Yes, their personal past is safe, but that wasn't their past where they went to in the movie.
Spoilers Avengers: Endgame grade and discussion thread
- Thread starter The Nth Doctor
- Start date
Yes, their personal past is safe, but that wasn't their past where they went to in the movie.
We don't know that. We have no way of knowing what happened between the Loki beatdown scene and the moment Thor took Loki back to Asgard. No one ever mentioned it before, but that doesn't mean Loki didn't 'almost' escape their grasp. His fondness for making fun of Cap would guarantee that everything Future Cap did there would be remembered as Loki impersonating Cap. And Tony's heart attack would obviously be chalked up to his recent near death experience.
We also have no reason to believe that Nat and Clint weren't always on Vormir in that place and time or that Hulk didn't always have a chat with the Ancient One during the battle of New York.
The Morag scene is more problematic, but it's not by any means impossible that Star-Lord got knocked out for a few minutes and just thought he slipped and hit his head or something - we don't see every moment of his time on Morag in GotG, anyway. And it's also counterbalanced by Old Steve, who clearly did travel back to his own past and live in it for decades.
We saw Thor take the bridge back to Asgard with Loki in Avengers 1. There's like a ten minute window for them to catch him if he had gone missing in the original movie.
A past is changing, but not their past, and although it doesn't impact on the travellers in the past, while they are in the past, the present they return to is subject to the changes the made, just like Marty McFly came back to the wrong parents and the wrong car/truck in the garage.
Making new timelines is fine.
It's only bad when you take infinity stones through time, and a single timeline is left without a full set.
And even then it's only bad from the perspective of an ancient omniversal protector, because something unknown might happen eventually maybe.
A past is changing, but not their past, and although it doesn't impact on the travellers in the past, while they are in the past, the present they return to is subject to the changes the made, just like Marty McFly came back to the wrong parents and the wrong car/truck in the garage.
Making new timelines is fine.
It's only bad when you take infinity stones through time, and a single timeline is left without a full set.
And even then it's only bad from the perspective of an ancient omniversal protector, because something unknown might happen eventually maybe.
Booked my ticket for Sunday afternoon, had to search around for the right times to get the best seat! If I could get up early in the morning and see the 8,30am show I would, the cinema would be empty!
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I definitely think the implication is Steve going to the past was already part of the timeline. Kids with Peggy in photos could be nieces/nephews.
I think the Steve we see would be around 110 or older
27 years old when frozen in ice
thawed out in 2011 and this movie took place in 2023(+5 years from 2018 infinity war)
So that puts Steve at 39 years old when he returned to if not the 1940s, certainly looked 1950s
So the Old Steve could possibly even be 117 if he went back to 1945. Having waited 78 years for that moment in 2023. The super soldier serum giving him a longer lifespan like the guard in the Green Mile.
I think the Steve we see would be around 110 or older
27 years old when frozen in ice
thawed out in 2011 and this movie took place in 2023(+5 years from 2018 infinity war)
So that puts Steve at 39 years old when he returned to if not the 1940s, certainly looked 1950s
So the Old Steve could possibly even be 117 if he went back to 1945. Having waited 78 years for that moment in 2023. The super soldier serum giving him a longer lifespan like the guard in the Green Mile.
Must have been one hell of a conversation with Peggy when he presumably told her about his experience in the future.
„... and that one time, in band camp, when I made out with your niece who hasn’t been born yet...“
„... and that one time, in band camp, when I made out with your niece who hasn’t been born yet...“
I hope you'd be right. I went on Thursday at 7am in Seoul and the theater was getting packed. They take their Marvel films kind of serious here.
I don’t think Steve went back in their past, just a past. Otherwise why does that instance not follow the rules of the others? If the travel means were identical, he went to another reality amd shifted back maybe after Carter passed away and had no reason to stay.
"Before We Go" was excellent- he's definitely got talent as a director.
And no one noticed him at the funeral in Captain America: Civil war? Young Cap was kissing Old Cap's niece in law. and she let him? If Young Cap was still holding a romantic candle for Peggy why did he lip kiss Sharon?
But Captain America changed his past! Did the Winter soldier events still happen?
So all along there were two Steve Rodgers, the married one and the Avenger's one?
Time travel , too confusing!
If it's the kid they hang on for a bit that you didn't recognize, it's the little kid from Iron Man 3
There's no indication in the movies that the Super Soldier treatment slowed his aging, though. In the comics, yes. But not in the movies (Evans has aged a bit from 2011 to now).
As for Sharon, for all we know she got dusted too or they realized it wouldn't work out between them.
Hawkeye and his family, we seem them get snapped. Hawkeye misses it because he literally has his back turned. It was pretty brutal.
Thank you! Sucks I missed that.
Alright here is my short review for final score B+ (oh so close to an A-)
The Good
-Cold open with Hawkeye and family, both amazing and heart-wrenching
-Amazing closing for Iron Man and Captain America arcs
-Amazing battles throughout
-No timeline reset. All the dusted have been un-dusted 5 years into the future.
-The ancient one scene with the Hulk
-Captain America wielding Thor's hammer
-Thor's dialog throughout
-Thor's scene with his mother
-Tony with Howard scene in 1970s. John Slattery is amazing actor, he should be featured more in future MCU (just figure out a way)
-Imposter past Nebula bringing Thanos and his ship into the present. I was, "oh shit, here he comes!"
-No mid-credit or any end-scenes of any kind. I kinda found it funny how rest of theater groaned and was pissed off. I didn't mind it at all.
The Bad
-Original Thanos went out like a little b*tch. I wanted him to put up more of a fight.
-All of time travel shenanigans just handwaved away. Does it matter what you do in the past? What doesn't matter? Grandfather paradox apparently ain't a thing. How did Cap return the soul stone? How did he put back the space stone into the Tessaract? And where is Loki?
-Hawkeye/Black Widow trying to sacrifice for each other. Just didn't closely have the same impact as Thanos/Gamora scene in Infinity War
-All females super heroes saving Spiderman. I get it, we live in 2019 but don't hit me over the head with it.
-Professor Hulk, he just didn't do it for me.
-The middle act was too long and too slow. Pacing of the movie was off many times. Infinity War did not have this issue
-Captain Marvel was a complete disappointment. She was pretty useless or missing through most of the movie.
The Ugly
-Hulk/Ant-man scene with kids wanting a photo with the Hulk
-Captain Marvel's new haircut. No, nope, nah-ah
Overall, amazing movie, but I just can't give it higher than a B+. It's right there around 88%-89% percent grade. A little bit more and it would get A-
It's not better than Infinity War, and that one was a solid A. Yes, they accomplished a lot in this movie. They closed many arcs. They could have really screwed it up, so commending them for giving us a good, very good movie. It's just not the best movie of all time.
P.S.
BBL! Bring Back Loki!
The Good
-Cold open with Hawkeye and family, both amazing and heart-wrenching
-Amazing closing for Iron Man and Captain America arcs
-Amazing battles throughout
-No timeline reset. All the dusted have been un-dusted 5 years into the future.
-The ancient one scene with the Hulk
-Captain America wielding Thor's hammer
-Thor's dialog throughout
-Thor's scene with his mother
-Tony with Howard scene in 1970s. John Slattery is amazing actor, he should be featured more in future MCU (just figure out a way)
-Imposter past Nebula bringing Thanos and his ship into the present. I was, "oh shit, here he comes!"
-No mid-credit or any end-scenes of any kind. I kinda found it funny how rest of theater groaned and was pissed off. I didn't mind it at all.
The Bad
-Original Thanos went out like a little b*tch. I wanted him to put up more of a fight.
-All of time travel shenanigans just handwaved away. Does it matter what you do in the past? What doesn't matter? Grandfather paradox apparently ain't a thing. How did Cap return the soul stone? How did he put back the space stone into the Tessaract? And where is Loki?
-Hawkeye/Black Widow trying to sacrifice for each other. Just didn't closely have the same impact as Thanos/Gamora scene in Infinity War
-All females super heroes saving Spiderman. I get it, we live in 2019 but don't hit me over the head with it.
-Professor Hulk, he just didn't do it for me.
-The middle act was too long and too slow. Pacing of the movie was off many times. Infinity War did not have this issue
-Captain Marvel was a complete disappointment. She was pretty useless or missing through most of the movie.
The Ugly
-Hulk/Ant-man scene with kids wanting a photo with the Hulk
-Captain Marvel's new haircut. No, nope, nah-ah
Overall, amazing movie, but I just can't give it higher than a B+. It's right there around 88%-89% percent grade. A little bit more and it would get A-
It's not better than Infinity War, and that one was a solid A. Yes, they accomplished a lot in this movie. They closed many arcs. They could have really screwed it up, so commending them for giving us a good, very good movie. It's just not the best movie of all time.
P.S.
BBL! Bring Back Loki!
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Ah I wondered who that was!
They subverted all the typical time travel tropes. Current Nebula killed her past self, she didn't disappear. Captain America kicked his own "american" past ass's self, etc etc etc. Those events had no impact on "current" avengers. That is, their past didn't change. Whatever happened, still happened. Somehow.
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Exactly. It doesn't matter if it "makes sense" ...the movie went to great pains to explain (to us) that we should not expect the rules of time travel to be the same ones we've seen in other movies. Going into the past does not alter their present. (Except the scene with the Ancient One does make that point a little murky.)
Quantum Realities, plucking objects from the past and using them to do things in the future, killing past selves of people you already killed later, everything just gets forced back into the one timeline (somehow) and that's all she wrote.
Quantum Realities, plucking objects from the past and using them to do things in the future, killing past selves of people you already killed later, everything just gets forced back into the one timeline (somehow) and that's all she wrote.
