this will be really interesting to see.
CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar
- Thread starter Richard Baker
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this will be really interesting to see.
Except either Mr. Peters or Axanar productions holds the lease for Ares Studios (which has been stated by Mr. Peters as where the Axanar feature would be filmed, and has some standing set pieces) and as both Axanar and Mr. Peters personally were named in the lawsuit, the disposition of/ and the ability of Mr. Peters and Co. to make use of that facility could be part of a Judgement/Settlement.
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well, sure, he could sell what he owns I would think. but he runs Propworx, which has done a number of Trek auctions and has more planned.
Probably how he's going to pay for whatever he needs to pay back the lawyers for whatever costs he may have to cover along with any judgment or settlement against him.
selling a hundred props/costumes per auction at 20% commission, then taking out operating expenses, couldn't possibly cover a loss, unless he chipped in the donor money.
Unless he owns the costumes. I probably should have said "part of."
Do I gotta? :-/
What I said then was true at the time, and I guess some of it is my fault for not really paying that much attention to what Axanar was doing. From the infrequency of my attention to the topic, it looked like it was going well and going to kick butt. Until the lawsuit happened I didn't know there was Axanar coffee (which still shocks me) or model kits being "donored" (another word for sold, IMO) and all of that. I didn't know the studio was being built out with offices and new carpet and all of that. When Alec told me about it originally it was just like New Voyages and being filmed mostly on their sets.
I like fan films. Not because they're awesome and better than Trek you see on TV or the movies but because they're made from heart and passion. And when Alec originally talked to be about it, he was. I was all for it. Then people much more skilled than I at scripts got involved and I was like "wow, good for him."
When the lawsuit happened I said, "sorry it's happening" to him thinking that he was, as he'd always said, going to fold up his tent and stop, because I know *I* have always said if Paramount and CBS stay stop, you stop. That he didn't doesn't sit well with me and all the other stuff I've since learned didn't either. I told him PRIVATELY because no one asked me publicly and I always think it's better to not start some internet pissing match.
I'll also say this, which some here may disagree with: I don't think Alec and Axanar set out to defraud or steal from their donors. I think all involved wanted to see Axanar made. Clearly there is passion there. (A bit too much passion, IMO.)
What was somehow lost was the understanding that making a fan film is at the good graces of the IP holder, and the idea that somehow CBS has waived their right to assert their IP is, to me, both ridiculous and immoral.
Hope that clears it up for my part, and hope I don't have to make other comments about it.
@DaveGalanter do you know what the story was about? Can you say how good it was?
It was about 90 pages I think. :-p
I only know what it was about in first draft form. I've not seen it in years (and had neither the time, nor the skill, nor the inclination other than curiosity at one point) to see later drafts.
It's not for me to tell someone else's story. If Alec wants to publish it online, and CBS/Paramount allow it, that's up to him/them.
Was it good? It was a first draft. I liked the idea and thought it had real potential. Why else would I have assumed it would be good fun? What it became after the very first draft? No idea. I'll tell you this, Alec took criticism well. Never once said an unkind word to me. (And, in fact, when I told him recently I didn't like how things had gone, he thanked me for the feedback. Take that as you will.)
also, thanks. the decision as Alec tells it to walk away from the other fan production as a place to do Axanar, and instead build their own studio, and retroactively repurpose the 2nd kickstarter to fund that is what catches my eye wrt/ honesty with donors.
as Alec tells it in an interview, it was the director who said they couldn't work with the other fan production, and they should relocate to Hollywood and use professionals, and deciding to go with that demand led to the repurposing. Alec says if they hadn't done this, Axanar would have been finished by now.
it looks from the outside like no matter how it started, somewhere in the process the idea of doing a transitory project with all the money going to getting one thing done, got changed to using donor funds to build a permanent studio asset.
but I think the biggest honesty issue is with CBS/Paramount and as you say, claiming copyright law is not what it is.
Suspect that's how it went, mostly. Started off as another fan thing, and somewhere along the way, he realized he was getting a shit-ton of money. At some point, it seems to have turned into just using the film (have to assume it was still going to happen, after stringing it along for more money once or twice) to collect enough 'extra' donations to fully set himself up as a company, with the donors paying for all of his startup costs.
Film could have been finished multiple times over at this point. He got greedy and decided to use the donations to start a self-sustaining company, and then just make the movie on the side (for likely around what it was supposed to cost before). And when the dust settled, he'd have most of a million dollars worth of stuff on his hands to use going forward. Too bad...
Film could have been finished multiple times over at this point. He got greedy and decided to use the donations to start a self-sustaining company, and then just make the movie on the side (for likely around what it was supposed to cost before). And when the dust settled, he'd have most of a million dollars worth of stuff on his hands to use going forward. Too bad...
Many of the biggest prop and costume collectors are on to him. If a person only goes to sites controlled by Alec Peters (Star Trek Prop, Costumes and Auctions blog and forum, everything Propworx or sponsored by Propworx, including Facebook Star Trek sites, everything (mostly) Axanar, the site TrekSpace), they will see only the World According to Alec. Anyone who tells the truth about Alec's unsavory actions is banned and/or censored from those sites. I was an admin on his Prop forum since 2008 until the day I posted something negative about Alec Peters on Facebook. Bad tactical move on his part. I have to hang with Trekkies somewhere, and I like it here!
To get more complete information, Trek bbs, Trek Prop Zone, The Wrath of Dhan blog, 1701, etc. are some sources. People thinking of bidding should speak to people like me or others who have done business with him, and known his ways. It is not pretty. People worry I will be sued because I said things. So I won't say, but Alec was a bad boy who did bad things. I would never ever bid in his auctions. Ever.
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I've been working on a screenplay for a while now that plays along with that. A lot of places have painted Alec Peters as either The Hero or The Mustache Twirling Villain. I will admit to not particularly caring for what I saw of him based solely on his forum posts on various sites, but I don't actually know the guy. People usually don't wake up in the morning and say, "Today I will unleash my nefarious plan!" Good and Evil are entirely in the eye of the beholder.
Typically, you have to prove not only that what was said is false, but then prove damages. Like it cost you a job, or a raise, or you got a fine because of it.
Like, Alec Peters claiming I said that Axanar funds were used to purchase his townhouse in Florida. I never said it. It's false. It's damaging my reputation, and if there were actual monetary damages, I might have a case for defamation. His latest post that I have more than one chin? He might think it's an insult, but I'm like, "Wow! The first truthful thing he's said about me!" And it's truthful, so it can't be defamation.
But then you also have to show that it's not just an opinion, and actually a misstatement of fact. For instance, someone calling Alec a douche is not defamatory. But if you called him a con-man or a fraudster, that could be defamatory, especially if he isn't one. So be careful about words like that ... there is nothing that proves that he scammed anyone or defrauded anyone. The only thing that's on the table right now are multiple allegations of copyright infringement, so at the worst at the moment, he's an alleged copyright infringer.
Even after all that, you still have to show damages.
Now this does change all the time, thanks to new laws and case law, and I'm not a lawyer. But working in media for a long time, you have to keep up on libel, so I do speak with some experience here.
Sorry, another thought popped in there, and I get so few I wanted to share. I also work on videos, and I've done a few to get my name out there. When Starship Farragut was looking for stories, I didn't send one in to get my name out there, I sent it because I thought I had a good story. I wouldn't use a fan production, personally, to get pro work just because it isn't my sandbox. That said, anyone who wanted to pay me based on my NON-Trek writing or film, well, call me! (My phone never rings...)
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