Bad Language in Discovery

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Jamie Calderhead, Oct 21, 2017.

  1. MakeshiftPython

    MakeshiftPython Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2013
    Location:
    Baja?! I haven't got anything in Baja!
    Since when has a burrito not been generic? It's a pretty common food product.
     
  2. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk A Spock and a smile Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2001
    Location:
    AI Generated Madness
    Way to miss the point. Of course TOS gave us Space Hippies.

    The same as reason as any piece of fiction. It's the way real people talk.

    You're reading way more into the food choices than the writers ever did. Yeah some were character bits. Other were just ordinary things like chicken sandwiches and coffee or a burrito. They're exist to show the characters are just like us.

    Teen profanity? :lol: Are you for real? Seriously. You think profanity, burritos and a song that's two decades old, that samples a song that's four decades old is designed to appeal to young people? :guffaw:
     
    Kor, nightwind1, Greg Cox and 4 others like this.
  3. SolarisOne

    SolarisOne Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Well, it was certainly clear she thought so. Just a bunch of goddamn technobabble bullshit to me. ;)

    First time I watched that scene, I bursted out laughing. Of course, wordplay's kinda my thing--I'm the guy who literally couldn't breathe while watching and rewatching the Taxi scene where Christopher Lloyd asks "Whaaaaat doooooes a yeeeeeeellow liiiiiiiight meeeeeeean?" YMMV.

    I miss the tea and Shakespeare and classical music concerts, damn it! *pout*

    Touché. :techman:
     
  4. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk A Spock and a smile Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2001
    Location:
    AI Generated Madness
    We two cats that are called dumbass and double dumbass.
     
    nightwind1 likes this.
  5. marsh8472

    marsh8472 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2016
    Technically the bad language and other phrases they use do not jibe well with TOS. Phrases like "Seriously??", "Don't get your panties in a bunch", and "this is so fucking cool" are not the kind of phrases we ever heard in the original series. Kirk and Spock were also out of place when trying to use curse words in Star Trek 4. They did it to make the characters more relatable to today's generation at the price of making them unrelatable to the original series.
     
  6. Greg Cox

    Greg Cox Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Location:
    Lancaster, PA
    As opposed to Kirk joking about dipping little girl's pigtails in inkwells? Or calling the ship's doctor "Bones" like the '"sawbones" in an old TV western?

    TOS's dialogue sounded casual and colloquial to audiences in the 1960s, just as DISCO's dialogue sounds casual and colloquial to audiences in 2017. It's all about not sounding stiff and stilted just because you're in the future.
     
  7. marsh8472

    marsh8472 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2016
    I figured Kirk called Mccoy "Bones" because of what Mccoy said in Star Trek 2009 regarding his ex-wife taking everything in the divorce and "all he had left was his bones". But yeah they make them sound 2017ish and not TOSish. The price for that is it feels less like they're really in the same era as TOS. Ah well, suspension of disbelief again
     
  8. Greg Cox

    Greg Cox Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Location:
    Lancaster, PA
    That explanation was a retcon, due to the fact that the modern audiences aren't familiar with the term "sawbones," so the reboot movie had to come up with a brand-new explanation for the "Bones" thing. But that certainly wasn't the intent back in the 1960s, when westerns were all over TV, and STAR TREK could expect viewers to understand why the ship's doctor was called "Bones."

    The "divorce" explanation came along forty years after the fact, so that doesn't change the point that TOS was using an old slang term back when it first aired. (Heck, the original series never once mentioned that McCoy was divorced.)

    So who knows? Maybe forty years from now, "fucking cool" will sound archaic and the reboot of DISCOVERY will have to invent some new explanation for why Tilly says it. :)
     
    Markonian, Satron and Ovation like this.
  9. marsh8472

    marsh8472 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2016
    SPOCK: Your use of language has altered since our arrival. It is currently laced with, ...shall I say, ...more colourful metaphors. 'Double dumb ass on you' ...and so forth.
    KIRK: You mean profanity. That's simply the way they talk here. Nobody pays any attention to you if you don't swear every other word. You'll find it in all the literature of the period.

    It's kinda funny because Star Trek 4 takes the opposite approach they make the language of the 23rd century not fit in with the past. But if Discovery goes back in time to 2017 they'll fit right in.
     
    Satron likes this.
  10. Commishsleer

    Commishsleer Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2013
    Location:
    Backwaters of Australia
    If they made TOS now they'd probably use colourful language.
    I'd much rather see swearing than "panties in a twist" or Uhura's farm animal remark in 2009. These seem crude to me.
    Maybe I am a Grandma after all.:lol:
     
  11. MakeshiftPython

    MakeshiftPython Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2013
    Location:
    Baja?! I haven't got anything in Baja!
    Were there threads like this in 2009 when Kirk said "bullshit" to Spock Prime?

    I swear, some folks are just LOOKING for things to not like in DISCO and make a mountain out of a mole hill, however incidental.

    I'm surprised nobody is upset that beer pong was featured. I mean, that game was never shown in any iteration of Trek, so it must be a canon violation. Am I doing this right? Oh, and burritos, because I live in a world where burritos were only associated with "youth culture".
     
    Turtletrekker and Satron like this.
  12. ralfy

    ralfy Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2013
    When I thought about this, I realized that although young viewers would have recognized the terms "bones" because they saw Westerns when they were kids (and that Westerns were still being shown when TOS was shown, not to mention the point that some describe TOS as a western set in space), it was probably not the type of terms they used when they talked to each other, especially teens. I think the latter would have used terms like "dig," "bummer," "outta sight," and "skirt," and a bit later words like "groovy," "skank," and "a gas".

    What is more unusual is that several main characters of TOS were not teenagers, so that plus the circumstances that they found themselves in (not just a human race but a generally elite team organization exposed to so many alien cultures and discovering even more) would have lead to the use of such language...fascinating. :hugegrin: For some reason, this reminds me of several funny scenes from Nutty Professor with Del Moore.

    Given that, I'd imagine that Tilly's character was made to use such speech in the same way hippie-like characters did in one of the latter episodes from TOS: a shortcut by the writers to depict the characters as young, and probably with bonus points if young viewers get it. But if the purpose is to show that such terms in general are still in wide use in that imaginary future (even given Tilly's quick apology for the outburst), then I'd expect characters like Lorca to blurt out similar profanities. And maybe even the Klingons can do similar. It would be like a mash-up of Goodfellas and Friends in space, with Vulcan-raised characters like Burnham raising their eyebrows frequently. :lol:
     
  13. MakeshiftPython

    MakeshiftPython Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2013
    Location:
    Baja?! I haven't got anything in Baja!
    I take it you still think having a character say "fucking" must be some tactic to appeal to youth culture rather than the most likely reason being that it's just a common phrase warm blooded adults use every now and then?

    I mean, I'm pretty sure "fucking" was as commonly used in the 1960s as is today. The only big difference is that television in certain sections, out of reach from uppity parents, are no longer arbitrarily restricted from uttering that word. I'm pretty sure if 1960s television didn't have restrictions over certain words we would have heard an f-bomb in Star Trek.
     
  14. Kor

    Kor Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2001
    Location:
    My mansion on Qo'noS
    I would also like to know what exactly burritos have to do with... anything. :wtf:

    Should we declare ENT non-canon because there was a reference to Hoshi eating soba noodles, which also never appeared in TOS?

    Kor
     
  15. Ovation

    Ovation Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2003
    Location:
    La Belle Province
    Well, of course. How could you possibly support letting such an affront to canon stand unchallenged? :scream::censored::klingon::mad:


    :lol::lol::lol:
     
    Kor likes this.
  16. ralfy

    ralfy Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2013
    Well, it did involve Tilly, who based on her character is one of the youngest in the group. I think the only thing missing was the high rising terminal and use of words such as "like."

    Next, I don't think it was commonly used in the 1960s, and isn't commonly used today. By that, I mean the use of profanity to describe almost everything by generally all age groups in all circumstances.

    Finally, given your argument, we should have seen that f-bomb across various TV shows during the last few years. Why didn't it show up? Probably because the use of language isn't ultimately driven by being "uppity" but by other factors.
     
  17. ralfy

    ralfy Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2013
    Most likely short cuts to develop characters plus create familiarity for the audience. Thus, one character uses "fucking cool" and apologizes quickly after to create the impression of inexperience. Burritos are used because most U.S. viewers are familiar with it, and it has been part of a steadily growing food trend for some time, but not often seen as something eaten by those who want to be healthy. Club music alluding to disco is finally used to reinforce the youthfulness of the STD crew, even though they are supposed to be part of some "black ops."
     
  18. MakeshiftPython

    MakeshiftPython Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2013
    Location:
    Baja?! I haven't got anything in Baja!
    Nobody was ever going to utter "fucking" on UPN.
     
  19. Agony_Boothb

    Agony_Boothb Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    There are people on this very board who had issues with the crew having a party. Apparently it was unprofessional or 'not starfleet' or something else equally anally retentive.