CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[HMS Ark Royal]

What about this for a Star Trek line...?

"We are the lawyers. Lower your counter claim and surrender your sets. We will add your scripts and kickstarter donations to our own. Your fanbase will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile."

 

[mos6507]

They used 'Ambassador Soval' from 'Enterprise' and Gary Graham (the original actor) reprised the role. <--- !00% indefensible copyright infringement QED.

Wait a second now... Sometimes this thread really teeters into hypocritical tunnel-vision. Let's be fair here. Here's a partial list of other Trek actors who have reprised their roles for other fan-films in order of name-recognition:

George Takei (New Voyages)
Walter Koenig (New Voyages, Renegades)
Nichelle Nichols (Of Gods and Men)
Tim Russ (Renegades)
Alan Ruck (Of Gods and Men)
Michael Forest (Continues)

And if Equinox gets off the ground (I'm doubtful) you'd have the two-fer of John Savage and Gary Lockwood.

 

[oswriter]

They used 'Ambassador Soval' from 'Enterprise' and Gary Graham (the original actor) reprised the role. <--- !00% indefensible copyright infringement QED.

Wait a second now... Sometimes this thread really teeters into hypocritical tunnel-vision. Let's be fair here. Here's a partial list of other Trek actors who have reprised their roles for other fan-films in order of name-recognition:

George Takei (New Voyages)
Walter Koenig (New Voyages, Renegades)
Nichelle Nichols (Of Gods and Men)
Tim Russ (Renegades)
Alan Ruck (Of Gods and Men)
Michael Forest (Continues)

And if Equinox gets off the ground (I'm doubtful) you'd have the two-fer of John Savage and Gary Lockwood.

Yes, and all of these are cases of copyright infringement. The fact that CBS has chosen not to pursue claims against other fan films may be hypocritical, but it is within their legal rights. A copyright owner need not prosecute every violation.

 

[Squiggy]

Having Koenig play Chevov in Renegades is one thing - as he looks nothing like he did in the 60s nor did they attempt to make him look similar.

The reuse of Soval is egregious because they seemed to go out of their way to make him look as he did during the show 10 years ago. Maybe a couple more wrinkles but it's not that much of a leap to go from an episode of Enterprise to...whatever that scene was supposed to be.

 

[M'Sharak]

Psst oswriter how do I subscribe to your blog? I don't see an option on your site, thanks.

(sorry for the OT but I don't believe oswriter is accepting PMs)

He's not been here long enough yet for the PM feature to become active.

When I look at his blog, I see an RSS button in the address bar of my browser. If you can see the same thing, clicking that should allow you to subscribe.

 

[Squiggy]

They can easily pick that up by winning the lawsuit. Plus, most will end up watching Beyond anyway.

Well, yeah. And that $780,000 loss isn't even a drop in the bucket compared to what Beyond is likely to generate.

Also, since the Axanards are posting random things...feel free to use this as counter:

If you don't post that image in the FB "Star Trek - The New CBS TV Series" group I'm stealing it and posting it myself.

I can do that, you know, because I'm a big fan of yours and you really owe me for whatever success you've achieved in any sphere. Objecting to my theft would come back to bite you in the ass as my thousands of screaming fans boycott your posts.

Too late. Because I added that text to the photo, it's my own work and no one can tell me otherwise.

I also said some legal sounding words in the post that will protect me from prosecution, because the law is like magic and by typing out that you own something on Facebook, it stops Facebook from doing anything.

Sorta like how if you ask someone if they're a cop, and they are a cop, they HAVE to tell you.

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

Having Koenig play Chevov in Renegades is one thing - as he looks nothing like he did in the 60s nor did they attempt to make him look similar.

The reuse of Soval is egregious because they seemed to go out of their way to make him look as he did during the show 10 years ago. Maybe a couple more wrinkles but it's not that much of a leap to go from an episode of Enterprise to...whatever that scene was supposed to be.

I don't see the difference really.... Star Trek Actor playing their star trek role... But even if bald checkoff is enough of a change, what about Tuvok?

 

[oswriter]

Having Koenig play Chevov in Renegades is one thing - as he looks nothing like he did in the 60s nor did they attempt to make him look similar.

The reuse of Soval is egregious because they seemed to go out of their way to make him look as he did during the show 10 years ago. Maybe a couple more wrinkles but it's not that much of a leap to go from an episode of Enterprise to...whatever that scene was supposed to be.

From a copyright standpoint I'm not sure that matters. The copyright applies to the character of Chekov, for example, not how Chekov looks at a certain age, nor even as portrayed by Walter Koening.

Now where the use of Soval is "egregious," at least according to CBS and Paramount, is that it clearly establishes "Axanar" as a "derivative work"--i.e., a sequel to Enterprise and a prequel to TOS--rather than any sort of "fair use" or parody.

 

[JD]

I doubt this will have that much of an effect. I really think this is just a case of a very small group being very loud and making themselves seem like a much bigger group. I find it hard to believe that a fan film that hasn't even started production yet is going to have enough fans to even be noticed by CBS. CBS have been dealing with crazy fans since 1927, and they and Paramout have been dealing with crazy Star Trek fans since 1967, so I doubt they'll even notice the Axanar fans.

 

[Squiggy]

I imagine Soval is one of the many reasons why Axanar is getting singled out.

Yes - any reuse is a violation, but those other productions are raising a million bucks, selling coffee, and then being general dickholes about getting caught.

Sorta like how when you repost a clip of your favorite show on YouTube. It's a violation, but just doing it once or twice isn't going to get the CBS police called on you.

Make a business by reposting shows on YouTube without consent? Nope nope nope.

 

[SFC3]

They used 'Ambassador Soval' from 'Enterprise' and Gary Graham (the original actor) reprised the role. <--- !00% indefensible copyright infringement QED.

Wait a second now... Sometimes this thread really teeters into hypocritical tunnel-vision. Let's be fair here. Here's a partial list of other Trek actors who have reprised their roles for other fan-films in order of name-recognition:

George Takei (New Voyages)
Walter Koenig (New Voyages, Renegades)
Nichelle Nichols (Of Gods and Men)
Tim Russ (Renegades)
Alan Ruck (Of Gods and Men)
Michael Forest (Continues)

And if Equinox gets off the ground (I'm doubtful) you'd have the two-fer of John Savage and Gary Lockwood.

Funny you mention Equinox. Their Vimeo trailer is dead, their website is dead, and the Facebook page is all but dead. They were never a real project to begin with.

 

[steam235]

duplicate post sorry

 

[mos6507]

A copyright owner need not prosecute every violation.

I'm not saying they do, but some of what's going on here is lynch-mob mentality of playing judge, jury, and executioner. If people want to do that, focus on what makes the Axanar case unique, otherwise you're just building an argument for CBS to crush Axanar and then proceed to take down Renegades, Continues, and NV/PII, all for the sake of enforcing copyright law in its strictest possible interpretation. I can't imagine people here really want that to happen.

 

[mswood]

Why is it that the "core fanbase" is always described as people who think the JJ-films are bad and embrace "real Trek" via fan productions? I've been a Trek fan for 21 years now. And I like the JJ films. Okay, ST09 was better than STID, but I still like them, and many of the rebooted elements...and I ALSO like classic Trek! Am I not a "real fan"?

I don't think Paramount has been giving anyone the middle finger. They rested the franchise after it suffered from lack of interest and oversaturation, and then rebooted it several years later, breathing new life into a franchise that was basically on life support. That's par for the course for Hollywood.

Thank you. This fan of Trek going back to 1968 likes TNG seasons 3-7, DS9 2-7, Voyager seasons 3-6, ENT seasons 1-4 all better then Season three of TOS. And while there are several issues that annoyed the crap out of me with the last two films, overall i liked them better then all but Wrath of Khan from the TOS films. In fairness, i think every Trek series (Save animated, I really never liked the animated series) has produced material stronger then any Trek film.

And some of the issues I have with the last two films are issues that I have had with other Trek.

Here's an example, in Into darkness I hated that no other ship was able to help? but hell look at the Motion Picture were we are at earth, with a threat coming to Earth and only the Enterprise stood between. So not a single other ship was in the Sol System, or even any of the closer systems?

There are two rather specific weaknesses to the last two films that aren't something from other parts of Trek. 1. Interstellar beaming. seriously, while Larissa managed that back in TOS's That Which survives", it;s a tech that should never be apart of this franchise. Simply put there is no reason to use a ship ever again. Very, very thankful that it will not be apart of Beyond. 2. Cadet to Captain Kirk. Thankfully we at least see the writers of Into darkness try and show how Kirk wasn't ready, but he should have never been given command at the end of the first reboot film. promote him absolutely, but don't give him a Capital ship. Besides those two elements every other complaint I have ever heard about the films could be applied to the rest of Trek.

 

[Squiggy]

CBS is free to enforce their copyright however they wish. If they want to shut everyone down, they easily could. If they just want to shut Axanar down, they will.

They don't have to be fair at all about protecting their copyright.

 

[Balrog]

A copyright owner need not prosecute every violation.

I'm not saying they do, but some of what's going on here is lynch-mob mentality of playing judge, jury, and executioner. If people want to do that, focus on what makes the Axanar case unique, otherwise you're just building an argument for CBS to crush Axanar and then proceed to take down Renegades, Continues, and NV/PII, all for the sake of enforcing copyright law in its strictest possible interpretation. I can't imagine people here really want that to happen.

***Back from the grave myself - My username still works?***

I don't imagine folks would want that to happen. The problem is, it seems AP doesn't seem to care if it did happen.

That being the case, the man won't be able to show his face in fandom again, and he will forever be branded as the man who killed fan filmmaking.

 

[thumbtack]

Is that Marie Antoinette in the corner back there?

I was thinking Stateroom B on the Titanic.


.

 

[yenny]

They used 'Ambassador Soval' from 'Enterprise' and Gary Graham (the original actor) reprised the role. <--- !00% indefensible copyright infringement QED.

Wait a second now... Sometimes this thread really teeters into hypocritical tunnel-vision. Let's be fair here. Here's a partial list of other Trek actors who have reprised their roles for other fan-films in order of name-recognition:

George Takei (New Voyages)
Walter Koenig (New Voyages, Renegades)
Nichelle Nichols (Of Gods and Men)
Tim Russ (Renegades)
Alan Ruck (Of Gods and Men)
Michael Forest (Continues)

And if Equinox gets off the ground (I'm doubtful) you'd have the two-fer of John Savage and Gary Lockwood.

Yes, and all of these are cases of copyright infringement. The fact that CBS has chosen not to pursue claims against other fan films may be hypocritical, but it is within their legal rights. A copyright owner need not prosecute every violation.

Not exactly, copyright infringement only accord if say actor/actress is getting pay to play a character by a studio that was created by another studio, that as well goes for the actor/actress that had played say characters themself.
It goes as well to anyone involve with the project, but not to those that are not involve.

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

CBS is free to enforce their copyright however they wish. If they want to shut everyone down, they easily could. If they just want to shut Axanar down, they will.

They don't have to be fair at all about protecting their copyright.

From what I have found on Google University and Wikipedia School of law, selective enforcement of copyright *CAN* have an impact on damages awarded... But I don't think CBS is looking for money here....

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

Wait a second now... Sometimes this thread really teeters into hypocritical tunnel-vision. Let's be fair here. Here's a partial list of other Trek actors who have reprised their roles for other fan-films in order of name-recognition:

George Takei (New Voyages)
Walter Koenig (New Voyages, Renegades)
Nichelle Nichols (Of Gods and Men)
Tim Russ (Renegades)
Alan Ruck (Of Gods and Men)
Michael Forest (Continues)

And if Equinox gets off the ground (I'm doubtful) you'd have the two-fer of John Savage and Gary Lockwood.

Yes, and all of these are cases of copyright infringement. The fact that CBS has chosen not to pursue claims against other fan films may be hypocritical, but it is within their legal rights. A copyright owner need not prosecute every violation.

Not exactly, copyright infringement only accord if say actor/actress is getting pay to play a character by a studio that was created by another studio, that as well goes for the actor/actress that had played say characters themself.

But that's what happened with Renegades....