Babylon 5 vs Deep Space Nine
- Thread starter EmoBorg
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I voted DS9 straight down until I got to the villains. The shadows and the Psyche core were much better than the Dominion IMO as a villain.
Also, the friction between Londo and Gkar being multi-dimensional good and bad throughout the series also made them as protagonists much more interesting than any villainous character on DS9
Also, the friction between Londo and Gkar being multi-dimensional good and bad throughout the series also made them as protagonists much more interesting than any villainous character on DS9
I'd place Avery Brooks notoriously bad overacting against Bruce Boxleitner's notoriously bad overacting any day of the week.
DS9:
Cast
B5:
Everything else
Pretty tough to choose as they're both honestly my favourite sci-fi shows of all time*. But I think DS9 was a more quality production, especially in terms of acting.
Would never say one was particularly better than the other, though. Different strengths.
* Apart from Stargate. O'Neill could take both those clowns.
Cast
B5:
Everything else
Pretty tough to choose as they're both honestly my favourite sci-fi shows of all time*. But I think DS9 was a more quality production, especially in terms of acting.
Would never say one was particularly better than the other, though. Different strengths.
* Apart from Stargate. O'Neill could take both those clowns.
At least with Brooks he got better as the series progressed whereas IMO Boxleitner was bad at the start through the finish.
I have to disagree with that.
In the beginning, he was acting as Captain Skippy. Even his voice over in the opening credits reflected this. Later, as he grew into the role, and the role grew into him, he was so much better, so much more entertaining. He was pretty awesome.
Brooks, on the other paw, seemed more bored the longer he went on. By the time season 7 came around, he looked like he was desperate to leave every time he was on screen.
Not to mention (and I know Omaha knows this), Sheridan was deliberately written at first to work with the audience's expectations of a lightweight based on his previous roles.
I never gave much thought to Boxleitner's acting ability until the scene with Kosh in "Interludes and Examinations". Especially considering his actin partner was a mobile shower curtain.
Jan
I voted a lot of B5, but kept wanted to add a "but..."
The thing is, at its peak, B5 captivated my attention & interest more than DS9. I thought the story was more epic & exciting (and dare I say, a fair bit higher in concept) and I was well & truly hooked. But (there it is again), it didn't sustain the peak. Neither did DS9, mind you, but it was very good for about 4/5 years and average over 2/3, whereas B5 was utterly superb for two seasons, average for a couple and pretty poor in the last series.
I don't really like comparing them too; it's just good that we had two such fun series to watch.
The thing is, at its peak, B5 captivated my attention & interest more than DS9. I thought the story was more epic & exciting (and dare I say, a fair bit higher in concept) and I was well & truly hooked. But (there it is again), it didn't sustain the peak. Neither did DS9, mind you, but it was very good for about 4/5 years and average over 2/3, whereas B5 was utterly superb for two seasons, average for a couple and pretty poor in the last series.
I don't really like comparing them too; it's just good that we had two such fun series to watch.
Just couldn't resist:
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNTxr2NJHa0[/yt]
I put down Babylon 5 for best Plot and and DS9 for best commander. The other categories, i abstained (but should have voted for both -- missed that instruction).
The plot of Babylon 5 was essentially a 5 year arc -- something relatively new & innovative for TV, and we could really see the benefits of it over the years.
I think Sisko was better commander -- in terms of how he was portrayed and written. For example, i REALLY appreciated the family relaitonships with his father & son. 3 different people (in terms of caeer choice, for example), but completely believable as close family who love & respect each other.
I would add in another category: impact on Fandom. And Babylon 5 would win, IMHO. For example, the term Lurkers has gone way beyond Babylon 5 . (Also the importance/value of story arcs).
And I still think Deep Space 9 ripped off the general CONCEPT of Babylon 5, but still created a great show in its own right, with some unique qualities of its own, and in some ways the best of the Trek series.
Both series especially has some AMAZING actors, especially among the secondary cast.
I am glad both existed, and wish SyFy would air both of these again on TV.
The plot of Babylon 5 was essentially a 5 year arc -- something relatively new & innovative for TV, and we could really see the benefits of it over the years.
I think Sisko was better commander -- in terms of how he was portrayed and written. For example, i REALLY appreciated the family relaitonships with his father & son. 3 different people (in terms of caeer choice, for example), but completely believable as close family who love & respect each other.
I would add in another category: impact on Fandom. And Babylon 5 would win, IMHO. For example, the term Lurkers has gone way beyond Babylon 5 . (Also the importance/value of story arcs).
And I still think Deep Space 9 ripped off the general CONCEPT of Babylon 5, but still created a great show in its own right, with some unique qualities of its own, and in some ways the best of the Trek series.
Both series especially has some AMAZING actors, especially among the secondary cast.
I am glad both existed, and wish SyFy would air both of these again on TV.
Due largely to the fundamental difference is how the two shows were handled (B5 generally laid out in advance, DS9 improvising to a large degree), I don't care to compare the two in that manner.
Cast-wise, they both had their strengths and weaknesses, so again, I don't feel there's a good basis for an overall statement. I'm gay, but a Kira-Ivanova fight would be gangbusters.
Sheridan probably beats out Sisko for speechifying, but Sheridan may have been a bit too much of the Ideal vs. Sisko's Realistic (we're all well-aware that he was willing to get his hands dirty).
The Shadows (well, their ships) were the major reason I got into B5 initially, but as a threat they're vaguely simplistic (EVIL!!!) compared to some of the dynamics of the Dominion...nevermind that those dynamics never got to the point of fundamentally altering the direction of the story.
I call it too close to call.
Cast-wise, they both had their strengths and weaknesses, so again, I don't feel there's a good basis for an overall statement. I'm gay, but a Kira-Ivanova fight would be gangbusters.
Sheridan probably beats out Sisko for speechifying, but Sheridan may have been a bit too much of the Ideal vs. Sisko's Realistic (we're all well-aware that he was willing to get his hands dirty).
The Shadows (well, their ships) were the major reason I got into B5 initially, but as a threat they're vaguely simplistic (EVIL!!!) compared to some of the dynamics of the Dominion...nevermind that those dynamics never got to the point of fundamentally altering the direction of the story.
I call it too close to call.
Babylon 5 is my all time favorite television show. DS9 on the other hand hasn't aged well but at the time it was my gateway to sci-fi. The only advantage I would give to DS9 is better pilot, better production values (but I think B5 looks great!), and more personable villains, since B5 villains were usually distant non-characters.
Babylon 5 had a much better plot, and stuck with it for most of the series run. DS9 felt all over the place going from the Dominion, to the Klingons, back to the Dominion, and starting with the Bajorans which they abandoned because many complained they were too boring.
DS9 had a better everything else though: commander, cast, and Villain. I kind of wished the Shadows were more developed other than the Evil "What do you want" guys. In fact, I had wished they had used Morden more in terms of "speaking for the shadows" then they had (And I actually just saw his first episode, Signs and Portants" last night). The Dominion were well developed, and had such an array of great characters like Wayoun, the female founder, and the various Jem'Hadar.
I love both shows, but neither are my favorite shows of all time. That honor goes to Farscape, which would wipe out this competition in all four attributes.
DS9 had a better everything else though: commander, cast, and Villain. I kind of wished the Shadows were more developed other than the Evil "What do you want" guys. In fact, I had wished they had used Morden more in terms of "speaking for the shadows" then they had (And I actually just saw his first episode, Signs and Portants" last night). The Dominion were well developed, and had such an array of great characters like Wayoun, the female founder, and the various Jem'Hadar.
I love both shows, but neither are my favorite shows of all time. That honor goes to Farscape, which would wipe out this competition in all four attributes.
I agree that the Shadows were distant but B5 also had other villains like Mr Morden (sinster), Emperor Cartagia (crazy) and Alfred Bester (malevolent). They were not really distant.
I have to disagree with this as well. The Shadows were far from one-dimensional, or evil. As with the Vorlons, they have a philosophy that says their way is the right way. Other races will evolve through chaos and disorder. They are helping the universe by introducing the needed chaos. Without them, other races would stagnate and, if anything, de-evolve.
The Vorlons believe in order. They set the rules that others must follow, and are happy to manipulate other races, right down to their genetic structure, to make that happen. They have been manipulating races for millenia, creating racial images and memories that make beings see Vorlons how they want to be seen, inspiring awe and worship.
Neither side is evil, neither side is good. They simply are. Contrast that with the Dominion, which simply wanted to destroy everything that was not like itself. Now those folks were one-dimensional. Ironic for shape shifters.
While my comparison of the Shadows to EVIL!!! was perhaps a simplification, my point was that while the Dominion had at least three separate races comprising it, all of which were shown on occasion as having their own dimensions and not necessarily being in accord with the whole, the Shadows were never shown as having that level of complexity.
You never saw a Shadow speak out against the rest of its race, for instance.OTOH we saw both Jem'hadar and Vorta who disagreed with the Dominion's overall policy.
You never saw a Shadow speak out against the rest of its race, for instance.OTOH we saw both Jem'hadar and Vorta who disagreed with the Dominion's overall policy.
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