Another board talks about Voyager, mainly dislikes.

[Anwar]

Just assumed the show would be consistent within itself. If there was major damage throughout the interior of the ship, I didn't think it would be magically repaired next episode as nothing happened.

In DS9 whenever the station or the Defiant took damage they were both good as new by next episode, even during a war when realistically they shouldn't have the unlimited resources for that.

Frankly, all shows are going have those inconsistencies unless they're written by one guy for most of the episodes or it's a small series where they won't have to worry about things 100 episodes later because they only have 13 or so episodes.

 

[froot]

DS9 did a big war story and no one in the main cast died except the one who had a contract dispute.

No consequences there either.

I guess you hated how Moya in Farscape was an organic ship that could regenerate nearly all damage between episodes as well, hm?

Seriously, if you were expecting the show to be about the crew all becoming space pirates who went around raping the Delta Quadrant, you deserved to be disappointed.

Just assumed the show would be consistent within itself. If there was major damage throughout the interior of the ship, I didn't think it would be magically repaired next episode as nothing happened.

But then again, there is no debating with apologists. You'll always make excuses for anything that happens.

I only watched a little of Farscape, didn't care for it.

There was never any inconsistency in the rest of Trek, even from episode to episode -

Oh... wait.

Apologists? Cripes, man, it's been over 15 years. It's time to let go of the anger. We're just fans. It's just pretend.

 

[Alex1939]

Just assumed the show would be consistent within itself. If there was major damage throughout the interior of the ship, I didn't think it would be magically repaired next episode as nothing happened.

In DS9 whenever the station or the Defiant took damage they were both good as new by next episode, even during a war when realistically they shouldn't have the unlimited resources for that.

Frankly, all shows are going have those inconsistencies unless they're written by one guy for most of the episodes or it's a small series where they won't have to worry about things 100 episodes later because they only have 13 or so episodes.

lol that is not remotely the same thing.


Also I meant to say earlier, consequences don't just mean death. DS9 the consequences were seen in the characterizations and acting. In Voyager Harry Kim was as green in the final episode as he was in the first. He did have 1 or 2 episodes were he seemed to grow but its not like it carried through the series.

 

[Alex1939]

DS9 did a big war story and no one in the main cast died except the one who had a contract dispute.

No consequences there either.

I guess you hated how Moya in Farscape was an organic ship that could regenerate nearly all damage between episodes as well, hm?

Seriously, if you were expecting the show to be about the crew all becoming space pirates who went around raping the Delta Quadrant, you deserved to be disappointed.

Just assumed the show would be consistent within itself. If there was major damage throughout the interior of the ship, I didn't think it would be magically repaired next episode as nothing happened.

But then again, there is no debating with apologists. You'll always make excuses for anything that happens.

I only watched a little of Farscape, didn't care for it.

There was never any inconsistency in the rest of Trek, even from episode to episode -

Oh... wait.

Apologists? Cripes, man, it's been over 15 years. It's time to let go of the anger. We're just fans. It's just pretend.

There was definitely consistency in DS9.

I tend to want more out of my television entertainment and I certainly did not like Voyager with the exception of about a season's worth of good Trek.

I'm not angry about it, but it does make me angry every time I read these ridiculous excuses or "you don't like Janeway because you are sexists". Oh well I don't post at the TrekBBS often or this subforum hardly at all, but I happened to catch the title of this thread.

 

[froot]

Just assumed the show would be consistent within itself. If there was major damage throughout the interior of the ship, I didn't think it would be magically repaired next episode as nothing happened.

But then again, there is no debating with apologists. You'll always make excuses for anything that happens.

I only watched a little of Farscape, didn't care for it.

There was never any inconsistency in the rest of Trek, even from episode to episode -

Oh... wait.

Apologists? Cripes, man, it's been over 15 years. It's time to let go of the anger. We're just fans. It's just pretend.

There was definitely consistency in DS9.

I tend to want more out of my television entertainment and I certainly did not like Voyager with the exception of about a season's worth of good Trek.

I'm not angry about it, but it does make me angry every time I read these ridiculous excuses or "you don't like Janeway because you are sexists". Oh well I don't post at the TrekBBS often or this subforum hardly at all, but I happened to catch the title of this thread.

Certain complaints about that character can occasionally come across as sexist, yes. Her fans are rather more defensive since she's a pretty unique character in Trek (of course, that's a debate for another thread) but not every single person who likes her is going to throw down the sexist flag for complaints about writing.

Ridiculous excuses? Again, this is all pretend, and we're all of aware of this. Sometimes it's fun to come up with ways to explain all the Trek weirdness out there. The overabundance of shuttlecraft and clean hull was pretty silly to me, and I think a lot of fans feel the same way (and make a lot of jokes about it!) but it isn't ridiculous to assume that Voyager gets repaired. The thing did come equipped with replicators, after all, and the crew did a hell of a lot of bartering throughout their travels.

There are DS9 fans who like VOY and vise versa. Or, even (gasp) all five series - I think all five have a different vibe and have something for everyone to enjoy. What's good Trek to you is, perhaps, not good Trek to someone else. Some people prefer the "story-of -the-week" wherein the aliens symbolize some kind of human ill like TOS (and the characters sometimes take a backseat to the moral of the story,) while others prefer the more character-driven drama of DS9, and still others are glad both sorts of stories exist.

I could point out how DS9's treatment of the Defiant itself was anything but consistent - at least we know exactly how many decks Voyager has.

Anyways, it seems odd that you'd come into a subforum based on a show and then be surprised that it's populated by fans. People liking a show you don't like shouldn't make you angry.

 

[DeepSpaceWine]

Yeah, being pissed off at Voyager's inconsistencies after this long is quite absurd. And raging at fans who *gasp* can still enjoy the show is just silly. Most Voyager fans are disappointed with the series in some areas. The shuttles is one point, off-screen repair of damage between episodes is another, but that is outweighed by all the enjoyable stuff they see in Voyager.

And, as others pointed out, other shows aren't consistent either, including Farscape, DS9, TNG, TOS (like Uhura in "The Changeling" or Spock in "All Our Yesterdays"). Any show written by multiple writers is going to have these kinds of issues because a few scripts are in various stages of development at the same time. About the only show that has strong consistency is Babylon 5 and that was written by 1 person except for filler episodes, which were mostly in Season 1 & 2, some in S5. It's part of the nature of television.

What is your motivation coming here and being on offensive in every post? With the heat of your posts, it feels like you're posting from the late '90s or 2001. You're trying to fight a battle from 10-15 years ago. Most people coming from your position, not just here but on any forum, aren't going to persuade anyone. Everyone else just gives a "WTF?" look and continues their usual discussions.

 

[exodus]

DS9 did a big war story and no one in the main cast died except the one who had a contract dispute.

No consequences there either.

I guess you hated how Moya in Farscape was an organic ship that could regenerate nearly all damage between episodes as well, hm?

Seriously, if you were expecting the show to be about the crew all becoming space pirates who went around raping the Delta Quadrant, you deserved to be disappointed.

Just assumed the show would be consistent within itself. If there was major damage throughout the interior of the ship, I didn't think it would be magically repaired next episode as nothing happened.

But then again, there is no debating with apologists. You'll always make excuses for anything that happens.

I only watched a little of Farscape, didn't care for it.

There was never any inconsistency in the rest of Trek, even from episode to episode -

Oh... wait.

Apologists? Cripes, man, it's been over 15 years. It's time to let go of the anger. We're just fans. It's just pretend.

True that!

Why must someone be labeled an "apologist" for having a creative mind like those that write the damn show? Having a creative idea doesn't mean one has ignored the inconsistency, it does mean after 15 years many folks are throwing out ideas to the fanbase to continue post discussion.

After 15 years, how much more agreement that the show had missteps do you need before we can move on to talk about other ideas?

DS9 wasn't without flaw too.
What happened to the the plot that started off the series about finding and returning all the Orbs to Bajor? They completely and openly admit to dropping the ball on Jake.
Didn'tTNG say Trills couldn't use the Transporter, did anybody ever tell Dax?

 

[Alex1939]

lol I'm certainly not pissed off by Voyager's suckiness.

I'm just amazed at the level of excuses people can make for the show. Yes, the torpedo, shuttle, and magical repairs did take away from the atmosphere of the show and my overall enjoyment.


Where did I say every other Trek was perfect and without flaw? Oh yeah I didn't. I'm sure that won't stop you all from telling me how sexist I am because I think Janeway often acted crazy!

 

[froot]

lol I'm certainly not pissed off by Voyager's suckiness.

I'm just amazed at the level of excuses people can make for the show. Yes, the torpedo, shuttle, and magical repairs did take away from the atmosphere of the show and my overall enjoyment.


Where did I say every other Trek was perfect and without flaw? Oh yeah I didn't. I'm sure that won't stop you all from telling me how sexist I am because I think Janeway often acted crazy!

Well, if these things killed the show for you, that's cool; they did for other people too. However, they didn't for some, and that's why we're fans. But this has been said several times now. (LOL at the comment about 2001. Boy, those were the days, yeah?)

There are a few folks here who like Voyager and don't much care for the Janeway character as well, you know. But I'm not entirely sure you've been fully reading these posts, so I'm going to show you, in pictorial form, exactly why I love VOY despite things like magically-rebuilding shuttlecraft.

I present: Mark Herelik's chest hair.

Oh, yeah.

 

[Alex1939]

^ I lol'd.


And by the way even though I am taking shots at Voyager I have no problem that people are huge fans and love the show. We are all different and I have no problems with that.


I just wish I could come into a thread like this (or the "voyager continuity thread") without being called a sexist or being told "well obviously they made new shuttlecrafts in their food replicators, idiot!"

 

[Anwar]

Is it really so horrible to assume they COULD just build stuff? This isn't Galactica where they didn't have replicators and there were no other sentient lifeforms, this is the Trekverse where there are aliens everywhere and we have "Miracle Engineers".

 

[starlitegirl]

I just watched an episode last week where Chakotay states that they had a full of bay shuttlecrafts. I don't remember what it was specifically in reference to - I think it was regarding sending a shuttle somewhere. The statement clearly implies that there were times when they didn't have a full bay of shuttles. Also, if they can build the delta flyer and rebuild the ships every time there's a major battle where they limp through victory, it's safe to deduce that they have the ability to build shuttles. At the very least, they have that much ability. It's rather silly to think they do not. I think the only thing they were truly limited on were the gel packs. That was specifically stated in several episodes. What they had was all they had. Voyager had a resourceful crew. They did not go to a starbase every time they got hit with a torpedo unlike TNG. They fixed it themselves. They did it because they had no other option. They had to learn how to be self-sufficient if they were going to have a 75 year voyage home.

 

[exodus]

lol I'm certainly not pissed off by Voyager's suckiness.

I'm just amazed at the level of excuses people can make for the show. Yes, the torpedo, shuttle, and magical repairs did take away from the atmosphere of the show and my overall enjoyment.


Where did I say every other Trek was perfect and without flaw? Oh yeah I didn't. I'm sure that won't stop you all from telling me how sexist I am because I think Janeway often acted crazy!

Frankly, it just sound like you've come with a chip on your shoulder looking too stir up trouble.

 

[Anwar]

Don't you remember a few years back Exodus? We were having this exact discussion only Alex was a bit more friendly over the matter.

 

[exodus]

Don't you remember a few years back Exodus? We were having this exact discussion only Alex was a bit more friendly over the matter.

Yep, I do.
He must have gotten hit by gamma rays and came back all green and angry.

Misdirected anger is amusing, isn't it?

 

[Anwar]

I suppose it was because back then NuBSG was still going on strong and hadn't petered out after only 2 seasons. Without that, most complaints against VOY fall apart because there's no examples of how it could be done better.

 

[exodus]

I suppose it was because back then NuBSG was still going on strong and hadn't petered out after only 2 seasons. Without that, most complaints against VOY fall apart because there's no examples of how it could be done better.

I liked nuBSG all the way through but having been a fan of the originals, the first two seasons were just them retelling the events from the original series. Plus Voyager & nuBSG are looking at the universe from twp different points. Trek has always been a view of things from a utopian future, so even in the worst situations there is always a possitive solution. Even DS9 ended better for everyone in the end. NuBsg is the point of view of a dystopian future, so even in the end their was a threat of doom lingering on the horizon.
Folks compare them but they come from polar opposite POV's.

 

[Anwar]

NuBSG was a post-apocalyptic story that ended incredibly moronically (not to mention most of the series was ripped off from "Gall Force" to begin with), started to fall apart after two seasons (which shows that the premise of one ship's survival struggles is only good for 2 seasons at most).

VOY was not post-apocalyptic, and thus the characters breaking down like the NuBSG ones did wouldn't make any sense.

 

[ancientone]

Who needs consistency? Don't you know that the writer doesn't use a pen, but a magic wand?

 

[TedShatner10]

A minority of DS9 fans who bag on VOY sometimes do so by comparing their respective 30th anniversary episodes, "Trials and Tribble-ulations" and "Flashback", which seems rather unfair and biased, since "Trials and Tribble-ulations" is one of the better DS9 episodes anyway while VOY's "Flashback" was merely inoffensively average and had one or so ignorable plotholes. VOY had episodes that matched "Trails and Tribble-ulations" in tone and quality, like "The Bride of Chaotica". Gee, some people.

Star Trek: TOS set the standard and at its best holds up very well today, smoothly translating into a very successful blockbuster movie recently, but then again you had Gene Roddenbbery fiercely pissing on the franchise three decades before B&B were accused of doing, with such offensive and stupid dross like "The Omega Glory". No Trek series is unfallable.

There's a difference between discerning between good and bad ST episodes, and being a nerd raging bigot.