A question about Commander/Captain/Emissary Sisko

[los2188]

I just have a general question I guess...when DS9 started, the show rather, why was Sisko only a Commander for the first few years, then Captain. Was any particular reason given? One other question for anyone....which did you prefer...clean shaven with hair Sisko, Sisko with a goo-tee and hair, or bald Sisko with a goo-tee? I preferred the later myself.

 

[Quinton O'Connor]

He was promoted in 3x26 "The Adversary".

Anyway, definitely the latter, which is far and away his most iconic look across all of nerd kind and for good reason.

 

[R. Star]

DS9 was a relatively obscure posting and didn't require a high ranking captain. It was not much of a coincidence that Sisko was promoted once DS9's strategic importance picked up and the Dominion became a major factor.

And yeah, I liked his shaved head look better too.

 

[Tom]

The off show reason is because they did not want to compete with Capt Picard, once TNG was off the air that felt they could have another star captain in the trek universe

 

[R. Star]

The off show reason is because they did not want to compete with Capt Picard, once TNG was off the air that felt they could have another star captain in the trek universe

Is that why he picked that same time to shave his head? As not to compete with Picard in total baldness?

 

[Use of Time]

The bald Sisko is the one that sticks with me the most. As far as his CAPT promotion, he had just finished up his XO time with the Saratoga so it probably just wasn't his time yet.

 

[Tosk]

If he had been a captain, wouldn't the natural question have been, "How come this guy didn't get a starship command?"

 

[Use of Time]

Not all 0-6 postings are necessarily on starships. There may not have been any available or the DS9 posting was farther up the queue in terms of need to fill the position. If Star Trek has taught us anything it is that there is no rhyme or reason to the way they handle promotions. See: Kim, Harry ENS. I do agree that Sisko would have probably been in line for a starship Captaincy seeing as he just finished his XO billet and would no doubt be a capable CO. Didn't Sisko request some sort of planet side position though as he was contemplating getting out of Starfleet after the Saratoga went down.

 

[Pavonis]

Well, Sisko hadn't actually "just finished" being an XO. Immediately prior to being assigned to DS9, he was at Utopia Planitia, involved in the Defiant project. We know that his old CO, Leyton, felt Sisko needed a push to keep his career going, so recommended him for the CO position at DS9. It wasn't that important of a position originally, but Sisko probably needed a chance to be the CO of something if he was going to move forward.

What's the promotion requirements, though? We know Sisko was a lieutenant commander in 2366-2367, and that he was a commander in 2369, but we don't know if he was promoted immediately after Wolf 359, or if he was promoted to commander just prior to being posted to DS9. We do know he made captain in 2371, so he was a commander for between 3 and 5 years, which may be the minimum time-in-grade required for promotion to captain.

 

[DS9forever]

Weren't there also some TOS and TNG episodes which had starbases commanded by commanders?

 

[Pavonis]

The TOS starbases always had commodores in charge. The only starbase official I recall in TNG is Commander Orfil Quinteros, from the episode "11001001", and I don't think he was in command of the base.

 

[Use of Time]

Well, Sisko hadn't actually "just finished" being an XO. Immediately prior to being assigned to DS9, he was at Utopia Planitia, involved in the Defiant project. We know that his old CO, Leyton, felt Sisko needed a push to keep his career going, so recommended him for the CO position at DS9. It wasn't that important of a position originally, but Sisko probably needed a chance to be the CO of something if he was going to move forward.

What's the promotion requirements, though? We know Sisko was a lieutenant commander in 2366-2367, and that he was a commander in 2369, but we don't know if he was promoted immediately after Wolf 359, or if he was promoted to commander just prior to being posted to DS9. We do know he made captain in 2371, so he was a commander for between 3 and 5 years, which may be the minimum time-in-grade required for promotion to captain.

Yes, thanks I knew Sisko was piddling around Earth doing something I just couldn't remember what it was. Your assessment of promotion requirements makes sense to me but everytime I see a pattern it doesn't take Trek long to do something that breaks it. Data and Geordi were LCDR's for freaking ever. It's not like they had crappy service records either. Who knows. Nothing is as bad as Harry Kim though.

 

[Pavonis]

Well, Data had probably topped out at lieutenant commander because he lacked ambition. Literally lacked it. Besides, as an android, he'd have at least as much time as any Vulcan to make captain or admiral, if he wanted to. But, like Riker, he seemed "happy" on the Enterprise, and didn't want to move on.

As for LaForge, he had bursts of ambition and promotion. According to MA, he graduated in 2357, but was still an ensign in 2362 when Victory was investigating the Tarchannen III incident (which means LaForge was an ensign for almost as long as Harry Kim - 5 years vs 7 years). Meanwhile, LaForge's classmate Riker was already a full lieutenant in 2362! But just four years later (2366) LaForge was a lieutenant commander. Though again, Riker had already made full commander when LaForge was still just a lieutenant junior grade! Then LaForge remained a lieutenant commander for 13 years, and Riker a commander for 15 years.

It seems odd, but then again, maybe Sisko's is the odd career path? Maybe lieutenant commander is the rank most officers top out at?

 

[Use of Time]

Well, Data had probably topped out at lieutenant commander because he lacked ambition. Literally lacked it. Besides, as an android, he'd have at least as much time as any Vulcan to make captain or admiral, if he wanted to. But, like Riker, he seemed "happy" on the Enterprise, and didn't want to move on.

As for LaForge, he had bursts of ambition and promotion. According to MA, he graduated in 2357, but was still an ensign in 2362 when Victory was investigating the Tarchannen III incident. But just four years later he was a lieutenant commander. Then LaForge remained a lieutenant commander for 13 years. It seems odd, but then again, maybe Sisko's is the odd career path? Maybe lieutenant commander is the rank most officers top out at?

Either what you just said or that test that Riker gave Deanna was much harder than we thoght. Maybe Deanna really is that damn good

 

[Pavonis]

Well, Troi had held lieutenant commander rank for at least 7 years when she took the bridge officers' test. The promotion to commander couldn't have been just because of taking the test, because Pulaski held commander rank, too, and she explicitly said she was not part of the command structure, which of course, as a staff officer, she wouldn't be.

McCoy passed through commander and captain ranks to make admiral, but there's no indication he had to take a similar test to get the promotion. Why would he? He never wanted to command starships or be responsible for sending people to their deaths.

I think that Troi was probably up for promotion anyway, and the bridge officers' test put her in a good light with the promotions review board.

 

[Use of Time]

I know, I know, I'm just joking about Troi. Maybe Geordi is just biding his time before his next ambitious surge and he's going to make Rear Admiral within the next year.

 

[Pavonis]

Troi's an easy one to joke about. She might have passed the test, but they shouldn't let her drive.

Anyway, I bet there needs to be a lot of lieutenant commanders for Starfleet's work to actually get done, and there aren't many openings for commander rank and above.

Michael Eddington (a lieutenant commander) said you don't get to captain by wearing a gold uniform. And we never see any commanders in gold uniform. In fact, we only saw one admiral, Toddman, in a gold uniform. I wish we had seen more instances like that.

I've always thought that there should be promotion paths to the admiralty that don't require starship command. There should be gold uniform admirals in charge of engineering efforts, and blue uniform admirals in charge of Starfleet medical. Admiral Haftel of Starfleet research should've been in blue, in my opinion. Maybe LaForge and Crusher will end up admirals, despite not wearing red uniforms (well, La Forge did wear red early on).

 

[Use of Time]

Troi's an easy one to joke about. She might have passed the test, but they shouldn't let her drive.

Anyway, I bet there needs to be a lot of lieutenant commanders for Starfleet's work to actually get done, and there aren't many openings for commander rank and above.

Michael Eddington (a lieutenant commander) said you don't get to captain by wearing a gold uniform. And we never see any commanders in gold uniform. In fact, we only saw one admiral, Toddman, in a gold uniform. I wish we had seen more instances like that.

I've always thought that there should be promotion paths to the admiralty that don't require starship command. There should be gold uniform admirals in charge of engineering efforts, and blue uniform admirals in charge of Starfleet medical. Admiral Haftel of Starfleet research should've been in blue, in my opinion. Maybe LaForge and Crusher will end up admirals, despite not wearing red uniforms (well, La Forge did wear red early on).

I'm sure there are paths to the admiralty without starship command. Starfleet Medical probably doesn't require it and I'm not sure if branches like Intelligence, Research & Developement, etc. require a Starship Command. I think you just have to excel in your field.

 

[los2188]

I just have a general question I guess...when DS9 started, the show rather, why was Sisko only a Commander for the first few years, then Captain. Was any particular reason given? One other question for anyone....which did you prefer...clean shaven with hair Sisko, Sisko with a goo-tee and hair, or bald Sisko with a goo-tee? I preferred the later myself.

By the way, I meant to type latter, not later. Just in case there's any confusion.