Cobra Kai - The Karate Kid Saga Continues
- Thread starter Trekker4747
- Start date
How in the....they did it. They actually made season 2 better than season 1. I am at a loss with this show, I really am. It has no right to be THIS GOOD. Season 2 raises the stakes, mines some surprising emotional depth, and ends on a real shocker. There's genuine comedy in there too, with more of the same teen issues, but they pulled out all the stops this time. They really did.
One of the best shows on TV is on YouTube. And I said it earlier in the thread...they're making Lucasfilm look like Keystone Kops. THIS is how you revive a franchise, respect legacy characters, introduce and DEVELOP new characters, and push a property in new directions. I don't know where they go from here with the ending, but I'm all in. Roll on season 3!
One of the best shows on TV is on YouTube. And I said it earlier in the thread...they're making Lucasfilm look like Keystone Kops. THIS is how you revive a franchise, respect legacy characters, introduce and DEVELOP new characters, and push a property in new directions. I don't know where they go from here with the ending, but I'm all in. Roll on season 3!
Ive not dove into it yet, not sure when I will get a chance, but this is encouraging to hear.
3 episodes in. Loving it. The worst part is that at the rate I'm going, I'll be done some point tomorrow, and will have to wait yet another year for more.
Spoiler free--the first episode started pretty awesome. The next two were kind of like this week's Game of Thrones--less action, but clearly setting up for more cool stuff.
They really know what they are doing, and I look forward to more.
Spoiler free--the first episode started pretty awesome. The next two were kind of like this week's Game of Thrones--less action, but clearly setting up for more cool stuff.
They really know what they are doing, and I look forward to more.
I was worried that having Kreese would be corny, but they really mine it for good storytelling. By episode 5, shit gets real. By episodes 9 and 10, stuff is spinning out of control and they really emphasize the moral grey areas.
The usual skewering of PC culture that I love about the show, but also showing that you have to still be careful with your behavior. I thought the theme of season 2 would revolve around the balance between Cobra Kai and Miyagi Do. As it turns out...it's more complicated than that. And that's what makes the show so good. Nothing is clear cut. People make mistakes. Things spiral out of control despite your best intentions.
The Game if Thrones references made me cringe, though. But that's all. 9/10 overall for me. Awesome season. I have no idea where they're going after that finale but I'm here for it.
The usual skewering of PC culture that I love about the show, but also showing that you have to still be careful with your behavior. I thought the theme of season 2 would revolve around the balance between Cobra Kai and Miyagi Do. As it turns out...it's more complicated than that. And that's what makes the show so good. Nothing is clear cut. People make mistakes. Things spiral out of control despite your best intentions.
The Game if Thrones references made me cringe, though. But that's all. 9/10 overall for me. Awesome season. I have no idea where they're going after that finale but I'm here for it.
I've finished, and I'm a bit frustrated. First, I'm frustrated that I'm going to have to wait a year for this incredible show to come back. Second, I'm frustrated because though this is a Cobra Kai thread, and though the show has been released, I really want to talk about everything, but I'm not sure how much time we should give for people to avoid spoilers. Third, I'm frustrated because William Zabka deserves an Emmy for this performance, and likely will not get one.
What an amazing day yesterday plowing through this.
This show is in my opinion, realistic in many ways and one of those ways is that everyone is flawed. Even Sam. There's no real defined good guys and bad guys.
Characters that were in the original movies have grown. I would say the only purely good guy in this series is Miyagi, and of course, he's a ghost.
I wonder how he would have been written had Pat Morita been alive and willing to do this.
I can't wait to see where they go from here. I'd love to see more of Kreese, and more of the aftermath of Episode 6.
I always liked Johnny, even in the first movie. Miyagi had him pegged. He was not a bad person at all, but had a bad teacher. Even from the moment we met him we saw that he recognized that he wasn't a great person before he met Daniel, but wanted to change. It was Daniel that set him off.
Johnny was very humanized this season, even more so than in season 1. His faults were not so over the top that he couldn't exist in the real world. In many ways, he's stuck in a bubble, yet he shows willingness to adapt.
I wonder how much time will pass between Seasons 2-3.
What an amazing day yesterday plowing through this.
This show is in my opinion, realistic in many ways and one of those ways is that everyone is flawed. Even Sam. There's no real defined good guys and bad guys.
Characters that were in the original movies have grown. I would say the only purely good guy in this series is Miyagi, and of course, he's a ghost.
I wonder how he would have been written had Pat Morita been alive and willing to do this.
I can't wait to see where they go from here. I'd love to see more of Kreese, and more of the aftermath of Episode 6.
I always liked Johnny, even in the first movie. Miyagi had him pegged. He was not a bad person at all, but had a bad teacher. Even from the moment we met him we saw that he recognized that he wasn't a great person before he met Daniel, but wanted to change. It was Daniel that set him off.
Johnny was very humanized this season, even more so than in season 1. His faults were not so over the top that he couldn't exist in the real world. In many ways, he's stuck in a bubble, yet he shows willingness to adapt.
I wonder how much time will pass between Seasons 2-3.
I agree, Zabka needs an Emmy nomination for this year. And I still can't get over that ending. If the time through season 1-2 was days to months (May through the Summer), there needs to be something of a time jump to season 3.
But this show....this show. What they have done is simply awesome, and I literally can't wait to see where it goes. Both Johnny and Daniel had no clue things would go so far. Neither did I.
It balances comedy and drama so well. And so many of the emotions are real and believable. ESPECIALLY the kids. People in this show are truly multi-dimensional, and it exists in the grey area. People in this show screw up. They fail. There's bad qualities in even the goody goody characters...and I love that about it. And it portrays teens as emotionally conflicted people...because that's what teens ARE.
This, and the overall themes of "balance" and redemption, and the struggle to do good...this is why people need to watch it. Teens especially. I kind of wish it was on a network or got some kind of wide recognition.
But this show....this show. What they have done is simply awesome, and I literally can't wait to see where it goes. Both Johnny and Daniel had no clue things would go so far. Neither did I.
It balances comedy and drama so well. And so many of the emotions are real and believable. ESPECIALLY the kids. People in this show are truly multi-dimensional, and it exists in the grey area. People in this show screw up. They fail. There's bad qualities in even the goody goody characters...and I love that about it. And it portrays teens as emotionally conflicted people...because that's what teens ARE.
This, and the overall themes of "balance" and redemption, and the struggle to do good...this is why people need to watch it. Teens especially. I kind of wish it was on a network or got some kind of wide recognition.
It's insane, right? It shouldn't be this good, but it is.
To do THAT FIGHT... on what must be a TINY budget... is INSANE. And to do what they did to Miguel takes balls.
All right--
it's clear that the more of us that watch the show, the more of us are itching to talk about it, but everyone seems to be respecting spoilers because none of us want to ruin it for people who haven't seen it.
I'm not a moderator, and I don't know how often a moderator reads the thread, but the question is this--do we talk here, or start a thread that has spoilers in the title, so we can just talk freely?
Nonspoiler point--I haven't seen too many negative comments on this show. I have a few constructive thoughts, though again--this show was a homerun.
it's clear that the more of us that watch the show, the more of us are itching to talk about it, but everyone seems to be respecting spoilers because none of us want to ruin it for people who haven't seen it.
I'm not a moderator, and I don't know how often a moderator reads the thread, but the question is this--do we talk here, or start a thread that has spoilers in the title, so we can just talk freely?
Nonspoiler point--I haven't seen too many negative comments on this show. I have a few constructive thoughts, though again--this show was a homerun.
It seems like there's only a few of us, so I say go for it, but the final word I think should be Trekker4747, since they are the originator of the thread.
Yeah...that fight was insane. 10 minutes of balls-to-the-wall. I loved the choreography and the use of tracking shots. And though some people might roll their eyes at that happening in a school...it DOES happen at times. It happened at a school near me back in February I believe. There was a massive fight that filled the entire lunch room and spilled out into the hallway. People even jumped off tables into the fray, etc. They called the cops because the security guards were overwhelmed.
As for Miguel, I was shocked they actually did that. I think he'll be back for season 3, but if he has a broken back at the cervical spine (which is what I surmised because of the x-ray and that they had his neck in an Aspen collar), he won't recover for 6-7 months. And I can't imagine his mom ever letting him fight again. So where will they go from here?
I think the only real path is for Johnny and Daniel to somehow join up to take down Kreese. But how they get to that point will be interesting.
As for Miguel, I was shocked they actually did that. I think he'll be back for season 3, but if he has a broken back at the cervical spine (which is what I surmised because of the x-ray and that they had his neck in an Aspen collar), he won't recover for 6-7 months. And I can't imagine his mom ever letting him fight again. So where will they go from here?
I think the only real path is for Johnny and Daniel to somehow join up to take down Kreese. But how they get to that point will be interesting.
And I would LOVE that. I love the scenes in both seasons where Johnny and Daniel grudgingly start getting along. A big question will be what will happen with Robby. A) Striking out in anger like that when his opponent has backed off is bad enough without B) The guilt of knowing he broke Miguel's back. And C) will there be legal consequences?
I LOVED the scene with Dimitri vs Hawk, where everything finally clicked, the way Daniel told him it would. And who would have thought at the beginning of season 1 that ELI would become a primary antagonist?!? God I love this show.
I LOVED the scene with Dimitri vs Hawk, where everything finally clicked, the way Daniel told him it would. And who would have thought at the beginning of season 1 that ELI would become a primary antagonist?!? God I love this show.
Some thoughts: For me, episodes 5, 6, and 10 were my favorites.
I loved fleshing out Kreese again, but in the end, he takes over the dojo.
I have tons of thoughts, but lets go through the fight.
First--Tory would likely end up arrested. She assaulted teachers and she started the whole thing. There are a lot of charges that she likely would never be seen at that school again. There is arguably attempted murder if someone saw what she did with those spikes.
Robbie also will have plenty of legal troubles. Miguel ended the fight. He was no longer a threat, which means that self defense goes out the window. Interestingly enough, I think Robbie would end up in less legal trouble than Tory. Robbie, if Miguel dies, would be on the hook for manslaughter, especially if witnesses kill his self defense claim. But maybe because he's under 18, he might still be able to get out of jail.
It will be very interesting what they do with both characters.
One thing that I found unrealistic was the length of the fight, and the idea that cops weren't swarming the school, possibly with tear gas.
Maybe the school has security cameras.
But let's ignore the nitpicking and talk more about it.
Honestly, I wish Cobra Kai did better in the fight. How many Cobra Kai actually won their matchups? Other than Miguel, who eventually paid a terrible price, did anyone?
Based on what we saw, I think it would have been very cool to see Demitri block a few of Hawk's attacks, but in the end, Hawk should have won. Hawk was a semifinalist in the All Valley, and Demitri was not a good karate student. While we the viewer should feel bad for Demitri, I think the show blew an opportunity here and Hawk should have won. Let's also not forget that Hawk was humiliated by Demitri.
At the end of Season 1, we saw Miguel start to turn into a jerk. What was amazing was that Johnny helped him make a course correction, and his good nature won out.
I think Miyagi would like Miguel. I also think he would see the good in Johnny much better than Daniel has.
Daniel's wife Amanda is one of my favorite characters on the show. She is always the voice of reason--but there was one exception. While I get that she was upset over what happened with Sam, Tory was coming for Sam no matter what. The fact that she is such a strong student saved her from far worse injury. Sam did everything right in that fight. She used karate for defense only. She protected herself. Imagine what happens if she didn't know what she knew--if someone came after Anthony, he'd be in a lot of trouble.
Ironic that Miguel's decision to let up--something that Miyagi would approve of, is what got him so badly hurt. Robbie didn't want that to happen, but he has to face the consequences. But in that situation, Kreese's "mercy is for the weak" strategy would have benefited Miguel. When Daniel fought for his life, he didn't let up on Chozen until he was clearly helpless. Miyagi also said he fought for his life on occasion. This brawl was far more like that than a tournament. Miguel's mistake was letting his guard down. It cost him.
I love how every character is so human. No one, not even goodie two shoes Sam, is perfect. Everyone on this show has done wrong things at one point. But no one has been purely evil except maybe Kreese and Hawk.
I loved fleshing out Kreese again, but in the end, he takes over the dojo.
I have tons of thoughts, but lets go through the fight.
First--Tory would likely end up arrested. She assaulted teachers and she started the whole thing. There are a lot of charges that she likely would never be seen at that school again. There is arguably attempted murder if someone saw what she did with those spikes.
Robbie also will have plenty of legal troubles. Miguel ended the fight. He was no longer a threat, which means that self defense goes out the window. Interestingly enough, I think Robbie would end up in less legal trouble than Tory. Robbie, if Miguel dies, would be on the hook for manslaughter, especially if witnesses kill his self defense claim. But maybe because he's under 18, he might still be able to get out of jail.
It will be very interesting what they do with both characters.
One thing that I found unrealistic was the length of the fight, and the idea that cops weren't swarming the school, possibly with tear gas.
Maybe the school has security cameras.
But let's ignore the nitpicking and talk more about it.
Honestly, I wish Cobra Kai did better in the fight. How many Cobra Kai actually won their matchups? Other than Miguel, who eventually paid a terrible price, did anyone?
Based on what we saw, I think it would have been very cool to see Demitri block a few of Hawk's attacks, but in the end, Hawk should have won. Hawk was a semifinalist in the All Valley, and Demitri was not a good karate student. While we the viewer should feel bad for Demitri, I think the show blew an opportunity here and Hawk should have won. Let's also not forget that Hawk was humiliated by Demitri.
At the end of Season 1, we saw Miguel start to turn into a jerk. What was amazing was that Johnny helped him make a course correction, and his good nature won out.
I think Miyagi would like Miguel. I also think he would see the good in Johnny much better than Daniel has.
Daniel's wife Amanda is one of my favorite characters on the show. She is always the voice of reason--but there was one exception. While I get that she was upset over what happened with Sam, Tory was coming for Sam no matter what. The fact that she is such a strong student saved her from far worse injury. Sam did everything right in that fight. She used karate for defense only. She protected herself. Imagine what happens if she didn't know what she knew--if someone came after Anthony, he'd be in a lot of trouble.
Ironic that Miguel's decision to let up--something that Miyagi would approve of, is what got him so badly hurt. Robbie didn't want that to happen, but he has to face the consequences. But in that situation, Kreese's "mercy is for the weak" strategy would have benefited Miguel. When Daniel fought for his life, he didn't let up on Chozen until he was clearly helpless. Miyagi also said he fought for his life on occasion. This brawl was far more like that than a tournament. Miguel's mistake was letting his guard down. It cost him.
I love how every character is so human. No one, not even goodie two shoes Sam, is perfect. Everyone on this show has done wrong things at one point. But no one has been purely evil except maybe Kreese and Hawk.
I disagree that the fight went on too long. On the show, it was a shade under 10 minutes. The one that happened in my local area (I checked, it was February 6th) took 20 minutes to fully contain according to the news, and was only stopped after police arrived. It started in the cafeteria and spread to the hallway. There were multiple altercations which developed into a brawl. One kid was arrested and charged. The principal was pepper sprayed accidentally by the security guards, who were quickly overwhelmed. Kids took video of it and people were flying off the lunch tables into the melee, and kicking people on the ground. You also have to remember that cops have to be called, and take several minutes to get there.
On Amanda I agree...assuming Sam told her everything (which we don't know...she's a 16 year old girl after all). "Tory came after me because I kissed Miguel at the party because I was drunk. Miguel and Robbie were fighting so intensely because of me..." etc. But I'm sure the security cameras at the school will show that it was all self defense on her part. Right now Amanda is being a concerned mom, and it's a knee-jerk reaction to blame karate. Just like Miguel's mom (although Miguel's mom has more of a point. Miguel became aggressive once he saw Robbie's hands on Tory...when he initially went there to STOP an altercation between Sam and Tory).
I think the show let Demetri win because it wanted to make the point that his training finally "clicked" when he really needed it, and also to show Hawk/Eli will eventually crack. He's trying so hard to be a jerk and a badass to compensate for being made fun of, and that can only last so long. So his former best friend will be the one to (eventually) lead him back. Overall I think they made the decision to have Cobra Kai "lose" the fight because they had them win last year. But Miyagi-Do's "victory" came at the cost of Miguel breaking his back and Kreese slithering back in. Cobra Kai losing this fight gives Kreese the reasoning he needs to say Johnny's teaching sucks.
All of this is what drives the drama of the show IMO. We've seen that Johnny and Daniel can get along on their own. They find common ground. It's the KIDS that usually start the shit, and it spreads to them, when one of them (usually Daniel, sometimes Johnny) assumes the worst. All of this could be solved in an hourlong counseling session in which everyone is completely 100% honest....but where's the fun or drama in that?
I wonder if they are trying to get Elizabeth Shue back for next year, or if the thing on the phone at the very end was just tantamount to saying "Ali accepted the friend request, but it no longer matters to Johnny"
On Amanda I agree...assuming Sam told her everything (which we don't know...she's a 16 year old girl after all). "Tory came after me because I kissed Miguel at the party because I was drunk. Miguel and Robbie were fighting so intensely because of me..." etc. But I'm sure the security cameras at the school will show that it was all self defense on her part. Right now Amanda is being a concerned mom, and it's a knee-jerk reaction to blame karate. Just like Miguel's mom (although Miguel's mom has more of a point. Miguel became aggressive once he saw Robbie's hands on Tory...when he initially went there to STOP an altercation between Sam and Tory).
I think the show let Demetri win because it wanted to make the point that his training finally "clicked" when he really needed it, and also to show Hawk/Eli will eventually crack. He's trying so hard to be a jerk and a badass to compensate for being made fun of, and that can only last so long. So his former best friend will be the one to (eventually) lead him back. Overall I think they made the decision to have Cobra Kai "lose" the fight because they had them win last year. But Miyagi-Do's "victory" came at the cost of Miguel breaking his back and Kreese slithering back in. Cobra Kai losing this fight gives Kreese the reasoning he needs to say Johnny's teaching sucks.
All of this is what drives the drama of the show IMO. We've seen that Johnny and Daniel can get along on their own. They find common ground. It's the KIDS that usually start the shit, and it spreads to them, when one of them (usually Daniel, sometimes Johnny) assumes the worst. All of this could be solved in an hourlong counseling session in which everyone is completely 100% honest....but where's the fun or drama in that?
I wonder if they are trying to get Elizabeth Shue back for next year, or if the thing on the phone at the very end was just tantamount to saying "Ali accepted the friend request, but it no longer matters to Johnny"