Spoilers Clues on Picard show from Picard Countdown comic (possible spoilers)
- Thread starter Yistaan
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Not if the producers believe that returning fans would rather see the Enterprise-G in all its unknown glory than merely the -F in the canon or more of the -E. I mean, think about it: who in here wouldn’t want to see the -G? All I can think of is “those of little faith” who’d rather have PIC recreate the good-old in an OK manner than try to design its own ship and generate controversy as DSC has.
Why not?
It simply doesn't interest me
There could be an -F if the -E is in a museum. Not "in service" like some are saying, but extant. Probably too soon for a -G.
If this show were set in 2420, I wouldn't question using the Enterprise-G at all. In 2399, it feels way too soon. A story would be needed to explain what happened.
Whereas if it was the Enterprise-F in 2399 and she was new, there wouldn't really need to be a story explaining it. I'd figure they decommissioned the E because she was getting old and replaced her with the F. Pretty straightforward.
Whereas if it was the Enterprise-F in 2399 and she was new, there wouldn't really need to be a story explaining it. I'd figure they decommissioned the E because she was getting old and replaced her with the F. Pretty straightforward.
Even having an F by that point is a bit of a stretch, given what we know about the potential longevity of starships.
1701 made it 40 years, 2245-2285, A went 8, 2285 - 2293, B ? 2293 - who knows, C ??-2345, D 8 years, 2265- 2273, E 2273 - ?? Even if it's still going, it'll only be 25 years old.. Still a young buck.. Way to early to decommission.
11 aircraft carriers active, 6 over 25 years old.. Oldest is 44...
11 aircraft carriers active, 6 over 25 years old.. Oldest is 44...
One can make the argument that the stresses of spaceflight and warp speed are much more severe than those of a seafaring voyage. Also, how many of today's aircraft carriers see routine attacks by rogue enemy states? How many warships going into WWII came out in one piece?
Maybe a 25 year lifespan for a starship is pushing the statistical limits (yes, the Excelsior and Miranda classes are still in use 75 years on, but we all know that was really due to TV budget reasons).
In the AGT Future, Riker said Starfleet tried to decommission the Enterprise-D "five years ago", so that would've been in 2390. Which would've been when the D was 27 years old. So that's where I got the idea that maybe it might be believable for the Enterprise-E to be decommissioned after a quarter-century. Even though I know the future of "All Good Things" never came to pass, there might be some things in there that would stand true.
I know that in the Technical Manual it says that a Galaxy Class Starship could last up to 100 years but let's be honest, the writers and creators will never let an Enterprise actually serve that long in-universe because they always want to have a new one after a while. That and I feel like Alex Kurtzman will want his own version of a "TNG" Enterprise (for lack of a better term) after having his own version of the "TOS" Enterprise. Since Picard seems to be sticking much closer to TNG than Discovery stuck to TOS, the only real way to get a new Enterprise for Picard (even if he's not in command of it) is to actually have a new one.
Not that I'm saying the Enterprise-E couldn't still be around in the "present day" of Picard, and I wouldn't be up in arms if it did appear, but that's just my rationale why I think it might be the Enterprise-F. But I think the E-E makes more sense than the E-G, at the very least.
I know that in the Technical Manual it says that a Galaxy Class Starship could last up to 100 years but let's be honest, the writers and creators will never let an Enterprise actually serve that long in-universe because they always want to have a new one after a while. That and I feel like Alex Kurtzman will want his own version of a "TNG" Enterprise (for lack of a better term) after having his own version of the "TOS" Enterprise. Since Picard seems to be sticking much closer to TNG than Discovery stuck to TOS, the only real way to get a new Enterprise for Picard (even if he's not in command of it) is to actually have a new one.
Not that I'm saying the Enterprise-E couldn't still be around in the "present day" of Picard, and I wouldn't be up in arms if it did appear, but that's just my rationale why I think it might be the Enterprise-F. But I think the E-E makes more sense than the E-G, at the very least.
Personally, I’m not a fan of that STO design for the Ent-F, as it doesn’t look different enough to the Ent-E, at first glance. So, for me, I’d love them to create something new.
That said, since Day One of CBSAA Trek, they’ve said they want more synergy between televised Trek and literary Trek (and other mediums), so I wouldn’t be surprised to see them take existing designs from STO and other sources, even if how they use them doesn’t quite gel with STO’s own established continuity.
I agree. I think the Enterprise-F is at least another ten years away, if not more.
This whole thing reminds me, ironically, of when the Sovereign-class was first introduced. Some thought that immediately meant the end of the entire Galaxy-class. If anything, Starfleet shipbuilding policy tends to suggest it favors having a variety of different starship designs in its inventory at any given time and that they're constantly developing new ones.
They should retcon that terrible premise in the episode. The Prime Directive is about preserving the culture and not interfering in their natural evolution. It was the most asinine thing in all of Trek to make it be about not interfering regardless of the circumstances. Clearly life is precious enough that it is morally acceptable to interfere when not doing so would mean the end of an entire species or culture. The Federation has the technology to move a species to a new uninhabited planet. Not doing so was effectively sentencing them to extinction because they didn't want to have tainted races that knew of other species prior to them developing warp. By this logic, they should have went back and wiped out all pre warp species that learned of them prior to the Prime Directive. That episode basically says complex life capable of growing into an advanced race is so common and plentiful that no body should step in and save a species from a disaster when it could be done easily. Or no life is more precious than our man-made policy. How many times do we see policies and laws have unintended consequences because it is nearly impossible to write rules that consider all use cases? This episode was basically giving an injured and dying car accident victim a parking ticket because his wrecked vehicle ended up in a loading zone instead of calling 911.
I am starting to feel like the E-E is still around BUT we may see it's destruction in "The Children of Mars" as part of what makes Picard leave Starfleet, something horrid happens during the evacuation mission, and the guilt of feeling like it was your fault would weigh heavy on anyone. Just a feelin'.
My thoughts exactly. And a number of TNG characters were loss along with the E, most likely Dr Crusher (whose death would've been so devastating to Picard given they've known each other for more than four decades- from the time he commanded the Stargazer in the 2340s) and perhaps Worf or B-4 (if either one becomes captain of the E).
Losing B-4 would've looked like losing Data all over again to Picard, esp if B-4 has evolved to become more like Data a decade after 'Nemesis.' And it would've explained why Picard is so obsessed with Data's loss that he dreamt of seeing him several times as seen in the 'Picard' promos.
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Well, not really. I have a car that can cover thousands of kilometers if suitably provisioned; I still can't move even a single football team from Canada to Bolivia in time for their important game.
Picard's lone ship could not have saved a planetful of people, not even if given infinite time to do so. Possibly Starfleet could have summoned enough ships to save a significant part of the population of this primitive planet (perhaps measured in mere hundreds of millions), given enough time. But nothing at all indicates there would have been time.
The natural disaster was explicitly an unpredictable and rapidly developing one; it wasn't the reason Nikolai Rodzhenko was sent there originally, it was a calamity he noticed at timepoint X and only told Starfleet about four days before the events. Could Starfleet summon enough ships to this location in four days? Nope. It had about that much time to summon a fleet to defend Earth from doomsday in "BoBW", and failed to get more than about 40. Apparently, sending the E-D was the best they could even theoretically do.
What Picard could do was save a few individuals (15,000 is a plausible load, as per "Ensigns of Command"). And the issue is about whether he should have.
Which is probably true in the Trek context. But the actual question is whether "saving" these people would be doing them good or ill. At least one of them chose death over survival when given that choice. All the others were denied the choice initially; eventually, they would be facing that choice, realizing what had happened. How would they choose?
We don't really know why the guy who learned the truth chose to kill himself. Probably most Romulans would not act like that if told that moving would be the only way to dodge the supernova. And soon enough, we will learn whether the supernova was an unpredictable and rapidly developing disaster, or a slow-motion train wreck against which preparations could be made decades in advance. Evacuation of at least the planet Romulus would be possible under the latter circumstances. But only if the evacuees chose to cooperate, instead of chaining themselves to their homes or refusing to stop breeding etc.
Timo Saloniemi
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Well, Lets see.. the original 1701 lasted 40 years, and thats only because it was destroyed.. And that ship was put threw the ringer a lot of times.. maybe the Refit was a complete tear down to the frame, then inspecting and replacing parts from square one.
I know ships last.. depending on millage and wear and tear.. Look at the A-10, its been around for over 30 years, and was due to be retireed unless it got new wings, which it did.. So I think with proper upkeep and refits, a ship can last for awhile, maybe not 100 years, but close to 50 is reasonable to me. Even then its not front line, its like a cadet ship, or warping around doing light duty like the miranda or excellsior in Tng..
If you take a look at TOS, one with the asteroid going to hit the "Native Americans".. that was a pre warp culture, yet they still tried to deflect the asteroid.. if the Prime Directive meant ( Unless there Warp Capable.. we don't do shit.. then what was that? Now if they blow themselves up then.. hey.. them's the breaks.. but a natural catastrophe.. yeah, I think they can help, if there there and able to.. so Picard just saying "LET THEM DIE" was wrong..
I know ships last.. depending on millage and wear and tear.. Look at the A-10, its been around for over 30 years, and was due to be retireed unless it got new wings, which it did.. So I think with proper upkeep and refits, a ship can last for awhile, maybe not 100 years, but close to 50 is reasonable to me. Even then its not front line, its like a cadet ship, or warping around doing light duty like the miranda or excellsior in Tng..
If you take a look at TOS, one with the asteroid going to hit the "Native Americans".. that was a pre warp culture, yet they still tried to deflect the asteroid.. if the Prime Directive meant ( Unless there Warp Capable.. we don't do shit.. then what was that? Now if they blow themselves up then.. hey.. them's the breaks.. but a natural catastrophe.. yeah, I think they can help, if there there and able to.. so Picard just saying "LET THEM DIE" was wrong..
