crew would really be a hodgepodge of several DQ species mixed with a few Starfleeters trying to organize themselves into something resembling a crew and not used the Maquis at all.

Sounds interesting, albeit maybe a little too reminiscent of the scenario DS9's personnel started off in? (imo)

 

[Anwar]

Sounds interesting, albeit maybe a little too reminiscent of the scenario DS9's personnel started off in? (imo)

I just figured, if they were going to send them to a faraway place like the Delta Quadrant, they may as well have more native DQ characters in the crew to have a proper connection to the Delta Quadrant to start with. Neelix and Kes aren't enough.

 

[Blip]

Since this is a what-if scenario, afaic the whims of RDM, UPN, and B&B are irrelevant.

Had Equinox been spared, say, if Randy had sacrificed himself for ship and crew? IMO they should have faced an uphill struggle to restore her and Voyager to a semi-spaceworthy* state. Maybe they'd later down the line have to rescue survivors from an alien caravan of refugees at some point, and conveniently some of those could stay to bump the crew count up a little - plus it wouldn't hurt to have some non-Starfleet figures milling about, and drive new character interactions and story opportunities.

As far as personnel transfers, obviously Chuck would be the logical choice to take command; hopefully discarding some of that excess cardboard in the process... Would Equinox's EMH be recoverable and/or salvageable, or would they duplicate Voyager's using a backup module? (if so I imagine 'our' Doctor would ask that his new duplicate be wiped and allowed to begin his own journey of self discovery...) Kim could be a strong contender for transfer and promotion (we got a glimpse of how much more Garrett Wang could do in Timeless, I say give him more of that). I'd let Carey take on Equinox's engines if he were still alive, but I guess Vorik will have to do I imagine Neelix would prefer to stay on Voyager with the Wildmans, but Chell might be a decent chef for Equinox... And Icheb might ask to transfer, believing he could learn from and offer more to that ship, than Voyager.



*I say "semi-spaceworthy" because I'm someone who feels that Voyager should have shown the wear and tear she was due after seven years in the DQ. To anyone dismissing that as making the show "too gritty" I ask that you try not to conflate a show's production design and storylines with characterisation. Trek's characters are largely aspirational; nuBSG's were largely.. not.

 

[Blip]

I just figured, if they were going to send them to a faraway place like the Delta Quadrant, they may as well have more native DQ characters in the crew to have a proper connection to the Delta Quadrant to start with. Neelix and Kes aren't enough.

I definitely agree with you there! They really needed more interaction with non-AQ characters. Not only were Neelix and Kes not enough, but they were (admittedly somewhat understandably) very underutilised. That's why I think taking on refugee characters post-Equinox might have helped.