Spoilers Batwoman - Season 1
- Thread starter dahj
- Start date
TVLine is absolutely one of the most reputable sources for TV news on the internet, so if they say it's been confirmed, it's pretty much a guarantee.
Why get rid of Kate Kane the character just because of a recast? The majority of the hanging plot threads from Season 1 are all about her. The entire plot at this point revolves around her (Alice's revenge, Jacob wanting to kill Batwoman not knowing who she is, etc). Both movies and shows have had to recast in the past and have worked out fine. I legitimately think that I'll just drop Batwoman if they get rid of the character of Kate Kane, because there really is no point to the show anymore. They will have wasted an entire season and then just dropped the majority of the plot threads for no real reason.
If this is true, it will easily be the stupidest decision that any of these CW shows have made. I guess I'll be back to just watching The Flash next season. The Arrowverse really is just dying at this point, and it feels like its down to bad leadership/lack of ability from the people running all of these shows.
If this is true, it will easily be the stupidest decision that any of these CW shows have made. I guess I'll be back to just watching The Flash next season. The Arrowverse really is just dying at this point, and it feels like its down to bad leadership/lack of ability from the people running all of these shows.
I wonder if the new character is to allow TPTB to hire an actress of a different race.
I don't mind a new character, I just want Kate Kane back too, for the reasons outlined above. Too many storylines revolve around her, her family and her ex-loves.
Maybe we can see Kate lighten up in season 2 because she finds her "Robin".
I don't mind a new character, I just want Kate Kane back too, for the reasons outlined above. Too many storylines revolve around her, her family and her ex-loves.
Maybe we can see Kate lighten up in season 2 because she finds her "Robin".
^ Kate is gone, and so is the entire existing premise and conceptual structure of the series.
Which is frustrating, baffling, and extremely disappointing.
Which is frustrating, baffling, and extremely disappointing.
If there was a sexual relationship found between Batwoman and Robin, the same old questions will definitely rise up about how much Batman loves Dick.
Actually, if Ruby is giving up the show as Batwoman, for perhaps physical reasons... Kate could still be a guest character from time to time, if it's explicit that she cannot ever be Batwoman ever again for "reasons".
Or, you know, you could wait and see how this plays out before judging.
If Kate Kane the character is gone, I don't have any reason to watch anymore. I thought that Ruby Rose was only ok as an actress so I don't mind her leaving, but the show needs Kate Kane. Besides the fact that she is the actual Batwoman and I don't support the CW shows trying to replace actual characters with OCs, the plot threads I like are all about her. I don't care about the stuff with Hush pretending to be Bruce, or the stuff with Luke Fox or the step sister, I don't hate that stuff but I don't tune in for it. With the character gone, the show is basically done for me. I'm not tuning into a "Batwoman in name only" show.
For an example from the CW shows, I would never have watched that Green Arrow and the Canaries show if it had been made, because Oliver Queen was the only Arrow/Green Arrow that I cared about.
I have to say, I never believed I would see the day where I agreed with both Fives and Digific in the same thread.
As much as it pains me to agree with @kirk55555, he's 100% right in this particular instance.
The entire series is based around Kate Kane being the person in the Batwoman suit.
The entire series is based around Kate Kane being the person in the Batwoman suit.
I actually agree with the Fives on this one as well. The only thing the supporting cast has in common is their connection to Kate, and other than the murder of Lucius Fox every plot thread hinges on Kate's character.
No, what @CorporalClegg was responding to was explicitly a discussion about character substitution, while recasting. Perhaps you noticed it was about recasting while failing to notice it was also moreover about character substitution.
In particular:
The native Kate Kane to the Prime Universe, is already dead.
Earth 1 Kate Kane has been pretending that her new friends and family on Earth Prime are the same old friends and family from Earth One, when they are not.
Earth 1 Kate Kane man-slaughtered Earth Prime Kate Kane, when she "arrived" and if her Earth Prime friends and family know about this, they are being extraordinarily cool about it.
She is as foreign to these people as the second Beth that was running around, that all the earth prime People, and Kate were designating "not our Beth, not the real Beth" becuase she was from a parallel earth, just like Earth One Kate Kane.
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Almost, but not quite. There's a fair amount of stuff in Sophie's life that isn't about Kate -- her struggle with her identity and coming out, her tensions with Jacob and the Crows, her relationship with Julia. There's also that thing they seeded with Julia and the mystery woman she's working for, who I gather is a major antagonist from the comics and was probably going to be introduced next season anyway. Meanwhile, Jacob is still Alice's father, and Mary's her stepsister, so there are still family dynamics to build on there even without Kate at the center. And weren't there some hints of romantic sparks between Luke and Mary?
Granted, losing Kate does take away a lot, especially just when "Bruce Wayne" is seemingly returning. But there are other angles they can develop with the remaining characters, plus whatever new story possibilities arise from the new lead.
I'm still skeptical this is indeed the way they're going. It just seems like unnecessarily complicating something that should be rather straightforward, and also from a production standpoint I can't imagine both the CW and HBOMax just said "fine, whatever, just remove the main character you sold us the show on, who cares."
All of those little story beats are threads in a wider tapestry that is woven around Kate.
Remove her from the equation, and no other character has a storyline that has any meaning or relevance.
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Rarely have I seen a growing, strong TV series shoot itself in the foot as quickly as Batwoman. Whatever internal politics led to Rose leaving was bad enough (and I do not see the series moving beyond that in the grand scheme of things), but this latest rumor is simply assbrained. It appears the showrunners missed the past 50+ years of Bond history regarding maintaining continuity of the main character even as the actors portraying him were replaced.
I doubt any on-screen explanation for Kate's absence will ever work, including pulling some throwaway plot out of their collective asses such as Kate--after the coming Hush/fake-Wayne's scheme--is conned into following bait to another city as Batwoman, leading to a trap set by Alice--one that ends her life. No matter how it goes, I see this as the showrunners--despite whatever rumored issues they had with Rose--realizing letting her go / firing her was the worst of all bad decisions, so they are trying to wipe both character and actress from history.
Agreed. Kate did not put her resume' on LinkedIn hoping to land an available superheroine job. Batwoman became a way to express her identity, strengthen her relationship with Bruce (and he means nothing to the series without the relative who confided in him), was on a strained path to understanding with Jacob and was the body which gave purpose to the others orbiting her, particularly Luke, who was the natural successor to his father's position with Kate as Lucius was with Bruce (obviously). That was one of the can't miss elephants in the room that was successfully driving the series, and now that's lost.
I doubt any on-screen explanation for Kate's absence will ever work, including pulling some throwaway plot out of their collective asses such as Kate--after the coming Hush/fake-Wayne's scheme--is conned into following bait to another city as Batwoman, leading to a trap set by Alice--one that ends her life. No matter how it goes, I see this as the showrunners--despite whatever rumored issues they had with Rose--realizing letting her go / firing her was the worst of all bad decisions, so they are trying to wipe both character and actress from history.
If they really don't want to recast Kate Kane, then I thought of two other possibilities they could have gone with. Just have Luke Fox become Batwing, that would lose them the lesbian lead, but at least they would then have an established comic book superhero in the lead, and having a black male lead would give them a member of an under represented group as the new lead.
The other thing that occurred to me is to just cancel Batwoman, and set up a Batgirl series that is set in the same version of Gotham, so that way they could at least still keep some of the supporting cast around. If she already has a history as Batgirl before the show, then that could be enough to at least keep Luke around since they'd probably know each other, and Jacob Kane could stick around since any vigilante operating in Gotham would probably end up in conflict with the Crows. They could have Babs around the same age as Mary and they were friends, the only one that's a bit harder to find a connection for would be Alice.
The other thing that occurred to me is to just cancel Batwoman, and set up a Batgirl series that is set in the same version of Gotham, so that way they could at least still keep some of the supporting cast around. If she already has a history as Batgirl before the show, then that could be enough to at least keep Luke around since they'd probably know each other, and Jacob Kane could stick around since any vigilante operating in Gotham would probably end up in conflict with the Crows. They could have Babs around the same age as Mary and they were friends, the only one that's a bit harder to find a connection for would be Alice.
I'm sure the producers have reasons for their decision that we aren't privy to. After all, we're just spectators devoting occasional moments of idle thought to the question here and there between dealing with our own jobs and lives, and we've only been thinking about it for a week or two. But for them, it's their actual full-time job to figure this out, and they probably knew about Rose's departure long before it was announced (the fact that it was revealed just after the de facto season finale makes it pretty clear they were sitting on the news until then). So they've devoted enormously more time to thinking about this than any of us have, and thus they probably know what they're doing better than we do. Anything we can think of now is probably something they already considered and discarded.
Hard to keep up with all the rumors. My first thought when having a new character as lead surfaced was it was really just an added complication to explore - Who is Batwoman?
Similar to what happened post Death of Superman. Where four different Supermen appeared but no one was really him. Or how the Batman writers used Knightfall to show that Jean Paul Valley as a very different Batman to appreciate Bruce Wayne more.
Maybe that is what is really happening here. Recasting always raises questions - are they going to do a direct copy of the previous actor or actress? Or their own completely separate take.
Perhaps having a 2nd very different Batwoman character is a way of clearly defining who a recast Kate Kane/Batwoman is without Ruby Rose.
Maybe wishful thinking. I can not imagine the show working without Kate Kane. It’s more than that the supporting cast relationships revolve around her. I do not think this is that strong of a cast! I am not sure if it’s the casting or writing of the characters. The show is still new. Maybe that feeling will change in time.
As unimaginable as it is to think if Stephen Amell, Grant Gustin or Melissa Benoist had left their series, I think those shows could have continued without them. It would not have been easy. But those shows have great supporting casts. I think Diggle could have been lead. Or Cisco, Wally, or Alex or J'onn. With still having strong backup characters.
Similar to what happened post Death of Superman. Where four different Supermen appeared but no one was really him. Or how the Batman writers used Knightfall to show that Jean Paul Valley as a very different Batman to appreciate Bruce Wayne more.
Maybe that is what is really happening here. Recasting always raises questions - are they going to do a direct copy of the previous actor or actress? Or their own completely separate take.
Perhaps having a 2nd very different Batwoman character is a way of clearly defining who a recast Kate Kane/Batwoman is without Ruby Rose.
Maybe wishful thinking. I can not imagine the show working without Kate Kane. It’s more than that the supporting cast relationships revolve around her. I do not think this is that strong of a cast! I am not sure if it’s the casting or writing of the characters. The show is still new. Maybe that feeling will change in time.
As unimaginable as it is to think if Stephen Amell, Grant Gustin or Melissa Benoist had left their series, I think those shows could have continued without them. It would not have been easy. But those shows have great supporting casts. I think Diggle could have been lead. Or Cisco, Wally, or Alex or J'onn. With still having strong backup characters.