Calling All Shippers! Mediation Thread

[Hoshi's sis]

Posted by angie:

You've brought up a good point, Angie. What exactly is trolling? From what I gathered, it's purposedly going into a thread to state a negative and inflammatory opinion. Not sure if that's right or not. Maybe a Mod can come in and give us the correct definition.

That is the way I have always interpreted it as well.

I will read threads like the T/T ones because occassionally there is some good general discussion that I can join in but I have no interest in technobabble so I avoid those threads with a to each his own shrug which is why I don't get posting what I call inflammatory remarks in a thread about an actress on professes to hate.I think CT a mediocre actor but I do not visit each new Trip and / or Connor thread to point this out because it would be stupid and a waste of my time. However were I to do so I would feel that anyone would be allowed to say hey read the title of the thread--- you are trolling.

That's fine with the RAGE threads regarding characters but since the 'I love Jolene' thread was NOT A RAGE THREAD but discussion with negative and positive comments, it does not apply. In that case offering a different opinion is not trolling, in your case being unnecessary nasty in your remarks was.

 

[angie]

I think my comment was bitchy but disagree on unnecessary and will still stand by a thread titled I love Jolene and her remarks was for people in agreement just as the Trip great actor whatnot thread was for people who agreed with that sentiment.

angie

 

[commodore64]

I could turn your little argument around

Oh man. Danger, Will Robinson, danger!

and say that the only reason you and other A/T shippers have been so enthusiastic about some of Jolene's comments is because of your dislike of Trip and the Trip/T'Pol ship.

Didn't LC say she hated being lumped as a "you Tuckerites are only saying that because you like Tucker ..."? I thought that was a rather good idea.

I like T'Pol much more than I like the A/T'P ship. My main concern is ensuring she's Vulcan. I like Vulcans. Spock is my favorite character of all Trek time (though dark Archer is a close second).

As a woman, I had a hard time with people saying something to the effect of "Jolene was a bimbo because she appears in magazines where she's half-clothed." I'm not saying all Tuckerites did, but enough to really get my liberal feminist blood boiling. For those who didn't and have to bear the mark, I'm sorry.

And, I don't hate Trip. But, you know -- that's the last time I'll type that. From now on, my policy is going to be to agree and prove I hate him. I've been accused of it enough, I might as well give in.

Not everything I say here is about Trip or shipping.

 

[pookha]

well once again it wasnt only trip fans who were upset by some of the stuff interview.
that she seemed to be in such a negative way about the show made some people wonder.
most of the threads about it were started by non trip fans.

 

[angie]

The threads were started by general fans but the majotity of negativity and vehemance towards the actress came from the Trip fans primarily with general fans not agreeing necessarily but not calling her names and saying by posing in these kind of magazines she was not entitled to an opinion.

 

[Jenna]

C64, this isn't directed at you.

I think all of this "I could point out that CT/SB sucks and that your thread is stupid" stuff has got to stop, from both sides. It does nothing. Turn the other cheek. More than likely, the person antagonizing you will be the one to end up looking bad and getting slapped by the mods. We've all seen it happen. Taking the high road around here really does wonders. It might feel like you're biting a bullet, but you come off looking so much better than the person who constantly goes for the throat.

Those who go for the throat know who they are, and if the rest of us would stop responding in kind, they might actually be shamed into stopping. Who knows?

At the risk of someone taking this politically: Be a uniter, not a divider.

 

[Darlah Nahan Halrad]

As far as the whole Spam issue is concerned I look at it this way. I stay out of certain threads...for the most part, so I really wouldn't know if people are spamming in them. Even if I thought they were, I wouldn't give a shit. I mean it doesn't affect me.

If a bunch of people who share a viewpoint you vehemently disagree with start spamming it up in a thread you wouldn't participate in does it really affect you? If so, how?

Is it the post numbers that affect you? As in certain threads seem to grow faster and "lap" certain other threads? What, you think TPTB (even the tiny handful that visit occasionally) are going to be influenced in any way by what goes on here?

I can see it now...

Rick Berman logs on late one night and reads the Enterprise Forum thread list. He thinks to himself:

"Shit! That T/T thread had three times as many hits as the A/T thread since the last time I checked! You know what? Those plucky little darlings deserve to be rewarded! But how?...<snaps fingers> I got it! <cue dramatic music> T'Pol's gonna give Trip the balloon knot for February sweeps! YES! It'll be the "b" story in that upcoming episode Manny's working on. What's it called again? Oh yeah, And Surak's Soul Lingers On Vulcan Eternally. Ricky, you're a goddamn genius!!

 

[Ulva]

Thank you Darlah Nahan Halrad for bringing a sence of humour into this... I think we could all need some more of that right now...

 

[dmleo]

Posted by commodore64:

and say that the only reason you and other A/T shippers have been so enthusiastic about some of Jolene's comments is because of your dislike of Trip and the Trip/T'Pol ship.

I like T'Pol much more than I like the A/T'P ship. My main concern is ensuring she's Vulcan. I like Vulcans. Spock is my favorite character of all Trek time (though dark Archer is a close second).

If that's the case then why did you post in the T/T thread the minute news of Jolene's negative comments were made public.

For the record, I never said one word about Jolene posing in men's magazines and I certainly never called her a bimbo. I only criticized the way she expressed herself in her interviews, which, in my opinion, is fair game.

 

[commodore64]

Posted by dmleo:

Posted by commodore64:

and say that the only reason you and other A/T shippers have been so enthusiastic about some of Jolene's comments is because of your dislike of Trip and the Trip/T'Pol ship.

I like T'Pol much more than I like the A/T'P ship. My main concern is ensuring she's Vulcan. I like Vulcans. Spock is my favorite character of all Trek time (though dark Archer is a close second).

If that's the case then why did you post in the T/T thread the minute news of Jolene's negative comments were made public.

For the record, I never said one word about Jolene posing in men's magazines and I certainly never called her a bimbo. I only criticized the way she expressed herself in her interviews, which, in my opinion, is fair game.

I didn't say you did. I'm saying why I felt it was necessary to comment in various threads.

I don't believe I posted anything in the T/T'P thread -- I think maybe I've posted like twice in the T/T'P thread. I don't really read the thread anyway. Why should I? I don't like T/T'P and haven't seen in the past a lot of character or episode analysis that I would like to participate in. Occasionally someone will point something out to me, but that rarely happens and they usually quote someone -- preventing me from looking at the thread.

To your point in general, I don't remember anyone posting anything in the T/T'P thread. I do remember about three or four threads all responding to her comments [because roughly three or four interviews came out at the same time]. Maybe I'm not recalling correctly?

 

[Darlah Nahan Halrad]

Posted by Ulva:
Thank you Darlah Nahan Halrad for bringing a sence of humour into this... I think we could all need some more of that right now...

No prob, Ulva. I was in a weird mood when I posted that.

Anyway, I think the problem is that there really isn't much to discuss about the show right now. "Hot Button" episodes like Harbinger, Twilight, and E² are several months old at this point and all the arguments about them are pretty worn out. Recent spoilers have been rather definitive IMHO and I think the vast majority of posters (shippers) get it...whether they're happy about it or not. So what are we left with? Not much. It seems to me people are just creating reasons to fight...and outlets to vent.

 

[pookha]

indranee
after reading through the whole thread and reading
your posts and some of the responses you got i am sorry top
said something to you because i felt i may have a part in it.

yesterday when i logged in i had a pm waiting saying you
were in the t/t thread and had came in more then once.

i am really short of time at lunch and i didnt know if i
would have time to read through the thread so i told the person that if it was causing a problem let a mod know.

after reading through your posts while i think some of your tone (without intending to) came across a little in strong
a careful reading of your words sounded not as bad.

does this make sense.

well there was this archer /tpol have had this special relationship and t/t only started getting close in season 3.

well in the t/t thread you should know many of us dont see it that way that t/t too have been close also.

any way i am sorry it happened and maybe things could have been handled better if a pm was sent to you like you are welcome but tone down the a/t gushing just a mite and dont
be so dismissive of the t/t friendship prior to season 3.

just my half cent for whatever it is worth..
i just hope i havent made things worse

 

[dmleo]

Pookha, the bottom line is that fans posting in the Trip/T'Pol rage thread don't want to be told of how special the A/T relationship is. Whatever understanding Quills and Zane have with the A/T camp in terms of their posting habits has nothing to do with Indranee's comments.

A lot of folks are rather tired of the same old argument that Trip/T'Pol came out of nowhere and that A/T are the ones with the special bond, especially if this opinion is being expressed in a T/T thread.

 

[Blah]

I think the simple answer to Quills/Zane as opposed to Indranee is that no one in the A/T thread hit the mod button for either Quills or Zane.

Indranee came into the T/T thread to defend Archer against the T/Ter's..a little off topic but fine. However it seriously couldn't have been more than a day or two after she said in another thread that she thought T/T was one of the stupidest and lamest Trek couples EVER.

If the situation was reversed and let's say I said that about A/T..and then came into the A/T thread to talk about Trip..I would expect most of the A/Ter's to be like..Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.

The things you've done and said in the past play a big factor in how you'll be received. So when Indranee showed up in the T/T thread I imagine someone was hitting the mod button pretty fast.

 

[LLAP2U]

^^^

Just chiming in for a second to say that TnT'ers were discussing Archer and T'Pol so she probably assumed that it was okay to come in and discuss it as well...

The tone of the overall discussion did have a turn towards the end and it started becoming the 'us against them' thing again but I was not offended by anything that she said nor do I think that she 'over stepped her bounds'.

If the discussion was not about Archer/T'Pol I may have understood why others got upset but I really did not... We were talking about the A/T' dynamics... She was on topic and if you did not like her tone then the post should have been ignored or discussed through pm's.

Whether indranee was baiting or not is up to your perceptions... (I personally think she was in her own way by the end of the discussion and maybe she wasn't really aware of it) but we are adults and someone should have just said... "I feel that you are baiting me into an argument... please don't." Then go back to talking about the topic at hand or change it to TnT'.

But honestly I did not have a problem with her post as a whole and I think it was blown out of proportion......

 

[dmleo]

Posted by Blah:
I think the simple answer to Quills/Zane as opposed to Indranee is that no one in the A/T thread hit the mod button for either Quills or Zane.

Indranee came into the T/T thread to defend Archer against the T/Ter's..a little off topic but fine. However it seriously couldn't have been more than a day or two after she said in another thread that she thought T/T was one of the stupidest and lamest Trek couples EVER.

If the situation was reversed and let's say I said that about A/T..and then came into the A/T thread to talk about Trip..I would expect most of the A/Ter's to be like..Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.

The things you've done and said in the past play a big factor in how you'll be received. So when Indranee showed up in the T/T thread I imagine someone was hitting the mod button pretty fast.

Blah, great post. That's exactly how I feel. I would expect the same negative reaction from A/T folks if I decided to go to their rage thread and tell them what a special bond Trip and T'Pol have and how great they are together.

I still say that the only way to keep the peace is to stay the hell away from each other's rage threads.

 

[commodore64]

Posted by dmleo:
Pookha, the bottom line is that fans posting in the Trip/T'Pol rage thread don't want to be told of how special the A/T relationship is. Whatever understanding Quills and Zane have with the A/T camp in terms of their posting habits has nothing to do with Indranee's comments.

A lot of folks are rather tired of the same old argument that Trip/T'Pol came out of nowhere and that A/T are the ones with the special bond, especially if this opinion is being expressed in a T/T thread.

I almost want to read the T/T'P thread, just to see what everyone is talking about.

Whatever understanding ...? Isn't a well-reasoned logical debate important no matter where you are in the TrekBBS?

Zane and Quills never get the invite to come hang out, they pop in from time-to-time of their own accord. But, so has LL, Lady Di and a few others. I personally don't care who comes into the A/T'P thread, as long as:
1) They have something interesting to say.
2) They're nice and respectful.

LL -- good stuff to say and awesome avatar! Baiting is sometimes perception. Wouldn't it be nice if everyone assumed the best? I would rather get a post -- "Do you know this baits us?" rather than "You're baiting us, you evil C64!"

Blah said
Indranee came into the T/T thread to defend Archer against the T/Ter's..a little off topic but fine.

This brings up something I don't think we can really come to agreement on. I've seen the following logic from some Tuckerites.
1) Archerites or T'Polians may never make fun of Tucker. Trip is sacred.
2) Archer is fair game. In fact, it's okay to hate him and say so ... a lot.
3) We can say whatever we want to about T'Pol, too.

I'm not trying to bait you, this is actually how it feels on this side of the ENT divide.

However it seriously couldn't have been more than a day or two after she said in another thread that she thought T/T was one of the stupidest and lamest Trek couples EVER.

Did she really say those exact words?! Whoah. Well, Indranne is a nice person and a cool chick. I'm wondering if she felt like a lone Archer protector.

If the situation was reversed and let's say I said that about A/T..and then came into the A/T thread to talk about Trip..I would expect most of the A/Ter's to be like..Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.

True enough. Occasionally someone will come into the thread and slam an ideal that we believe in. I think once even Zane and/or Quills did. I think they probably received lots of polite, "Please go away"s. They came in a few days later to discuss something else -- which was fine. I know they mean well -- they're as passionate about their beliefs as I am mine.

Here's another thing -- the Tuckerites, Archerites and T'Polians continue to run into each other every day. Even when a few of you say something that irks me, most days start anew at the TrekBBS. I'll give you a for example, I like Jenna. She may've said something I didn't like once and I'm sure I replied overly harshly, but she's still a sweet person. I enjoy seeing her around -- she has enthusiasm for her ship. And thus, from time to time all of us are bound to disagree strongly. And from time to time, we're bound to disagree with enthusiasm and passion. Sometimes knowing people mean well is a good thing.

 

[Blah]

Posted by commodore64:
I almost want to read the T/T'P thread, just to see what everyone is talking about.

Whatever understanding ...? Isn't a well-reasoned logical debate important no matter where you are in the TrekBBS?

Zane and Quills never get the invite to come hang out, they pop in from time-to-time of their own accord. But, so has LL, Lady Di and a few others. I personally don't care who comes into the A/T'P thread, as long as:
1) They have something interesting to say.
2) They're nice and respectful.

LL -- good stuff to say and awesome avatar! Baiting is sometimes perception. Wouldn't it be nice if everyone assumed the best? I would rather get a post -- "Do you know this baits us?" rather than "You're baiting us, you evil C64!"

It wasn't that big a deal. We were talking about closeness and who knows T'Pol better. Some of the T/Ter's mentioned they see very little if any closeness with the A/T relationship..past or present. Indranee came into to say why she thought that was wrong. Mentioned times of closeness between A/T. It wasn't particularly well received and I think 3 T/Ter's politely warned her, then the mod came in. Indranee said to the mod she felt singled out cause Quills/Zane never get warnings for being in the A/T thread.

That's the whole story.

 

[LLAP2U]

Posted by commodore64:
LL -- good stuff to say and awesome avatar! Baiting is sometimes perception. Wouldn't it be nice if everyone assumed the best? I would rather get a post -- "Do you know this baits us?" rather than "You're baiting us, you evil C64!"<snip>

Thank you for the compliment! Spock was my first love... Then it was Michael Jackson... (Work that out! I am one sick puppy...)

Anyway, I think many people on both sides have baited each other and some are more sensitive to it... I am the type of person that will say what I feel in an open forum but I attempt to be courteous in rage threads.

I love reading the A/T' thread and I do so every day but I do not make a comment unless I think it is helpful or respectful but not everyone knows to do that. We all have different humor as well and so sometimes we say things that we think are funny or interesting and it offends someone... Like my comment about liking Spam in regards to a comment you made about Tucker... You got the Python related joke but others didn't and became defensive......

indranee and angie (yes I am saying names) have said a lot of things on several occasions that have put a lot of TnT'ers and Tuckerites knickers in a bind and I think that the problem is that most people don't forget that... So as soon as they see who the poster is they go on guard and 'shields come up' as they are waiting for the attack... So when the slightest statement appears as baiting the defenses come out in full swing......

But I have also had very interesting and informative discussions with indranee as well......

As we have both said C64 'baiting is perception'. We have all given in to it... (including myself until I realize... "What the Hell am I doing??? ) If you don't like what you are reading you can politely say to the person (without calling names or being condescending) please stop or you don't have to answer them... Eventually they will get the message...

 

[RedFenix]

Posted by LLAP2U:
Spock was my first love...

Mine too! Along with Larry Hagman and Adam West. I'd like to second the coolness of your avatar, BTW, and sorry for pulling this off topic.