7 was right

[exodus]

KitchenWitch said:

exodus said:
How many decades has Trek been around for that people still don't understand Starfleet isn't about war or killing, it's about making peace.

To paraphrase Seven, a lesson in peace will do them little good if they are dead.

The Hirogen were kicking Voyager's ass. The 8472 would not have survived Voyager's destruction by the Hirogen. So nothing would have been accomplished and no one--not the Federation nor the 8472 in fluidic space--would have known of Janeway's olive branch.

If the Kazon & Borg couldn't best Voyager, I doubt the Hirogen could either.

Voyager was way faster, smaller and more manuverable than all their ships.

 

[KitchenWitch]

^ They were getting their asses kicked.

Plus the Hirogen did later end up taking over Voyager.

 

[exodus]

KitchenWitch said:
^ They were getting their asses kicked.

Plus the Hirogen did later end up taking over Voyager.

..as did the Kazon.

They got the ship back both times.

Voyager was also built to take a beating.

 

[KitchenWitch]

^ So on the off-chance that 8472 would respond to her compassion, Janeway was supposed to take the ship into fluidic space to save this guy?

What makes you think that 8472 wouldn't blast Voyager to bits?

 

[exodus]

KitchenWitch said:
^ So on the off-chance that 8472 would respond to her compassion, Janeway was supposed to take the ship into fluidic space to save this guy?

What makes you think that 8472 wouldn't blast Voyager to bits?

Because it wasn't written that way.

 

[KitchenWitch]

In other words, Seven was right.

 

[exodus]

KitchenWitch said:
In other words, Seven was right.

I don't like you anymore.

 

[Capt_Piett]

If you also remember, Species 8472 were highly telepathic beings, and we don't know the range of their telepathy. Who's to say that the long 8472 wasn't in contact with Fluidic Space and that the rest of his kind weren't aware of what was happening or what Janeway was trying to do?

 

[KitchenWitch]

^ If the rest of his kind were aware of his situation, then why didn't even one bioship return to the DQ to save him from the Hirogen?

 

[Anwar]

I'm thinking that most of them returned to Fluidic Space after "Scorpion" and that only when returned to Fluidic Space would they have "heard" him.

Those guys from "In the flesh" either arrived afterwards from Fluidic Space or were too far away to hear him.

 

[exodus]

KitchenWitch said:
^ If the rest of his kind were aware of his situation, then why didn't even one bioship return to the DQ to save him from the Hirogen?

Because their are always expendable losses in war.

or

It's the same reason Sisko couldn't turn around and go back for Jake when the Dominion took over DS9.

 

[Photon]

In a tacet defense of Janeway, perhaps this was her thinking:
If I can just get that singularity opened, the creature could communicate thru it that WE are trying to assist it and the Hirogen are trying to hunt it down.
If that could happen, Bioships would pour thru the singularity and blow the Hirogen ships to Hunter's Hell.

 

[Tino]

Photon said:
Beam the creature over and get the Hirongen off her back.

By sacrificing another one's life, not standing behind your principles and closing your eyes?
I cannot believe I'm hearing that from a Star Trek-fan. :-(

 

[Ezri]

Janeway did not have the fleet of starfleet to back her up. Janeway did not have the backing of starfleet command.
Janeway did not have the ship of the line like Picard did with the Enterprise.
Janeway did not have everything like that like Picard and Sisko.

Janeway did what she felt she had to do to stay alive one more day to get back home. Janeway had to deal with short term relationships because she was going to move on in space. If she was going to be there for the rest of her life, I could see that she would have done other stuff. But that is not the case.

 

[exodus]

Ezri said:
Janeway did not have the fleet of starfleet to back her up. Janeway did not have the backing of starfleet command.
Janeway did not have the ship of the line like Picard did with the Enterprise.
Janeway did not have everything like that like Picard and Sisko.

Janeway did what she felt she had to do to stay alive one more day to get back home. Janeway had to deal with short term relationships because she was going to move on in space. If she was going to be there for the rest of her life, I could see that she would have done other stuff. But that is not the case.

Just one thing, Voyager was more advanced than the Enterprise-D. The Enterprise was over 10 years old by the time Voyager was built. Technology in our time advances every 5 to 10 years. Voyager is a much better ship than the Enterprise.

This also explains why Voyager can withstand a Borg attack and the Enterprise couldn't.

 

[Casper]

i don't think seven was right....
one thing that held up for voyager in 'in the flesh' was janeway explaining she was trying to help the sick 8472 species......

 

[Timo]

In the bigger scheme, the 8472 were obviously the stronger ally, making it a good idea to be on their good rather than their bad side. Whose side the Hirogen would be had little relevance.

After all, the Hirogen weren't out to conquer the galaxy - the alliance would be needed in order to oppose the Borg, the true scourge of the galaxy. And if one starship was lost to an incidental player in the process of trying to form that anti-Borg alliance, it would be a worthy sacrifice.

Sure, the gesture might not count if the 8472 prey died. But if it survived, the failure to make the gesture would certainly count. And despite all the bragging, the Hirogen hunters might well fail in their attempt at a quiet kill. They might not even try particularly hard to keep the kill quiet. So there was every chance of the negative news leaking out, even if the positive ones would have poorer odds.

Timo Saloniemi