Spoilers Batwoman - Season 1
- Thread starter dahj
- Start date
Nocturna--uncharted territory for this kind of series, and I am wondering if it will fit at all.
The only one? You sure, because...Also, Nocturna next week.
The one case where I'm 110% in favour of not staying true to the comics storyline
Sue Dibny just showed up on 'The Flash'...
Exaggerating for effect, I admit, there's loads in comics history that deserve to be chucked out.
Didn't click on the spoiler cause I haven't seen it yet, but probably that too whatever it is.
Oh it's one of those alright. Probably one of the most notorious on the DC side of things...
Anyway; what's the deal with Nocturna? Not that familiar with the character beyond the general "is really pale and invented by the same author of Moon Knight" (who I'm also not that familiar with...) and I think there was soem goofy story about her adopting Jason Todd?
The particular storyline had her hypnotize Kate into having sex with her and then when the issue of consent was raised by the readers the writer, instead of dealing with it, unironically had the villain ramble on for pages explaining to everybody that she really wanted it because you cannot do anything while hypnotized that you don't really want to in what can only be described as a completely oblivious and tone deaf way.
See, this kind of thing is partly why I'm not sorry I stopped following the mainline stuff just before the New 52/Flashpoint era came in. I think a lot of 'One Year Later' is what killed if for me.
Not that there wasn't crap before that, but there was a definite ratio shift around that time...
Batwoman's New 52 run was pretty good up until the abrupt writer change. And even then it wasn't as bad as that rest of the time. And the Rebirth run was also good if brief, so for her entire publishing history the good to bad ratio is somewhere on the higher end of the list.
I find this not having Batman be around to be something that might affect how this show's regarded badly; at least have him show up a season in, to explain why he disappeared. And those that don't like Batman..well, without him, there'd be no Batwoman.
If everybody were to remember this saying, things wouldn't be so heated.
If everybody were to remember this saying, things wouldn't be so heated.
Last edited:
Honestly I didn't even get very far into her first run. I think I was mostly still salty about what they were doing to Cassandra Cain...
Batwoman
Season 1 - Episode 13 - "Drink Me"
Kate/BW: I guess Kate cannot be blamed for not believing in vampires, but her disbelief made her an easy mark for Nocturna.
How wrongheaded could one woman be? She's telling Alice she has a chance to start over? What about all of her victims? The showrunners' "sisterhood" push breaks any sense of realism. making Kate appear less than heroic. I would like to think her speech to Alice was her true turning point, but...
Luke: As always, his relationship with Kate is fun to watch; he was particularly funny being creeped out by Kate needling him with Nocturna's lip-biting business. So, he's never laid eyes on Sophie until now? He certainly perked up by the sight her in that dress, leading him to conclude a woman who looks like that had to have dumped Kate. Heh. reaction to that was priceless.
Nocturna / Natalia Knight: Draining a guy's blood into containers...a bit reminiscent of a scene from The Return of Count Yorga (AIP, 1971).
Alice: Sort of floating in this episode, and I doubt Kate has lost her devotion to the killer. Alice's mind game about a certain grade of blood should not have worked on Nocturna at all, since--as she pointed out--she's heard it all before whenever people are being drained. Further, there's no way should be able to find Mary and know she would leave some club at just the right moment to be distracted by a completely random woman seemingly drunk. Pretty bad plotting, and the showrunners trying to find a reason for Mary to still be on the show.
Speaking of finding reasons for her to be on the show, her "detective" work in uncovering Batwoman's secret ID was nonsense. Kate mentioning being drugged is an experience not unique to her at all, nor is the fact BW and Kate happen to be lesbians. It was such a Herculean leap (the case with most things about Mary) like her being able to even understand what was happening to Alt-Beth, when everything about Alt-Beth's being was beyond the understanding of most. Kate has no duty to tell her anything, and should not accept prying eyes, or constant intrusion
Jacob: Great. The entire prison arc ends, but his resentment of Batwoman only intensified after the death of Alice. I can imagine what he will do when Alice is "resurrected" sooner or later. He was right to come down on Sophie; her own obsessive feelings compromises her job, and she actually believed she could convince Jacob that her two-faced actions were in the service of the city. He has no reason to ever take her back.
Sophie: Sophie's unending stares and emotional problems of her own making drag down every scene. She's apparently incapable of doing her job because of a dead relationship (and has no remorse for deceiving her husband). ..and Kate refusing to let that go makes her a total predator. Since Sophie pretty much said she would throw her career/life's work away (and finish crapping on her husband) for Kate, this makes both characters not at all ethical.
NOTES: A
GRADE: B-
Season 1 - Episode 13 - "Drink Me"
Kate/BW: I guess Kate cannot be blamed for not believing in vampires, but her disbelief made her an easy mark for Nocturna.
How wrongheaded could one woman be? She's telling Alice she has a chance to start over? What about all of her victims? The showrunners' "sisterhood" push breaks any sense of realism. making Kate appear less than heroic. I would like to think her speech to Alice was her true turning point, but...
Luke: As always, his relationship with Kate is fun to watch; he was particularly funny being creeped out by Kate needling him with Nocturna's lip-biting business. So, he's never laid eyes on Sophie until now? He certainly perked up by the sight her in that dress, leading him to conclude a woman who looks like that had to have dumped Kate. Heh. reaction to that was priceless.
Nocturna / Natalia Knight: Draining a guy's blood into containers...a bit reminiscent of a scene from The Return of Count Yorga (AIP, 1971).
Alice: Sort of floating in this episode, and I doubt Kate has lost her devotion to the killer. Alice's mind game about a certain grade of blood should not have worked on Nocturna at all, since--as she pointed out--she's heard it all before whenever people are being drained. Further, there's no way should be able to find Mary and know she would leave some club at just the right moment to be distracted by a completely random woman seemingly drunk. Pretty bad plotting, and the showrunners trying to find a reason for Mary to still be on the show.
Speaking of finding reasons for her to be on the show, her "detective" work in uncovering Batwoman's secret ID was nonsense. Kate mentioning being drugged is an experience not unique to her at all, nor is the fact BW and Kate happen to be lesbians. It was such a Herculean leap (the case with most things about Mary) like her being able to even understand what was happening to Alt-Beth, when everything about Alt-Beth's being was beyond the understanding of most. Kate has no duty to tell her anything, and should not accept prying eyes, or constant intrusion
Jacob: Great. The entire prison arc ends, but his resentment of Batwoman only intensified after the death of Alice. I can imagine what he will do when Alice is "resurrected" sooner or later. He was right to come down on Sophie; her own obsessive feelings compromises her job, and she actually believed she could convince Jacob that her two-faced actions were in the service of the city. He has no reason to ever take her back.
Sophie: Sophie's unending stares and emotional problems of her own making drag down every scene. She's apparently incapable of doing her job because of a dead relationship (and has no remorse for deceiving her husband). ..and Kate refusing to let that go makes her a total predator. Since Sophie pretty much said she would throw her career/life's work away (and finish crapping on her husband) for Kate, this makes both characters not at all ethical.
NOTES: A
GRADE: B-
How exactly did Jacob get cleared again? I missed something.
When I saw the promos for a vampire episode, I thought it was a sign that they were bringing the show more into line with the post-Crisis world of weirdness, but it turned out there was a mundane explanation for Nocturna's vampiric qualities. (And one that brings back old memories. I once had a medical treatment for a melanoma that gave me a temporary case of porphyria so I had to avoid sunlight for several weeks. I got a neat fedora out of it.)
Given how things turned out, it's ironic that Mary figured out Kate was Batwoman but Sophie still apparently hasn't. You'd think she would've recognized her for sure when they kissed, at least. And I don't see how Kate can pursue that without taking the mask and wig off. Well, I guess technically those are the parts of her costume she could keep on without them getting in the way, but still...
When I saw the promos for a vampire episode, I thought it was a sign that they were bringing the show more into line with the post-Crisis world of weirdness, but it turned out there was a mundane explanation for Nocturna's vampiric qualities. (And one that brings back old memories. I once had a medical treatment for a melanoma that gave me a temporary case of porphyria so I had to avoid sunlight for several weeks. I got a neat fedora out of it.)
Given how things turned out, it's ironic that Mary figured out Kate was Batwoman but Sophie still apparently hasn't. You'd think she would've recognized her for sure when they kissed, at least. And I don't see how Kate can pursue that without taking the mask and wig off. Well, I guess technically those are the parts of her costume she could keep on without them getting in the way, but still...
I think it's kind of funny that Kate can just make social calls on Alice whenever she wants. I can see where some might find her annoying but I don't mind her plus she seems to be the only one who cares that Alice killed her mother.
What's odd is I swear she already knew but I must have confounded something.
I dunno, maybe Sophie would be into that.
She figured it out, but Kate got Julia Pennyworth to pretend to be Batwoman while Kate was there too, throwing Sophie off the trail.
Even funnier is that she seems to take the stairs when the Batsignal is on...there's just something fundamentally wrong about that.
I don't know if it's deliberate to show she's still new at this (despite technically being at it for well over a year at this point) or it's the lack of creativity behind the camera that's also responsible for the rather limp fight scenes.
Last edited:
Mouse's father probably testified to spite is him and Alice.
Been a bit busy so only just got round to seeing it, but as luck would have it there was no new episode this week so I've managed to catch up and I'll have a shorter wait till the next one so I guess all turned out for the best. 
Really enjoyed this one, don't mind that re-imagined Nocturna isn't an actual vampire, found her quite interesting in fact (though kinda sad for Kate that she didn't get the chance to go full-Buffy
), Kate's bar is cool, nice that it's finally open and hope we see more of its lovely gothy queerness in the coming weeks and Alice continues to be one of the best villains in the Arrowverse.
Mary, however, was the definite MVP in this episode, not only is she the bestest wingwoman, but I love that she figured out Kate being Batwoman by herself, and I especially liked that her last clue was that she's a lesbian
Never found the whole idea of the case against Jacob being super-strong to be even remotely plausible, so I'm glad that's over with, but it did end a bit abruptly considering the show was trying to sell how very desperate his situation was for the past few weeks.
Really enjoyed this one, don't mind that re-imagined Nocturna isn't an actual vampire, found her quite interesting in fact (though kinda sad for Kate that she didn't get the chance to go full-Buffy
), Kate's bar is cool, nice that it's finally open and hope we see more of its lovely gothy queerness in the coming weeks and Alice continues to be one of the best villains in the Arrowverse.Mary, however, was the definite MVP in this episode, not only is she the bestest wingwoman, but I love that she figured out Kate being Batwoman by herself, and I especially liked that her last clue was that she's a lesbian
Never found the whole idea of the case against Jacob being super-strong to be even remotely plausible, so I'm glad that's over with, but it did end a bit abruptly considering the show was trying to sell how very desperate his situation was for the past few weeks.
OK, so I haven't seen the latest episode, but I have seen the one before it and I'm really confused. I don't understand why Beth and Kate were dying when we've seen tons of dopplegangers of the same people together and on The Flash all repeatedly, and we even just had the whole episode with all of the different Brainys on Supergirl just a week or two before this one aired.
I have to admit, I was surprised by the reveal that the plastic surgeon is Mouse's father, but I also wasn't giving him a whole of thought before the reveal.
The end with Beth surviving only for him to kill her was a shock.
I have to admit, I was surprised by the reveal that the plastic surgeon is Mouse's father, but I also wasn't giving him a whole of thought before the reveal.
The end with Beth surviving only for him to kill her was a shock.