qft.
A Shatner thought
- Thread starter Lonemagpie
- Start date
qft.
Star Trek VI was a grand send-off. Generations was not. The death in Generations was meaningless and served as thematic support for the TNG story that involved Picard's family burning in a fire.
The Undiscovered Country was a grand send-off for TOS and All Good Things was a grand send-off for TNG. Unfortunately, they had to give us Generations and Nemesis to leave a bad taste in our mouths. I wish there were a way to say goodbye to Shatner-Kirk and undo the garbage that was Generations. I also think TNG ought to have another movie. But I don't know if either scenario happening is enough to bring in the kind of dollars Paramount now wants to make on Trek.
I really can't imagine a way Shatner-Kirk could be involved with this new young cast and think it could diminish the very interesting and creative way that Leonard Nimoy was brought back. The Nimoy thing worked perfectly I think. I don't want to see it tarnished despite my desire to see Shatner play Kirk one last time.
The Undiscovered Country was a grand send-off for TOS and All Good Things was a grand send-off for TNG. Unfortunately, they had to give us Generations and Nemesis to leave a bad taste in our mouths. I wish there were a way to say goodbye to Shatner-Kirk and undo the garbage that was Generations. I also think TNG ought to have another movie. But I don't know if either scenario happening is enough to bring in the kind of dollars Paramount now wants to make on Trek.
I really can't imagine a way Shatner-Kirk could be involved with this new young cast and think it could diminish the very interesting and creative way that Leonard Nimoy was brought back. The Nimoy thing worked perfectly I think. I don't want to see it tarnished despite my desire to see Shatner play Kirk one last time.
Oh, I'm perfectly happy with him not being in it. Just thought it'd have been an amusing addition to the references scattered throughout the film
nokiafuturephon
Lieutenant
I think that he could have played Kirk. With some CGI they could have made him look young again.
They made Picard look young in that X-Men movie with CGI. I don't see why they couldn't do it with Kirk too.
They made Picard look young in that X-Men movie with CGI. I don't see why they couldn't do it with Kirk too.
Wait... William Shatner is what Star Trek is all about? When did I miss this memo?
Lightinspire
Lieutenant Commander
There will be no rest as long as Kirk is dead.
Lightinspire
Lieutenant Commander
As many as it takes until his retirement or his death has some kind of meaning of making a difference.
Okay, I suppose you can argue about Generations. Granted, we didn't know or particularly care about the people in the Viridian system. But, still, Kirk died saving the lives of 230,000,000 people. And, frankly, I think the fact that he was willing to sacrifice himself to save the lives of people he had never met and had no connection to was even more of show of his character than were he trying to save Earth.
But, putting Generations aside, you don't think he went out making a difference in TUC? He stopped the assassination of the Klingon chancellor, exposed a conspiracy within the heart of the Federation, led the way to many people to change their minds and put aside old hatreds, and made it possible for there to be peace between the Federation and the Klingon Empire.
Regardless of whether you like the movies or not, I just don't see how you can look at TUC and Generations and say that Kirk -- who was given not one but two farewell pictures -- did not go out in a way that made a difference or had any meaning.
x2
As much as I love Shatner, I think it's perfectly fine that he's not in the movie. Nimoy is much more self controlled and could resist trying to steal the show. But Shatner is a grade A #1 ham....and I just don't think the new cast needed that hanging around.
It is clear that the new cast is a success. So let them have their glory. Let them have their time in the sun.
We needed Shatner in this film about as much as we needed Frakes and Sirtus in TATV.
Re: Did you see a way to work in Shatner?
This thread is pretty much the same topic as another started earlier today.
I'm gonna merge the two.
This thread is pretty much the same topic as another started earlier today.
I'm gonna merge the two.
Thank God for JJ - a guy who is not afraid of doing things his own way.
"Lets get all the old cast in to do some BS cameo as parent - shave twenty minutes off the film to feed some fan's orgasm." Screw That. Shall we arrange a "Bring your doddering parents to Enterprise day?" I don't need any parents.
In fact, I didn't even need Nimoy. Abrams shouldn't have curried that much favor. This cast carried their weight admirably, for this incarnation. The LAST thing I want is a whole bunch of weak TNG season one epi-movies to drag the elders out of their boxes one last time. Go watch Phase II for that stuff.
...and just think - with a non-Nimoy story, we wouldn't have needed to blow up Vulcan, which has caused so damned much heartbreak for the rubber-ears crowd.
IMO, Nimoy did not just not overshadow the new cast - he slowed the whole thing down. Whoopie - look - its Nimoy!!! Oh! And he's important... to explain why Nimoy is there in the first place. And kiss up the Kirk/Spock duo. I didn't need him - the chemistry was on screen without Nimoy begging us to accept it.
My God!! Has Tom Baker been in the new Dr Who?? UNFAIRRRR!!!!
"Lets get all the old cast in to do some BS cameo as parent - shave twenty minutes off the film to feed some fan's orgasm." Screw That. Shall we arrange a "Bring your doddering parents to Enterprise day?" I don't need any parents.
In fact, I didn't even need Nimoy. Abrams shouldn't have curried that much favor. This cast carried their weight admirably, for this incarnation. The LAST thing I want is a whole bunch of weak TNG season one epi-movies to drag the elders out of their boxes one last time. Go watch Phase II for that stuff.
...and just think - with a non-Nimoy story, we wouldn't have needed to blow up Vulcan, which has caused so damned much heartbreak for the rubber-ears crowd.
IMO, Nimoy did not just not overshadow the new cast - he slowed the whole thing down. Whoopie - look - its Nimoy!!! Oh! And he's important... to explain why Nimoy is there in the first place. And kiss up the Kirk/Spock duo. I didn't need him - the chemistry was on screen without Nimoy begging us to accept it.
My God!! Has Tom Baker been in the new Dr Who?? UNFAIRRRR!!!!
Agreed. What I think they should do (if there are sequels) is continue with this story and find some way to bring back Shatner. With Old Spock being present, I am sure they can find some way. Heck, if they followed Shatner's books, I wouldn't mind seeing the Borg again if it meant bringing back the original James T. Kirk. (Although I do like the nuKirk
It's not that complicated. Now that there's a new timeline, Kirk doesn't necessarily get trapped in the Nexus, so future Kirk from the new timeline can always go back in time.....
But I don't think they should do that. Enough with time travel for now. I hope they move on to something else, and don't try to shoehorn in more of the TOS cast.
I know you said no more time travel but....
I understand(?) how Spock can come back from his future because it has happened. Now that there is a new time line that these characters haven't created yet, how could Kirk come back from that? Just trying to get a handle on the whole tt thing.
Spock, Kirk, you, me whoever could (?) return from what has happened but could we come back from something that hasn't happened yet? My brain hurts.
I'm not sure what you mean. The whole idea behind time travel is that people show up from the future even though (from the perspective of the people in the time that they're appearing in) that future hasn't happened yet.
Suppose a time traveler shows up at my doorstep, and he says he's from 100 years in the future. From his perspective, that future has already happened. From my perspective it hasn't. What's the problem there? If you accept time travel in the first place, then it kind of has to work like that.
I love Shatner. But I don't want him in the new timeline ever. It's over. Let it go. It's time to have fun, BRAND NEW, adventures with the crew of the 1701 in this timeline. That is what I want to see...to be honest, Spock Prime was almost too much as it was.
hmmmmmm. Good point. I was looking at time (literally) as a line drawn on a piece of paper. If I draw a 6" line, inches 2, 3, 4, 5 & 6 have been drawn and can be traced back to inch 1. However. If I start a new line. There is nothing that can come back to inch 1 because inches 2, 3 etc have not been drawn (happened) yet.
Sorry if that sounds dumb. It's just how I was looking at it.
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