RobertScorpio
Pariah
If the Borg had come into the Gamma Quadrant, could they have A: Defeated the Dominion and B: Could they have assimilated the Founders?
Borged Founders?
- Thread starter RobertScorpio
- Start date
I agree, the Founders most likely can't be assimilated.
RobertScorpio
Pariah
So the Borg could have assimilated the Jem'Hadar/Vorta..in essence, taken over the Gamma Quadrant. The founders would have just probably fled into the stars?
Moving to DS9
A: I don't think the Borg would win, the Jem'hadar are so ruthless they would kill any Borg who landed and they would destroy the cubes with suicide attacks or beam tons of Jem'Hadar onto the cubes.
B: I don't think they can be assimiliated, they could just turn to mist or fire and destroy the nanites, or turn into solid rock and crush them.
B: I don't think they can be assimiliated, they could just turn to mist or fire and destroy the nanites, or turn into solid rock and crush them.
All Seeing Eye
Admiral
As has already been said the Jem'Hadar would likely resort to making suicide runs against the Borg cubes, One Borg cube would be obliterated at the expense of a single Dominion Bug ship. We know the Dominion can grow soldiers and build ships at an immense speed and would be quite capable of producing a vast fleet and don't forget the power and size of a Dominion Dreadnought! its two times bigger than a Galaxy class ship and three times more powerful, that ship alone would be almost as big as a cube!
Lets get real though, the Borg have Trans-warp ability and would be jumping in from the Delta Quadrant, the Dominion has no such ability and would be confined to defending Dominion space completely unable to attack Borg shipyards whereas the Borg would be attacking Dominion installations repeatedly, in this scenario the Borg would have the upper hand but I would imagine the Borg wouldnt win but would be constantly repelled but should the Dominion acquire trans-warp themselves then I can see the Dominion being victorious against the Borg, the Dominion are just better in so many ways.
Starfleet when boarding Borg ships rely on their phasers, the Jem'Hadar when they board ships as we've seen immediately resort to hand to hand combat, the Borg would be unable to adapt and would get their asses kicked and any Jem'Hadar soldier injected with Borg nanoprobes would either a)Kill themselves commiting suicide or b)be shot and killed by a fellow soldier.
Now as for Changelings being assimilated it just wouldnt happen, the Borg nanoprobes are designed specifically to assimilate solid humanoid life with a bloodstream and organs, the changelings are completely different organisms, the Borg wouldn't even be able to adapt the nanoprobes because they can only adapt through assimilation and since they cant assimilate them there's no way they could do it, just think about when they tried to assimilate Species 8472 from another dimension, they couldn't assimilate them and couldn't adapt because of it so needed Voyagers help. The main reason they can't be assimilated of course (as has already been said) is the fact they can change form and can even become solid rock, the nanoprobes would be instantly crushed because they are mechanical whereas the disease that infected the founders was biological and was completely designed and engineered to attack changeling physiology, the Borg do not have that ability because they rely on assimilation.
Lets get real though, the Borg have Trans-warp ability and would be jumping in from the Delta Quadrant, the Dominion has no such ability and would be confined to defending Dominion space completely unable to attack Borg shipyards whereas the Borg would be attacking Dominion installations repeatedly, in this scenario the Borg would have the upper hand but I would imagine the Borg wouldnt win but would be constantly repelled but should the Dominion acquire trans-warp themselves then I can see the Dominion being victorious against the Borg, the Dominion are just better in so many ways.
Starfleet when boarding Borg ships rely on their phasers, the Jem'Hadar when they board ships as we've seen immediately resort to hand to hand combat, the Borg would be unable to adapt and would get their asses kicked and any Jem'Hadar soldier injected with Borg nanoprobes would either a)Kill themselves commiting suicide or b)be shot and killed by a fellow soldier.
Now as for Changelings being assimilated it just wouldnt happen, the Borg nanoprobes are designed specifically to assimilate solid humanoid life with a bloodstream and organs, the changelings are completely different organisms, the Borg wouldn't even be able to adapt the nanoprobes because they can only adapt through assimilation and since they cant assimilate them there's no way they could do it, just think about when they tried to assimilate Species 8472 from another dimension, they couldn't assimilate them and couldn't adapt because of it so needed Voyagers help. The main reason they can't be assimilated of course (as has already been said) is the fact they can change form and can even become solid rock, the nanoprobes would be instantly crushed because they are mechanical whereas the disease that infected the founders was biological and was completely designed and engineered to attack changeling physiology, the Borg do not have that ability because they rely on assimilation.
A suicide run by a single bug ship on a cube would probably not result in the cubes destruction.
One tiny bug against several kilometers large cube could probably induce some structural damage, but not by much.
The Borg wouldn't be completely defenseless after all.
They have shields, extremely tough hull armor, not to mention tractor/cutting beams.
The nanoprobes among other things rewrite the individuals DNA so the 'obedience' factor or even the addiction to the Ketracel White could be easily eliminated.
Even if the Dominion acquired TW capability, the Borg would crush them with sheer numbers (The Dominion having at their disposal about several thousand ships, vs millions of Borg ships).
The Borg once exposed to multiple tactics of the Dominion will adapt and would be able to quickly overcome them.
Same would happen in the scenario with Borg vs Federation ... but we know the writers keep them safe and sound from the Collective.
One tiny bug against several kilometers large cube could probably induce some structural damage, but not by much.
The Borg wouldn't be completely defenseless after all.
They have shields, extremely tough hull armor, not to mention tractor/cutting beams.
The nanoprobes among other things rewrite the individuals DNA so the 'obedience' factor or even the addiction to the Ketracel White could be easily eliminated.
Even if the Dominion acquired TW capability, the Borg would crush them with sheer numbers (The Dominion having at their disposal about several thousand ships, vs millions of Borg ships).
The Borg once exposed to multiple tactics of the Dominion will adapt and would be able to quickly overcome them.
Same would happen in the scenario with Borg vs Federation ... but we know the writers keep them safe and sound from the Collective.
In one novel a changeling turned into a sphere and then contracted which crushed the nanoprobes in the middle.
Only thing is, that particular situation was conjured up in a pocket book which is sadly not part of canon.
So effectively speaking, we don't know if a changeling would be able to do what was done in the novel under such circumstances.
The assimilation process is very fast from what we noticed in FC and on Voyager ... at least in terms of the individuals experiencing large pain during the assimilation process itself which is an invasive procedure right before they fall down.
I leave an open mind to the possibility that a changeling could be immune to assimilation ... but there is also high probability that with time the Borg would simply find an alternative solution.
The Borg did conjure up a 'nanovirus' in Dark Frontier which was intended for Earth's population.
Of course that was never pulled off ... still, I wouldn't put it pass the Borg to devise a method of assimilation that didn't involve nanoprobes.
So effectively speaking, we don't know if a changeling would be able to do what was done in the novel under such circumstances.
The assimilation process is very fast from what we noticed in FC and on Voyager ... at least in terms of the individuals experiencing large pain during the assimilation process itself which is an invasive procedure right before they fall down.
I leave an open mind to the possibility that a changeling could be immune to assimilation ... but there is also high probability that with time the Borg would simply find an alternative solution.
The Borg did conjure up a 'nanovirus' in Dark Frontier which was intended for Earth's population.
Of course that was never pulled off ... still, I wouldn't put it pass the Borg to devise a method of assimilation that didn't involve nanoprobes.
But we know the Borg don't think like that. If that were the case then the Federation would have fallen the first time the Borg came.
Whatever the outcome, you can be sure of one thing; It's gonna leave one hell of a sloppy mess.
All Seeing Eye
Admiral
Are you joking, an object the size of a bug ship slamming into the side of a Borg cube at .9c would release an equivalent amount of energy to probably about 100 Quantum torpedoes maybe even more, not to mention the possibility of even more damage following an explosion of the warp core as it goes critical. Also we're not even sure that the Borg have shields, its always appeared that the Borg prefer to regenerate the damage when it occurs rather than prevent it with shields, they more likely pump more power to the weapons and use less power gradually regenerating rather than having shields drain most of the power, even if they did have shields, the impact of a bug ship at .9c would instantly collapse them and blast half the cube to dust with the other half blowing up in the aftermath and even if one bug ship didnt finish the entire job another would likely make a run at the same time and do so, thats just 2 bug ships for 1 Borg cube, a small loss to the Dominiion but a major loss to the Borg. In Voyager when voyager destroyed one of those three Borg cubes with transphasic torpedos the other two moved away, the Borg clearly cant afford to lose entire cubes no matter how many they have and how many they have is pure speculation, for all we know they only have a few hundred or a couple of thousand with the rest of the fleet comprising of spheres, diamonds and interceptor probes.
One more thing, we saw in First contact the size of a sovereign class ship compared to the size of the Borg Cube, the Cube wasnt that much bigger, we know that Sovereign class ships are about the same size as a Galaxy Class ship, we know that Dominion Dreadnoughts are 2 times BIGGER than a Galaxy class and 3 times more powerful so pit a Dominion Dreadnought against a Borg Cube and the Cube is in some serious shit, pit 2 Dreadnoughts against a cube and you can kiss bye bye to the Cube.
If the UFP has encountered shape shifters, it's likely the Borg have knowledge of this type of alien as well they could easily have acquired information on the Founders morphagenic matrix from the databases of any number of UFP, Cardassian or Bajoran installations or starships they could have assimilated.
