Berman and Braga Were Sexist

[Four Lights]

I'm working my way through the second part of "The Fifty Year Mission" behind the scenes books at the moment. I'm must be about 75% through it now.

A couple of things have jumped out at me about the behaviour of these two as I read it though.
First, Berman was supposed to have been a real sleaze ball when it came to the treatment of Terry Farrell. According to her, he would go on constantly about how her breasts weren't big enough, and how she should do something about it, and how his secretary was a good example to follow as she had huge breasts. She even had to have fittings to get larger bras, and that was all done at his behest.

Then, I read later on how he and Braga were supposed to have had this name for Seven of Nine. Apparently they called the character "perineum" which if you look it up it is the area between the anus and the scrotum. I mean, what does it tell you about where these two were coming from in the development of this character if they had a name like that for her?

I was never much of a fan of either of them, even before I read any of this. My opinion of them now though has gone even lower.

 

[Balok's Decoy]

I can't remember what exactly he said, but I remember Rick Berman saying something really sexist in his interview for the Chaos on the Bridge documentary. IIRC it had something to do with Denise Crosby and Marina Sirtis.

I like a lot of the work they did on Star Trek. Doesn't make them good people irl though.

 

[Spot261]

So they were sleazebags who managed to make a show about equality convincing.

GR taught them well.

 

[Armus]

I'm working my way through the second part of "The Fifty Year Mission" behind the scenes books at the moment. I'm must be about 75% through it now.

A couple of things have jumped out at me about the behaviour of these two as I read it though.
First, Berman was supposed to have been a real sleaze ball when it came to the treatment of Terry Farrell. According to her, he would go on constantly about how her breasts weren't big enough, and how she should do something about it, and how his secretary was a good example to follow as she had huge breasts. She even had to have fittings to get larger bras, and that was all done at his behest.

I read that and I couldn't believe it. He shouldn't have cast her if that was his priority in female actresses.

 

[BillJ]

I have no love for Berman and Braga, but I'd take anything in The Fifty-Year Mission with a huge grain of salt. They reprinted many inaccuracies about TOS.

 

[Phily B]

Not really sexist, but playing off rape as a jokey subject completely turned me off Enterprise and Trek for quite a while.

I think they were just a pair of people who could play the showbiz political game well like many producers, execs, writers etc in LA.

 

[Voth commando1]

And Hollywood overall isn't?

It was the culture(and still is) that as a woman you've got to be attractive and yes you have to sleep with the producers/directors/lead actors to get ahead.

Is it degrading? Yes. Wrong? Arguably so. A fact of life? Yes.

 

[The Wormhole]

I'm working my way through the second part of "The Fifty Year Mission" behind the scenes books at the moment. I'm must be about 75% through it now.

That book certainly casts Berman in a negative and quite sexist light, but not really Braga so much. Indeed, Braga does some good work with female characters, Kate Mulgrew even singled him out as the one writer on Voyager's staff who wrote the best Janeway material.

GR taught them well.

"Them?" Roddenberry never spent any time with Braga. By the time Braga started working on TNG, Roddenberry was basically a figurehead who just visited the set to chat with the actors.

I have no love for Berman and Braga, but I'd take anything in The Fifty-Year Mission with a huge grain of salt. They reprinted many inaccuracies about TOS.

Oh yeah, I noticed they printed the story that it was because NBC didn't want a woman with authority that Number One wasn't brought back after The Cage, even though it is a well known fact they were okay with a female second in command, they just didn't want her played by an actress Roddenberry was sleeping with.

That being said, some of the more damning evidence against Berman in that book comes from quotes he actually gave in interviews specifically for that book, including one where he gives his opinion on women. It doesn't reflect well on him at all.

 

[Idran]

It was the culture(and still is) that as a woman you've got to be attractive and yes you have to sleep with the producers/directors/lead actors to get ahead.

Is it degrading? Yes. Wrong? Arguably so. A fact of life? Yes.

Not even mentioning what I think about what you're hopefully-unintentionally implying about Farrell and Ryan here, who cares if it's a "fact of life" or not? That means nothing at all for whether or not it deserves calling out. Just because something is institutional doesn't make it more acceptable. It's no justification whatsoever, it's no better than an excuse for not talking about it.

 

[Spot261]

"Them?" Roddenberry never spent any time with Braga. By the time Braga started working on TNG, Roddenberry was basically a figurehead who just visited the set to chat with the actors.

It wasn't really intended as anything other than mildly ironic

 

[Tracy Trek]

Isn't it true than many times female characters are considered by how they look?

I think I read an article once that Marina Sirtis was constantly pressured about weight. To make sure she always looked good in those skin tight/plunging neckline costumes. I think one of the best ideas they had was to start having her wear a regular uniform.

 

[1001001]

And Hollywood overall isn't?

It was the culture(and still is) that as a woman you've got to be attractive and yes you have to sleep with the producers/directors/lead actors to get ahead.

Is it degrading? Yes. Wrong? Arguably so. A fact of life? Yes.

It doesn't have to be a "fact of life". Accepting it as such perpetuates it. I am sure there are many successful women in Hollywood who did not just accept it as a fact of life.

Trading a job for sex is vulgar and wrong on many levels. And what kind of man could enjoy a sexual encounter knowing the woman doesn't really want to be with you, and is probably at this point disgusted by you?

I hadn't heard these stories about Berman. That's a shame.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

It doesn't have to be. There's a whole Christian film industry that, to my knowledge, doesn't do this.

You want contrast? There was a movie made about 9 years ago starring Kirk Cameron, called Fireproof. It was about a married couple who fall in love again and develop a deep relationship with God. In the scene where Cameron's character Caleb is supposed to kiss his wife Catherine, they actually dressed Cameron's wife in the other actress (Erin Bethea)'s costume and had them do the kissing scene together instead. They filmed it from a different angle in low sunlight so you couldn't tell the difference. (http://www.today.com/popculture/kirk-cameron-ill-only-kiss-my-wife-2D80555063)

Now that's love and devotion.

 

[Voth commando1]

It doesn't have to be a "fact of life". Accepting it as such perpetuates it. I am sure there are many successful women in Hollywood who did not just accept it as a fact of life.

Trading a job for sex is vulgar and wrong on many levels. And what kind of man could enjoy a sexual encounter knowing the woman doesn't really want to be with you, and is probably at this point disgusted by you?

I hadn't heard these stories about Berman. That's a shame.

About half of the practice of modern western society are vulgar, immoral and repulsive.

How many prostitutes are repulsed by their clients?

And whose to say a particularly cynical woman wouldn't at least pretend she enjoyed it if it got her the lead role?

Is it wrong? Of course. How do you solve it? Either draconian morality law or some sort of universal surveillance. IMO

 

[Balok's Decoy]

How many prostitutes are repulsed by their clients?

Comparing actresses who are coerced into sex by their employers to prostitutes is disgusting. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a sex worker, but an actress being coerced or manipulated into sex by an employer who wields power over her is in no way, shape, or form the same thing. At all.

 

[Voth commando1]

Not even mentioning what I think about what you're hopefully-unintentionally implying about Farrell and Ryan here, who cares if it's a "fact of life" or not? That means nothing at all for whether or not it deserves calling out. Just because something is institutional doesn't make it more acceptable. It's no justification whatsoever, it's no better than an excuse for not talking about it.

Jeri was brought on for T&A she was a talented actress and Voyager improved because of her talent and dedication.

Their exists a perception that sci fi fans being overwhelmingly male and 18-30 have quite a lot of frustrated sexual lust any producer would see that as something to exploit.

 

[Voth commando1]

Comparing actresses who are coerced into sex by their employers to prostitutes is disgusting. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a sex worker, but an actress being coerced or manipulated into sex by an employer who wields power over her is in no way, shape, or form the same thing. At all.

Have you ever heard prostitute used as a verb? If you have then what actresses are asked to do fall under that category.

Believe me this is despicable behavior I am not condoning it but acknowledging its pervasiveness.

You don't change the world with a lot of unbridled emotion and righteous anger. You have to look at objectively first.

 

[Voth commando1]

Comparing actresses who are coerced into sex by their employers to prostitutes is disgusting. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a sex worker, but an actress being coerced or manipulated into sex by an employer who wields power over her is in no way, shape, or form the same thing. At all.

Oh and I've said its wrong at least three times now.

 

[Balok's Decoy]

Have you ever heard prostitute used as a verb? If you have then what actresses are asked to do fall under that category.

Believe me this is despicable behavior I am not condoning it but acknowledging its pervasiveness.

You don't change the world with a lot of unbridled emotion and righteous anger. You have to look at objectively first.

Sex through coercion or manipulation is rape. Prostitution is a consensual exchange of sex for payment. They're really not the same in this example.

 

[Voth commando1]

Sex through coercion or manipulation is rape. Prostitution is a consensual exchange of sex for payment. They're really not the same.

Child prostitution? Kidnapping and sexual slavery?

So your totally cool with transactional sex, so long as the bill is payed?

If a man kidnaps your daughter and has her work in a prostitution wring where she gets payed the standard for prostitutes is that coercion? She is getting money for her services?

You need to reflect on your own morality.