If Alice/Beth, Bruce Wayne's cousin, had been tapped as the new Batwoman, the Batsuit would have got a blue paint job to resemble Disney's Alice in Wonderland
Spoilers Batwoman season 3
- Thread starter Enterprise is Great
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I gave up after the first episode. I'm kinda surprised it went as long as it did.
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I don't think Berlanti's idea was wrong, but you got to have the writing to execute it and Dries and her team just didn't have the stories or writing in order to do that. They tried, and sometimes they succeeded, but it ultimately wasn't enough. Changing Kate to Ryan opened up a lot of stories to explore when it came to race and class in addition to just having someone different in the suit who would think and act differently. Perhaps the show didn't do enough changing from Kate to Ryan and just plopped Ryan down into Kate's show without shifting enough early on enough to really reboot it. I think they went for the soft reboot instead, which I get because they were trying to hold on to the fans they had while also hoping the new casting would get more people interested in the show. Outside of some headlines that apparently didn't happen.
To my understanding Wallis Day is LGBTQ and would fit the bill. I do think Sophie as Batwoman though makes a lot of sense. And that would've given her character something to do in Season 3, where she was a bit rudderless without the Crows. Being Batwoman while also working for the Crows could've set up some interesting storylines.
Personally, I don't see them hedging their bets by bringing Day into Season 2. I think they were just ending Kate's storyline and doing it in a way that was supposed to secure Ryan as the legitimate Batwoman going forward. Day's Kate was there to pass the torch. But it is an interesting notion that the showrunners would have done something like that. However, I think if they had changed Leslie for Day that might have created a self-inflicted backlash.
I agree that the series stayed too rooted in Kate's time on the series, but I can also see how they would be skittish to let Alice go. Alice had to be the fan favorite character of the series, and maybe they were afraid that if they wrote her out, that would collapse a large part of the fanbase. It was like they took one big bold step with the new casting, but only because Rose gave them no choice, but then got real cautious about upsetting the apple cart further.
Rose exiting actually provided an opportunity to shake things up more. I would've loved to see a legit successor show to Arrow and Black Lightning, and Batwoman could've melded them both, while also having the benefit to being part of the Bat Family.
Wallis has refused to publicly comment on her sexual orientation beyond a declaration that "Being straight, bisexual or gay is NOT a choice" that she made in 2017.
I thought I had read differently before. But I stand corrected.
Finally. 51 episodes was to much. The show got well under a million viewers each week since like the second season. Why the kept that dumpster fire of the show going is beyond me. Finally its gone. The critical drinkers videos get more views and he's just in youtube. Enjoy the video.
That's just silly. What if the first episode is the worst episode of the series, and every episode after is amazing?
I never understood giving up on something after a single episode. What if your first TNG episode was Code of Honour or something bad like that?
I knew some Star Trek fans who gave up on TNG after watching "Encounter at Farpoint", and never regretted it, no matter what their TNG-watching friends said about the series improving seasons later. In other words, some people consider their time valuable, and if they're burned and/or promised something special that turns out to be the opposite on the quality meter, then its not surprising to see them bail after one episode.
Then I would miss out. While I may not agree with @Saul very much on this point I do. There is no reason to waste time on something I don't enjoy.
Well put. I just don't see how it's not understandable to give up on a show after not caring for one episode. There are too many shows out there to see to justify holding on and hoping.
I've sometimes given up on a show after an episode or two, then heard rave reviews of it later on, given it another chance, and become a fan. Syfy's The Magicians is an example that comes to mind.
I generally give a series a three episode grace period IF I'm interested in the subject matter to begin with. I also have a general rule that if a show I've been watching for a while has three episodes in a row that actively bore me, then I'm usually out too. Life's too short and there's so much good material out there that I really don't feel the need to waste my time watching shows I don't like anymore. I sat through all of X-Files, Lost, Heroes, BSG, and GoT mostly out of misguided loyalty and affection to what those shows had been, even when the warning signs were all there that they were spiralling (to varying degrees of course.)
All that said, if I go into something blind, or if I'm already iffy about it, then one episode is enough for be to decide if I want to continue.
As for Batwoman; It's never been "good" on any level, but it's mostly been watchable. Honestly Alice was the only thing that kept me watching and even then it was often very touch-and-go.
I'm actually not caught up on the latest season, so quick straw poll for those that are: are the last three or four episodes worth bothering with?
For context: I limped across the finish line for Supergirl and honestly, I kinda wish I'd never bothered. I already dropped out of 'Legends of Tomorrow' a season or two back and I'm seriously considering not bothering with Flash's new season either.
All that said, if I go into something blind, or if I'm already iffy about it, then one episode is enough for be to decide if I want to continue.
As for Batwoman; It's never been "good" on any level, but it's mostly been watchable. Honestly Alice was the only thing that kept me watching and even then it was often very touch-and-go.
I'm actually not caught up on the latest season, so quick straw poll for those that are: are the last three or four episodes worth bothering with?
For context: I limped across the finish line for Supergirl and honestly, I kinda wish I'd never bothered. I already dropped out of 'Legends of Tomorrow' a season or two back and I'm seriously considering not bothering with Flash's new season either.
I thought the first two seasons were good (and was really impressed by how the second season recovered from an acrimonious cast shake-up), but after a promising start, the third season was a study deterioration. None of the last few episodes are going to be better than the ones that made you lose interest in sticking with the show. Hell, it would’ve taken some spectacular reactions here for me to come back for season 4, if it had happened.
Yeah, but that didn't happen. In the past I have dropped out of a TV show and the buzz and excitement over later episodes got me to come back. It didn't happen here. There are also too many things to watch and too many things that I want to watch. I'd rather give time to those then waiting for a show to maybe get good. From the first episode of Batwoman there was noting that impressed me, not the story, characters, acting or production quality. There would have to be a massive change in the show to get me to come back. But since this is the CW I wasn't expecting that to happen.
You know what? I think it actually was my first TNG episode
Hard to say. I liked it better than the first episode of Batwoman and in those days there were 4 TV stations. I just watched what was on TV. I didn't have the black hole of choice that I do now.
I'm rewatching Arrow.
8 seasons in a month.
Near the end, just started Crisis, and the Batwoman crossover.
Old rich man with a broken dick makes his butler/ward (bitchy Luke) walk around the house half naked. I say broken dick, because over compensating impotence with men can be larger than life, or at least an 80 thousand dollar sports can and a trophy wife half his age.
Trauma aside, deep down, this is a gay Batman.
8 seasons in a month.
Near the end, just started Crisis, and the Batwoman crossover.
Old rich man with a broken dick makes his butler/ward (bitchy Luke) walk around the house half naked. I say broken dick, because over compensating impotence with men can be larger than life, or at least an 80 thousand dollar sports can and a trophy wife half his age.
Trauma aside, deep down, this is a gay Batman.
Well, it is Kevin Conroy.
Reading through this thread got me going back through old episodes. The truth is that this show never lived up to expectations. This first season was mediocre at best and disappointing most of the time. Rose's departure and COVID are what probably gave this series a third season. It did have some moments and some characters I liked, but I stayed with it to the end mostly because I am a DC fan. Bird of Prey was a better series than this.
It really depends on the person about giving shows a chance or a second or even third (or more chances). When it comes to Batwoman I gave up on the series after the very first episode. But once I heard about the recasting, I went back to season 1 and looked at the finale, but then watched most of Season 2. After Season 3 started I went back and looked at the rest of the second season and liked it better-overall-than I did the first time I looked at it. I don't think Batwoman was a great series, and struggled often to be a good series, but it had a likable cast, not bad costuming (I particularly liked the Batwoman costumes for both Rose and Leslie), decent production values, and it attempted some social commentary, which I take for it trying to be topical or mean something more than just superhero adventuring. Of course, it's very debatable about how good or effective they were at writing social commentary and weaving it into a superhero action-adventure series, but I'll give them a bit of credit that they made the attempt.
Despite the bad ratings Batwoman got, Hollywood Reporter had an article that proposed a different reason for why Batwoman was really canceled.
Mad About The CW Cancellations? Blame Streaming – The Hollywood Reporter
Just saw this article:
CW Boss on 'Shock' of Cancellation Spree: 'We Encouraged Producers to Treat Their Finales as Series Finales' (yahoo.com)
I think that the Batwoman writers did as Pedowitz suggested and sort of did make their season finale work as a series finale as well. Wilder had become Batwoman in her own right, she had Wayne back, she had found her birth mother and new love with Sophie. Alice also seemed to have some redemption and even Mary's time as Poison Mary was in the rearview. Luke also had grown as Batwing. There was still lots of stories that could be told, but still I think the season three finale worked as a series' end fairly well. And the door is open for all the characters to appear on the Arrowverse series that are left.
Perhaps less satisfying for fans of the series, there's also opportunities to see the characters again in comics (like the Arrowverse Earth-3 comic out now), novels, video games, or animation.
Despite the bad ratings Batwoman got, Hollywood Reporter had an article that proposed a different reason for why Batwoman was really canceled.
Mad About The CW Cancellations? Blame Streaming – The Hollywood Reporter
Just saw this article:
CW Boss on 'Shock' of Cancellation Spree: 'We Encouraged Producers to Treat Their Finales as Series Finales' (yahoo.com)
I think that the Batwoman writers did as Pedowitz suggested and sort of did make their season finale work as a series finale as well. Wilder had become Batwoman in her own right, she had Wayne back, she had found her birth mother and new love with Sophie. Alice also seemed to have some redemption and even Mary's time as Poison Mary was in the rearview. Luke also had grown as Batwing. There was still lots of stories that could be told, but still I think the season three finale worked as a series' end fairly well. And the door is open for all the characters to appear on the Arrowverse series that are left.
Perhaps less satisfying for fans of the series, there's also opportunities to see the characters again in comics (like the Arrowverse Earth-3 comic out now), novels, video games, or animation.
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I think you mean the Earth Prime comic.
