Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador kit!

[Captain Robert April]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Cary L. Brown said:

Captain Robert April said:
The presence of that circle on the keel of the Phase II Enterprise kinda confirms to me that, like the same marking on the keel of the TOS ship, the marking is supposed to be a core ejection port (or at least became to be taken as such; it wouldn't be the first time Jefferies cooked up something because it looked good on screen, then did some backward rationalization to come up wtih a technical reason for it, ala the theory behind the registry of NCC-1701).

So, figure that into where Jefferies was thinking of as the location of the intermix chamber.

And considering the same markings show up on the E-A (in homage to the original ship), the same approach can be used to work out the internal arrangement of that ship.

We return you now to your regularly scheduled thread on the original coneptual art for the Ambassador class starship, already in progress.

Well, go back and watch TMP again... those underside markings on the secondary hull were not present at that time.

I don't believe that they were present in TWOK, either, though I'm not certain. I BELIEVE that they were added during the repair job after Bran Ferren's paint job in ST-V, by ILM. Anyone know for certain?

Note that I said "E-A", not "the refit."

Besides, we already know the internal arrangement of the refit. The -A is still a bit of a mystery, since the bridge kept changing and the engine room is completely unlike the TMP version.

 

[Data Holmes]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Captain Robert April said:

Cary L. Brown said:

Captain Robert April said:
The presence of that circle on the keel of the Phase II Enterprise kinda confirms to me that, like the same marking on the keel of the TOS ship, the marking is supposed to be a core ejection port (or at least became to be taken as such; it wouldn't be the first time Jefferies cooked up something because it looked good on screen, then did some backward rationalization to come up wtih a technical reason for it, ala the theory behind the registry of NCC-1701).

So, figure that into where Jefferies was thinking of as the location of the intermix chamber.

And considering the same markings show up on the E-A (in homage to the original ship), the same approach can be used to work out the internal arrangement of that ship.

We return you now to your regularly scheduled thread on the original coneptual art for the Ambassador class starship, already in progress.

Well, go back and watch TMP again... those underside markings on the secondary hull were not present at that time.

I don't believe that they were present in TWOK, either, though I'm not certain. I BELIEVE that they were added during the repair job after Bran Ferren's paint job in ST-V, by ILM. Anyone know for certain?

Note that I said "E-A", not "the refit."

Besides, we already know the internal arrangement of the refit. The -A is still a bit of a mystery, since the bridge kept changing and the engine room is completely unlike the TMP version.

Well, that's only because the set designer changed and they built new sets.

 

[trevanian]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Designer changed between 4 & 5, but not after, so changes from TFF onward are all under the aegeis of Zimmerman.

 

[Data Holmes]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

trevanian said:
Designer changed between 4 & 5, but not after, so changes from TFF onward are all under the aegeis of Zimmerman.

Well... Ok got me there. But the changes between 5 and 6 were director based. :thumbsup:

 

[Adagio]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

I thought that this was going to be for the Ambassador class as seen in "Yesterday's Enterprise", at first. When I saw the pics, I was.....less than thrilled, to be sure.

 

[FalTorPan]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Adagio said:
I thought that this was going to be for the Ambassador class as seen in "Yesterday's Enterprise", at first. When I saw the pics, I was.....less than thrilled, to be sure.

The "Yesterday's Enterprise" Enterprise has already been realized in kit form -- both licensed and unlicensed. This is the first time that Probert's version of the Ambassador-class starship will be realized in 3D -- both in the virtual world and in the real world as a model kit.

No design is everyone's cup of tea. Fortunately it's a big Trekniverse, one in which each of us can find something that we like. This ship happens to be one of the somethings that I like.

 

[Captain Robert April]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

hutt359 said:

trevanian said:
Designer changed between 4 & 5, but not after, so changes from TFF onward are all under the aegeis of Zimmerman.

Well... Ok got me there. But the changes between 5 and 6 were director based. :thumbsup:

That, and there were those TNG sets sitting there not being used, what with the midseason hiatus and all...

 

[GodThingFormerly]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Updated!

If one may ask, what function/s are those blue panels on the dorsal surfaces of the warp nacelles intended to serve?

Probert said:
Wow, thanks for the complements. You obviously know a lot more about that stuff than I do. I'm glad I was able to hit on an idea that worked for both of us.

hutt359 said:
You should talk to TGT more often. His vast knowledge of aerospace industry and scientific realm is most impressive. :thumbsup:

Thank you kindly, Andrew and hutt. My knowledge - such as it is - of speculative astronautics is merely the result of a childhood (and now adulthood) misspent collecting and pondering the volumes of technical writings generated by noted pioneers in the field ranging from Tsiolkovsky to Ehricke. It must be said, Andrew, that the unmatched aesthetic elegance and technological verisimilitude of your hardware design work on ST:TMP was in large part responsible for triggering my disorder.

Cary L. Brown said:
Hey, TGT... what's your background?

Technical background? Undergrad degrees in physics and electrical engineering from UNSW (Australia), a masters in applied mathematics along with a few credits of graduate coursework in observational cosmology from UCLA before becoming gainfully employed in various brief and generally uninspired low-level astrodynamics, satellite constellation design and orbital debris analysis positions with SAIC, SS/Loral and The Aerospace Corporation. In 2001 I landed - thanks to a most improbable application of nepotism - a terrific gig as a satellite systems design engineer at Lockheed Martin Commercial Space Systems (Sunnyvale, CA). Currently I am on an academic sabbatical from LockMart in order to complete my aerospace engineering doctorate at UPenn while also serving as an occasional consultant on LM's end of the GPS/Galileo integration program at their Valley Forge facility.

TGT

 

[USS Mariner]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Shaping up rapidly, though not quite as I imagined.

I do hope it's possible to have the nacelle pylons blend seamlessly into the hull as they do in the painting. Not only does it make sense from a visual-evolution standpoint, it's gorgeous.

And thank you for the package.

 

[FalTorPan]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

The God Thing said:
If one may ask, what function/s are those blue panels on the dorsal surfaces of the warp nacelles intended to serve?

Perhaps they're the next generation of the longitudinal "slats" of unknown purpose which run along the tops of the Excelsior's nacelles. Maybe they're place holders for actual longitudinal slats.

Inquiring minds want to know!

 

[aridas sofia]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

My guess is that they are your basic power stage magnatomic flux chillers.

Or maybe just glowing blue slat things.

 

[Data Holmes]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

aridas sofia said:
My guess is that they are your basic power stage magnatomic flux chillers.

Or maybe just glowing blue slat things.

Sir, these lights keep blinking out of order.

Well, get them to blink in order. :thumbsup:

 

[GodThingFormerly]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

FalTorPan said:
Perhaps they're the next generation of the longitudinal "slats" of unknown purpose which run along the tops of the Excelsior's nacelles. Maybe they're place holders for actual longitudinal slats.

My concern is simply if they are intended to be the radiator component of the warp drive's thermal control subsystem, the emitted photons would generate a small albeit measurable net force on the spacecraft that may under certain circumstances need to be taken into account by the navigation computer. Such would be, in my humblest opinion, an engineering solution best described as inelegant. On the other hand, placing them on the outboard lateral surfaces of the nacelles would completely cancel out the effect.

TGT

 

[aridas sofia]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Why doesn't it surprise me that what was a well-conceived design element on the Enterprise class's nacelles became hokum on the Excelsior? I'm assuming here that a "flux chiller," (a device to regulate some transport phenomenon like heat transfer?), would behave like a "radiator."

Assuming, of course, that they were still flux chillers and not just glowing blue slat things.

 

[FalTorPan]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

The God Thing said:

FalTorPan said:
Perhaps they're the next generation of the longitudinal "slats" of unknown purpose which run along the tops of the Excelsior's nacelles. Maybe they're place holders for actual longitudinal slats.

My concern is simply if they are intended to be the radiator component of the warp drive's thermal control subsystem, the emitted photons would generate a small albeit measurable net force on the spacecraft that may under certain circumstances need to be taken into account by the navigation computer. Such would be, in my humblest opinion, an engineering solution best described as inelegant. On the other hand, placing them on the outboard lateral surfaces of the nacelles would completely cancel out the effect.

TGT

Well, then... maybe they're "warp coil access plates." Perhaps the Ambassador's warp propulsion system represented a significant advance in technology -- but at the cost of a slightly shorter MTBF than in older designs. The access plates would allow coils to be swapped out more quickly.

Just a thought.

 

[Cary L. Brown]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

The God Thing said:

FalTorPan said:
Perhaps they're the next generation of the longitudinal "slats" of unknown purpose which run along the tops of the Excelsior's nacelles. Maybe they're place holders for actual longitudinal slats.

My concern is simply if they are intended to be the radiator component of the warp drive's thermal control subsystem, the emitted photons would generate a small albeit measurable net force on the spacecraft that may under certain circumstances need to be taken into account by the navigation computer. Such would be, in my humblest opinion, an engineering solution best described as inelegant. On the other hand, placing them on the outboard lateral surfaces of the nacelles would completely cancel out the effect.

TGT

Agreed. The best designs, IMHO, are the ones where the apparent "radiator elements" are fully symmetrical. I did that on my ship, for instance (identical radiators on either side of the engine pylons, having a direct projected view of space in both cases.

The 1701(r) has similar guys on the outsides of the nacelle pylons... but they're at an angle. That's probably why there's another small set on the inner surface... to give a balanced, "net-zero" photonic "thrust" effect from those panels.

God, I love it when technical stuff that was done mostly for looks ends up working out right. I wonder... Andrew P, if you're reading this... was that your thought there? Or was that "just for looks?"

 

[Probert]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Cary L. Brown said:
I love it when technical stuff that was done mostly for looks ends up working out right. I wonder... Andrew P, if you're reading this... was that your thought there? Or was that "just for looks?"

Although I have nowhere near the creative genius of the Wright Brothers,... what you're asking me about here is like asking them how a jet engine works and what it would look like. I'm imagining their response would be pretty much what mine is here,... HUH? You'd be asking them to imagine technology only forty years in their future, NOT 300 years. Come on, guys, I'm a visual designer with some industrial design insights, not a theoretical space systems engineer.

The yet-to-be-developed blue thingy on top is simply a carry-over from the previous "design", as a way to continue the design lineage logically from starship to starship,.. nothing more, nothing less. Yes, when I'm conceptualizing future hardware that is based on what we (generally) know & use today, I implore my I.D. education and intuitiveness but when it comes to stardrive systems,... I bring it down to what logically looks like it could be the next stage of technological advancements within that specific 'universe'.

What you're all saying sounds really good to me, so I'll just come up with the way it looks and let you tell me, later, just what I've created.

Andrew-

 

[FalTorPan]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Bringing the discussion back to Earth somewhat (but not all the way -- since this is the Trek Tech forum...)

FalTorPan said:
Although I prefer Probert's take on the design, I like Sternbach's version a great deal, too. As I said in one of my earliest posts in this thread, comparing the two designs is somewhat unfair, because Rick's design was very much constrained by the practicalities of constructing a ship of the week. Andy's design was/is not.

Here are profile drawings of Probert's (unfinished) and Sternbach's (finished) designs.

Both are quite cool.

 

[Turbo]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

As much as I like Sternbach's Ambassador-class ship, I have to say that Probert's design is just gorgeous. And it does provide a much better evolution from Excelsior -> Ambassador -> Galaxy.

Can't wait for the finished model!

 

[Squiggy]

Re: Andy Probert releases prelim plans for USS Ambassador ki

Agreed. I think Sternbach's Amb would've been perfect if it was Connie-Amd-Galaxy...but as it is, meh.