Spoilers An easy explanation for the klingon ship design in Season 1

[Tuskin38]

They've since changed their minds and are in retcon mode.

They didn't change their minds, they're fixing Fuller's mistakes. He's the one who wanted them naturally bald.

They're doing their own thing.

Clearly they're not with what Season 2 has shown us so far.

They had another model but made the choice to reuse the D7/K'tinga. Therefore, it's canon.

And the producers immediately regretted it afterwards. David Goodman even wanted to use it again in Season 2, but Rick Berman said no.

 

[F. King Daniel]

They didn't change their minds, they're fixing Fuller's mistakes. He's the one who wanted them naturally bald.

Fuller was in charge of Discovery and helped shape it. His decisions are Discovery's decisions.

Clearly they're not with what Season 1 and 2 have shown us.

Of course it is. Even season 2 gives us a USS Enterprise incompatible with TOS. A D7 that's infinitely closer than the first Disco version but is still 25% different. They're doing their own thing. But you refuse to accept it because you don't see that it's not a crime.

 

[Tuskin38]

because you don't see that it's not a crime.

Why should I? It isn't a crime.

Fuller was in charge of Discovery and helped shape it. His decisions are Discovery's decisions.

Yeah so? He isn't anymore so they're free to fix his mistakes. They didn't change their minds since the mind that made those changes isn't there anymore.

Even season 2 gives us a USS Enterprise incompatible with TOS. A D7 that's infinitely closer than the first Disco version but is still 25% different.

So? It's the 21st century. Modern designs for a modern audience.

 

[DigificWriter]

Neville Page and Glenn Hetrick both created digital concept art featuring their Klingon redesigns with hair long before Season 1 premiered, so, no, putting hair on the characters for Season 2 is not an attempt to "fix" Bryan Fuller's "mistakes"; it's a natural evolution of what was established and is something that was thought of a long while ago.

 

[Tuskin38]

so, no, putting hair on the characters for Season 2 is not an attempt to "fix" Bryan Fuller's "mistakes"; it's a natural evolution of what was established and is something that was thought of a long while ago.

Uh no, you're wrong there. Either Neville or Glenn said the same thing. Fuller wanted them naturally bald.

Glenn said he pushed Fuller to change his mind, but wouldn't budge.

The whole 'shaving heads for war' idea was thought up for Season 2.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Why should I? It isn't a crime.


Yeah so? He isn't anymore so they're free to fix his mistakes. They didn't change their minds since the mind that made those changes isn't there anymore.

Who says they were mistakes? Their current vision doesn't fit into the old continuity any more than Fuller's did except in the most superficial ways, so I don't see the problem.

So? It's the 21st century. Modern designs for a modern audience.

That's not how continuity works. "Visual reboot" is a reboot.

 

[DigificWriter]

Uh no, you're wrong there. Either Neville or Glenn said the same thing. Fuller wanted them naturally bald.

Glenn said he pushed Fuller to change his mind, but wouldn't budge.

The whole 'shaving heads for war' idea was thought up for Season 2.

Neville Page flat-out said on Twitter that both he and Glenn at one point had done exactly what I said they did.

 

[Tuskin38]

^ Neville Page flat-out said on Twitter that both he and Glenn at one point had done exactly what I said they did.

Just because they designed them doesn't mean Fuller wanted them. John Eaves designed round nacelles for several of his DSC Designs, but Fuller didn't want them.

Who says they were mistakes?

That fact that they happened are mistakes.

Their current vision doesn't fit into the old continuity

It fits fine if you don't overthink it.

 

[Dukhat]

I don't know how you can say that given all the evidence on screen that they do research the canon.

What research was that?

 

[Tuskin38]

What research was that?

I gave examples in my post. Did you not read the whole thing?

Nearly all the Klingon lore in Seasons 1 and 2 came from the previous TV series.

They didn't make all that shit up. They have some really obscure stuff in there too, like the stuff about the Black Fleet, which was only mentioned in a Klingon drinking song in DS9.

 

[DigificWriter]

@Tuskin: I'm not arguing that Fuller rejected concept art of the "new-look" Klingons with hair; I'm saying that because concept art of the Klingon characters with hair existed long before the completion of Season 1, it isn't "fixing a mistake" to use said concept art in Season 2.

 

[Dukhat]

I gave examples in my post. Did you not read the whole thing?

Nearly all the Klingon lore in Seasons 1 and 2 came from the previous TV series.

They didn't make all that shit up. They have some really obscure stuff in there too, like the stuff about the Black Fleet, which was only mentioned in a Klingon drinking song in DS9.

I was talking about the ship designs, which is what this topic is about.

 

[Tuskin38]

@Tuskin: I'm not arguing that Fuller rejected concept art of the "new-look" Klingons with hair; I'm saying that because concept art of the Klingon characters with hair existed long before the completion of Season 1, it isn't "fixing a mistake" to use said concept art in Season 2.

It's fixing a mistake because Fuller refused to use it before.

I was talking about the ship designs, which is what this topic is about.

Fuller mandated that the Klingon ships not look like anything from the previous series.

Since he's gone they can ignore that mandate.

 

[Dukhat]

Fuller mandated that the Klingon ships not look like anything from the previous series. Same with the flat Fed ships and square nacelles.

I would love to see the actual quote where Fuller says this.

 

[DigificWriter]

It's fixing a mistake because Fuller refused to use it.

I disagree.

 

[Tuskin38]

I disagree.

But I'm agreeing with you.

I would love to see the actual quote where Fuller says this.

It comes from the DSC Klingon Ship designers. There is no direct quote from Fuller.
It's mentioned in the Eaglemoss booklets with the Klingon ships.

 

[Dukhat]

It comes from the DSC Klingon Ship designers. There is no direct quote from Fuller.

It's in most, if not all of the Eaglemoss booklets with the Klingon ships.

Yes, it's very easy for someone else to place blame on Fuller when he's not around to stand up for himself. As far as I'm concerned, it's all hearsay.

 

[Tuskin38]

Yes, it's very easy for someone else to place blame on Fuller when he's not around to stand up for himself. As far as I'm concerned, it's all hearsay.

Why would they lie? They have no reason to. They designed the ships, they'd know what the mandates were.

 

[F. King Daniel]

That fact that they happened are mistakes.

One man's choice is another man's mistake.

It fits fine if you don't overthink it.

I thought Trek was meant to stimulate thought

 

[Dukhat]

Why would they lie? They have no reason to. They designed the ships, they'd know what the mandates were.

Because nobody liked their designs, so they felt they needed to make up some bullshit as to why they look the way they do without the blame being placed on them? Because, you know, that never happens.

 

[fireproof78]

I thought Trek was meant to stimulate thought

Stimulate thought is fine. But it seems that some stimulation involves finding every reason to discredit DSC work.

Because nobody liked their designs, so they felt they needed to make up some bullshit as to why they look the way they do without the blame being placed on them? Because, you know, that never happens.

I do not understand the need to expect the worst in people.