Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks etc
- Thread starter TheMasterOfOrion
- Start date
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
*wants chocolate*
*wants chocolate*
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
Understatement... so far so bloody AWESOME :-D
Understatement... so far so bloody AWESOME :-D
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
No Super Bowl here :-S
No Super Bowl here :-S
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
Metalcore band avatars stand still for noone.
and dont be sorry, I have cricket and aussie rules football.
Metalcore band avatars stand still for noone.
and dont be sorry, I have cricket and aussie rules football.
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
I don't think it impossible to do a story with existing trek canon, but it would be difficult. I mean everything is so connected and programmed a certain way. I remember reading a film critics review of Nemesis and he complained about the dialogue of Trek...it never really changed....they were always switching to auxillary power.....shields were down to 50%....too much interference for transporters....etc...
Trek had become a mockery of itself...its own best parody...
It is time for a different take. For someone to take what star trek is and leave out all the extra rules about what it had become..
I don't think it impossible to do a story with existing trek canon, but it would be difficult. I mean everything is so connected and programmed a certain way. I remember reading a film critics review of Nemesis and he complained about the dialogue of Trek...it never really changed....they were always switching to auxillary power.....shields were down to 50%....too much interference for transporters....etc...
Trek had become a mockery of itself...its own best parody...
It is time for a different take. For someone to take what star trek is and leave out all the extra rules about what it had become..
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
Exactly why we need a brand new Trek movie/series with the same characters nad places and stuff but different events, rules and guidelines.
Exactly why we need a brand new Trek movie/series with the same characters nad places and stuff but different events, rules and guidelines.
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
Cloverfield premiered here in Germany last thursday.... with the teaser trailer! Now I could really feel the vibe. Love the look of the new Enterprise, and it made quite an impression on the moviegoers. I hears lots of "ooohs" and "aahs".
It's awsome. I'm happy.
Cloverfield premiered here in Germany last thursday.... with the teaser trailer! Now I could really feel the vibe. Love the look of the new Enterprise, and it made quite an impression on the moviegoers. I hears lots of "ooohs" and "aahs".
It's awsome. I'm happy.
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
I just saw Cloverfield with my "Sci fi is for Lesbos!" sister.
She drooled over the previews of Tony Stark in "Iron Man", Liz in "Hellboy 2", and The Enterprise in the Star Trek XI teaser.
She loved Cloverfield.
Afterwards asked me about Nyota Uhura.
I just saw Cloverfield with my "Sci fi is for Lesbos!" sister.
She drooled over the previews of Tony Stark in "Iron Man", Liz in "Hellboy 2", and The Enterprise in the Star Trek XI teaser.
She loved Cloverfield.
Afterwards asked me about Nyota Uhura.
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
It's very easy to do a story that takes place before TOS because we know very little about that time save a few throwaway lines that could mean a number of different things. Most of Trek history focuses on TOS-Voyager and then some major events like the Eugenics wars and WW3 that happened a couple of hundred years before TOS. We know almost nothing about Spock, Kirk, or McCoy or anyone else pre-TOS besides where they were born, that they went to school, the name of an ex-girlfriend or wife, stuff like that.
As long as you don't directly contradict established events you're good to go. Some people seem to be getting mad because either:
a) events that might happen in this film were never mentioned before and therefore they must be in a different time line, which is illogical and complete bullshit.
b) events might happen in this film that aren't quite like some fans imagined they should have been like, which is also bullshit.
Relying too much on "shields down to 50%" is a problem with the writing, not canon or continuity. A fresh take on making Star Trek doesn't mean that the events that happen during the new film can't be reconciled with the events of the other series and movies.
It's very easy to do a story that takes place before TOS because we know very little about that time save a few throwaway lines that could mean a number of different things. Most of Trek history focuses on TOS-Voyager and then some major events like the Eugenics wars and WW3 that happened a couple of hundred years before TOS. We know almost nothing about Spock, Kirk, or McCoy or anyone else pre-TOS besides where they were born, that they went to school, the name of an ex-girlfriend or wife, stuff like that.
As long as you don't directly contradict established events you're good to go. Some people seem to be getting mad because either:
a) events that might happen in this film were never mentioned before and therefore they must be in a different time line, which is illogical and complete bullshit.
b) events might happen in this film that aren't quite like some fans imagined they should have been like, which is also bullshit.
Relying too much on "shields down to 50%" is a problem with the writing, not canon or continuity. A fresh take on making Star Trek doesn't mean that the events that happen during the new film can't be reconciled with the events of the other series and movies.
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
And which are "Roddenberry's Klingons"? The ones he did in 1966 with a limited budget or the one HE did in 1979 that realized how he envisioned the Klingons? Which one was that?
And which are "Roddenberry's Klingons"? The ones he did in 1966 with a limited budget or the one HE did in 1979 that realized how he envisioned the Klingons? Which one was that?
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
Exactly. In a way, the TOS movies ALREADY reimagined TOS. Not only were the Klingons reimagined, but everything from the ship to the uniforms to the planets were reimagined.
Hell, the "refitting" of the Enterprise in TMP was clearly just an excuse to reimagine the original ship for the big screen. Even with that, I really doubt we were supposed to regard TOS as a literal interpretation of these character's experiences (what with all those fake rocks and 60s effects around them).
It wasn't until MUCH later, for nostalgia purposes mostly, than writers decided that everything in the past really did look exactly like TOS depicted it.
Exactly. In a way, the TOS movies ALREADY reimagined TOS. Not only were the Klingons reimagined, but everything from the ship to the uniforms to the planets were reimagined.
Hell, the "refitting" of the Enterprise in TMP was clearly just an excuse to reimagine the original ship for the big screen. Even with that, I really doubt we were supposed to regard TOS as a literal interpretation of these character's experiences (what with all those fake rocks and 60s effects around them).
It wasn't until MUCH later, for nostalgia purposes mostly, than writers decided that everything in the past really did look exactly like TOS depicted it.
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
I'm fine with some stuff being "polished up." The trick is simple... and if you keep this in mind, everything works out pretty well and everyone is happy.
The trick is to pretend that there's a "real Star Trek universe" and that somehow, folks back in the mid-1960s were doing their best (within budgetary and technological constraints) to COPY that mythical "real" Star Trek.
Obviously, not everything was perfect, or 100% "accurate" to what this mythical "real" Star Trek was like. But everything was targetted at that... so, for instance, the shape of the ship was "accurate." The overall shape/configuration of the Bridge (including color scheme) was right (though some scale tweaks might be justified by virtue of having to fit the set into an existing soundstage). The entire "top ring" area might consist of massive wide-screen flat-panel displays, rather than "windowframes" with one or two sub-windows inside of them. The shapes might be slightly more developed (ie, the railings might be more organically-curved). But generally speaking, assume that they were trying to approximate something REAL... and just didn't "quite" get it right.
Doing a new version would be aimed at hitting that same target. The things you might see that would be different shouldn't change the FEEL of the set... just the level of "polish."
I don't think anyone ever "really" decided that.
I'm fine with some stuff being "polished up." The trick is simple... and if you keep this in mind, everything works out pretty well and everyone is happy.
The trick is to pretend that there's a "real Star Trek universe" and that somehow, folks back in the mid-1960s were doing their best (within budgetary and technological constraints) to COPY that mythical "real" Star Trek.
Obviously, not everything was perfect, or 100% "accurate" to what this mythical "real" Star Trek was like. But everything was targetted at that... so, for instance, the shape of the ship was "accurate." The overall shape/configuration of the Bridge (including color scheme) was right (though some scale tweaks might be justified by virtue of having to fit the set into an existing soundstage). The entire "top ring" area might consist of massive wide-screen flat-panel displays, rather than "windowframes" with one or two sub-windows inside of them. The shapes might be slightly more developed (ie, the railings might be more organically-curved). But generally speaking, assume that they were trying to approximate something REAL... and just didn't "quite" get it right.
Doing a new version would be aimed at hitting that same target. The things you might see that would be different shouldn't change the FEEL of the set... just the level of "polish."
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
I like your raised level of "polish" idea Cary. As already referred to in previous posts, Gene "The Great Bird of the Galaxy" Roddenberry admitted himself that things like "bumpy-headed" klingons in TMP were what he had wanted in TOS if not for budget constraints. I think that some "purists" should ease their own stress levels a bit by allowing that a few big budget style revisions aren't stepping on Gene's vision. I'm glad such talented people are willing to spend so much time and money on Trek forty years on.
TOS style was great in the sixties on $100,000 per episode, but I'm sure G.R. would be the first on the "been there - done that" bandwagon if he was still calling the shots.
I like your raised level of "polish" idea Cary. As already referred to in previous posts, Gene "The Great Bird of the Galaxy" Roddenberry admitted himself that things like "bumpy-headed" klingons in TMP were what he had wanted in TOS if not for budget constraints. I think that some "purists" should ease their own stress levels a bit by allowing that a few big budget style revisions aren't stepping on Gene's vision. I'm glad such talented people are willing to spend so much time and money on Trek forty years on.
TOS style was great in the sixties on $100,000 per episode, but I'm sure G.R. would be the first on the "been there - done that" bandwagon if he was still calling the shots.
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
Actually, it wasn't that GR specified "bumpy-headed" Klingons in TOS, and couldn't have them. He merely wanted Klingons that looked "more alien" than was possible with greasepaint and crepe hair, and the short amount of makeup application time permitted by 60s TV.
Improvements in slip rubber and foam latex technologies between TOS and TMP led Fred Phillips to develop ideas for how to make the Klingons "more alien" in TMP. There was an alien race in one of GR's other pilots which trailblazed head bumps, and this concept was further developed for TMP.
Actually, it wasn't that GR specified "bumpy-headed" Klingons in TOS, and couldn't have them. He merely wanted Klingons that looked "more alien" than was possible with greasepaint and crepe hair, and the short amount of makeup application time permitted by 60s TV.
Improvements in slip rubber and foam latex technologies between TOS and TMP led Fred Phillips to develop ideas for how to make the Klingons "more alien" in TMP. There was an alien race in one of GR's other pilots which trailblazed head bumps, and this concept was further developed for TMP.
Re: Anyone else feeling disappointed with the look, leaks et
I agree with what you say. A lot of angst that people are feeling comes from it not being there way...
What you also say about writing is also true. But I think that the load of the canon was reflected in the oft repeated lines like "shields down to 50%". In other words I think that unimaginary writing was a symptom of a canon that had kind of taken over the show.
I hate to use this analogy, but the Pharisees at the time of Christ were so obsessed with obeying the letter of the law that they created "hedges" or more rules so that they would never get close to breaking the law. And by so doing the law lost all meaning.
As I have read reaction on this board, sometimes I feel the same way about Trek.
I think what abrams is doing is exactly what is needed....some housecleaning and some imagination...
I agree with what you say. A lot of angst that people are feeling comes from it not being there way...
What you also say about writing is also true. But I think that the load of the canon was reflected in the oft repeated lines like "shields down to 50%". In other words I think that unimaginary writing was a symptom of a canon that had kind of taken over the show.
I hate to use this analogy, but the Pharisees at the time of Christ were so obsessed with obeying the letter of the law that they created "hedges" or more rules so that they would never get close to breaking the law. And by so doing the law lost all meaning.
As I have read reaction on this board, sometimes I feel the same way about Trek.
I think what abrams is doing is exactly what is needed....some housecleaning and some imagination...
