CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar 2 - Electric Boogaloo-Fanboys gone WILD-too many hyphens

[dmac]

What must one do for a ban on facebook? I mean they aren't really that strict about most things.

Considering 3 out of 4 of my last week "+or-" bans came shortly after writing/producing a fan film. They never give you a list of who you caused such horrible pain, So it could have been my own Mother turning me in..lol
At this point I don't care and I'm off doing better things.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Considering 3 out of 4 of my last week "+or-" bans came shortly after writing/producing a fan film. They never give you a list of who you caused such horrible pain, So it could have been my own Mother turning me in..lol
At this point I don't care and I'm off doing better things.

I feel like some days I want to dump it again.

 

[dmac]

I feel like some days I want to dump it again.

I find more like minded folks on Brighteon social because I do the 20 % off grid living thing. I can't take 24/7 politics and would rather chat with people that have already tried something I'm thinking of getting into.
Anymore I look forward to getting snowbound for 5 months, it really isn't that difficult once you know what to expect.

 

[Coops]

These Facebook groups are insane. Alec is an obvious grifter that should be avoided, but the way people attack each other on pages like Axamonitor and The Real Truth About Axanar are just....childish? Petty? Ridiculous all around when this all centers on an IP absolutely nobody owns.

And it's a constant cycle too, they said something so they say something. Then they respond so then they respond.

If I could create a gif with Lazarus fighting Lazarus in The Alternative Factor I'd place it here now.

 

[Coops]

So they shut down a book project? That seems a bit... excessive.

I wonder if someone else is doing a similar licensed product and the suits are doing this preemptively to forcibly remove any potential competition. Stage 9 all over again...

I'm not sure I'd feel it was excessive if I'd forked out to buy a license to produce a Star Trek book. I'd need to recoup the cost of that as well as everything else before I made a profit. If I found out that my potential customers could pick up something similar for free or almost free I think I'd want something done about it.

This is what some people seem to forget, it's not the IP owner throwing it's weight around just for shits and giggles, being the big bad corporate monster, its' about protecting people who do follow the rules.

 

[fireproof78]

What must one do for a ban on facebook? I mean they aren't really that strict about most things.

Get enough reports on you and it will happen. I have a friend who does so frequently.

I'm not sure I'd feel it was excessive if I'd forked out to buy a license to produce a Star Trek book. I'd need to recoup the cost of that as well as everything else before I made a profit. If I found out that my potential customers could pick up something similar for free or almost free I think I'd want something done about it.

This is what some people seem to forget, it's not the IP owner throwing it's weight around just for shits and giggles, being the big bad corporate monster, its' about protecting people who do follow the rules.

Indeed, yes. They have to look out for their business side, and protect those who actually purchased the license to create their works. Again, it has nothing to do with "not making any money." it's the fact that it is outside the rules and people playing inside the rules have expectations.

Sorry, I get that being a fan brings a certain level of passion and interest but it doesn't mean there are not aspects of the business CBS and parent company have to protect.

 

[137th Gebirg]

There are probably millions of works of art (books, music, videos, games, etc.) on hundreds of thousands of fan websites out there with all this and more and V/P/C hasn't shut them down. If protecting IP is so important then why don't all fan sites suffer the same fate with a C&D and disappear within 30 days? What makes certain projects a specific target?

IIRC, Stage 9 was said to have been shut down because STO was planning a release of similar walk-throughs. Axanar got squashed for obvious reasons delineate numerous times here and elsewhere. There's cause and effect and there's always a reason.

What made this book project a target? Was it simply the usage of screen captures from canonical sources? Were they making money off the venture, or is this simply just some random occurrence to make an example of someone for all the world to see? The final option I find to be least likely. There's usually a reason that is publicly quantified somewhere.

 

[Coops]

There are probably millions of works of art (books, music, videos, games, etc.) on hundreds of thousands of fan websites out there with all this and more and V/P/C hasn't shut them down. If protecting IP is so important then why don't all fan sites suffer the same fate with a C&D and disappear within 30 days? What makes certain projects a specific target?

IIRC, Stage 9 was said to have been shut down because STO was planning a release of similar walk-throughs. Axanar got squashed for obvious reasons delineate numerous times here and elsewhere. There's cause and effect and there's always a reason.

What made this book project a target? Was it simply the usage of screen captures from canonical sources? Were they making money off the venture, or is this simply just some random occurrence to make an example of someone for all the world to see? The final option I find to be least likely. There's usually a reason that is publicly quantified somewhere.

I think you've answered your own question. If I created an illustrated novel about a Borg cube fighting Khan in the USS Reliant and tried to get people to give me money for it the IP owners would probably ignore it because it would look like a bag of shit.

 

[137th Gebirg]

My question wasn't answered though - Did the authors of this book try to raise money on the IP? Looking at the provided link upthread, the authors go on record, specifically saying, "Even though we have made $0 off this work, we always knew this was a possibility."

So, what was the purpose of this? Random enforcement or intentional target?

 

[fireproof78]

Random enforcement

Probably random enforcement, especially since it used stills from the show itself. Plus, being flagged by copyright ID bots which are less that discriminating. So, it got flagged because it used a copyrighted material (screen shots) and that set the process in motion.

If protecting IP is so important then why don't all fan sites suffer the same fate with a C&D and disappear within 30 days?

Time and money. They probably would if they could, and with bots that might become more common.

 

[Mytran]

My question wasn't answered though - Did the authors of this book try to raise money on the IP? Looking at the provided link upthread, the authors go on record, specifically saying, "Even though we have made $0 off this work, we always knew this was a possibility."

So, what was the purpose of this? Random enforcement or intentional target?

They apparently put up a poll asking how much their patrons would be happy paying for a printed copy of the work. The poll has now been removed, but it wouldn't surprise me if that was the straw (along with all the copyrighted images) which broke the camel's back.

 

[137th Gebirg]

AH! Now THAT would definitely throw a legitimate red flag. It was a line they never should have crossed and the legal reaction makes perfect sense in this context. Thank you for the clarification.

I guess some people never learn from mistakes made by others in the past. What was that line about "Those who ignore history" - something, something... ?

 

[Therin of Andor]

What must one do for a ban on facebook? I mean they aren't really that strict about most things.

Threat of violence will do it.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Yep.

 

[pgbka]

I'm just coming across this Axenar/lawsuit/fan fiction guidelines from 2015 and I'm stunned at how ridiculous they are - no more feature films? Limits of 2 episodes per series?? Is there a summary somewhere on what the reaction has been since then? I would expect a lot of ppl would boycott ST, paramount+, etc, until they revised the fan fiction guidelines. But maybe no one cares?

 

[137th Gebirg]

At the time, IIRC, people were pretty pissed about it. Now, it's like a first-world problem. We got bigger fish to fry right now.

This has become nothing more than a sideshow at this point - a source of minimal amusement. We're watching something that was once perceived to have great potential, has fallen hard under the weight of its own hubris, and yet continues to slowly flounder about like an earthworm on the sidewalk after a rainstorm and the water is slowly evaporating under the heat of the sun after the storm has long passed. Eventually it will shrivel up and die, but such things take a while to finally dry up.

 

[David cgc]

Another key point is that it's Fan-Films of the Caribbean, these are guidelines, not rules. Following them to the letter is no guarantee of avoiding trouble, but on the other hand, violating the guidelines is no guarantee of incurring it.

And making fan films (and fan fic, and fan art), is a lot of work done by a relative minority of fans. There's not going to a be a huge consumer boycott for our right to spend thousands of dollars and years of our lives to make something that looks promising and then turns out pretty middling.

 

[SITZKRIEG!]

I'm just coming across this Axenar/lawsuit/fan fiction guidelines from 2015 and I'm stunned at how ridiculous they are - no more feature films? Limits of 2 episodes per series?? Is there a summary somewhere on what the reaction has been since then? I would expect a lot of ppl would boycott ST, paramount+, etc, until they revised the fan fiction guidelines. But maybe no one cares?

The people who wanted to and had the will did. I was pretty salty about them as I think they went too far but I understand the reasoning given the nefariousness of the person behind Axanar and his actions. I'd have preferred that they limit a fan production to two 30 minute episodes per series so you could get a single full length episode like classic trek when viewed together but I see why they wouldn't want perceived competition from series like NV and STC either. As for feature length films, how many came out? I can only think of a couple over the past 20+ years of fan films (admittedly I only got into watching trek fan films because of Prelude so may have missed some) so I don't see that as a real loss but more of an imagined one.

 

[fireproof78]

I'm just coming across this Axenar/lawsuit/fan fiction guidelines from 2015 and I'm stunned at how ridiculous they are - no more feature films? Limits of 2 episodes per series?? Is there a summary somewhere on what the reaction has been since then? I would expect a lot of ppl would boycott ST, paramount+, etc, until they revised the fan fiction guidelines. But maybe no one cares?

It's an extremely small portion of the fan base that creates these, or puts them out for public viewing. The fan films I've done with friends never made it to online; we just made it for fun.

Two, doing a feature length fan film is a huge undertaking. Everyone my friends and I scripted and planned fell through just due to logistical challenges.

Finally, they have a right to protect their IP.

 

[Mytran]

Another key point is that it's Fan-Films of the Caribbean, these are guidelines, not rules. Following them to the letter is no guarantee of avoiding trouble, but on the other hand, violating the guidelines is no guarantee of incurring it.

And making fan films (and fan fic, and fan art), is a lot of work done by a relative minority of fans. There's not going to a be a huge consumer boycott for our right to spend thousands of dollars and years of our lives to make something that looks promising and then turns out pretty middling.

They were presented as a "safe harbour" to the fanfilm community - i.e. stick to these limits and you won't get sued.
You are correct that violating them isn't a guarantee of being sued however.
At the end of the day I think the intent was simply to clamp down on the mini-industry that certain fanfilm groups had become.