The Enterprise-E is so ugly

[Lance]

The E had plenty of character, especially in Nemesis.

We will just have to agree to disagree I think. In First Contact, Insurrection and Nemesis, I've just never "felt" it had any character, I'm afraid. It's a weak connect for me.

I'd love to have fallen in love the Enterprise-E, but I just couldn't.

It isn't simply 7 years of Ent-D vs 3 movies of Ent-E either. I find Voyager just as lacking in character despite its seven years on television, I never loved that ship either.

1701, 1701-refit, 1701-D and the Defiant are all characterful ships inside and out. I adore them. But Voyager and the 1701-E just leave me cold.Their designs just don't "do it" for me. Something's missing, some crucial element, some sense of feeling.

A gut reaction, but an honest one.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I think there was a general emotional disconnect with all of the ships after TOS. IMO, the only reason why the original Enterprise seemed like a character was because Kirk and Scotty were totally crazy about her (the former was very possessive, while the latter was very protective). Every hero ship after her, though, seemed to be treated by their crews as merely vehicles to get them from one place to another.

 

[LMFAOschwarz]

I have to say that I didn't exactly warm up to the Enteprise E either...but I think it might have had just as much to do with the new 'everything else', just as much as with the new ship.

The new, color-starved uniforms for one. Why the Federation would, in effect, borrow swatches for their new color palate from the borg is beyond me. Also, from a production standpoint, it's harder to contrast your heroes with a deadly, diametrically-opposite foe when they both, for all intents and purposes, buy their clothes from the same retail outlet. I'm almost surprised they don't run into each other more often..like from the opposite sides of a spinner rack.

 

[Cyke101]

The E had plenty of character, especially in Nemesis.

We will just have to agree to disagree I think. In First Contact, Insurrection and Nemesis, I've just never "felt" it had any character, I'm afraid. It's a weak connect for me.

That Picard was so nonchalant about blowing her up after only a year of service was fairly jarring for me. Yes, I get that it was integral to the mission to defeating the Borg, but he never really gave it a second thought once he was convinced and even kind of joked about it. Contrast that to TSFS, when Kirk is genuinely saddened by the realization of what he did to his old girl, even asking Bones, "What have I done?"

If the ship is a character and you're about to kill off a character from your team, at least have some kind of remorse about it.

(Oddly, Picard acted the same way when the E-D went down, even tossing aside a priceless archaeological artifact. He's had that ship, the pride and joy of Starfleet, for 7 years. These things are big, serve important strategic functions, have saved your lives every other week, and has been home to you, your crew, and their families that whole time. Some sentimental value must be expected.)

 

[Grendelsbayne]

The E had plenty of character, especially in Nemesis.

We will just have to agree to disagree I think. In First Contact, Insurrection and Nemesis, I've just never "felt" it had any character, I'm afraid. It's a weak connect for me.

That Picard was so nonchalant about blowing her up after only a year of service was fairly jarring for me. Yes, I get that it was integral to the mission to defeating the Borg, but he never really gave it a second thought once he was convinced and even kind of joked about it. Contrast that to TSFS, when Kirk is genuinely saddened by the realization of what he did to his old girl, even asking Bones, "What have I done?"

If the ship is a character and you're about to kill off a character from your team, at least have some kind of remorse about it.

(Oddly, Picard acted the same way when the E-D went down, even tossing aside a priceless archaeological artifact. He's had that ship, the pride and joy of Starfleet, for 7 years. These things are big, serve important strategic functions, have saved your lives every other week, and has been home to you, your crew, and their families that whole time. Some sentimental value must be expected.)

Maybe Picard just doesn't think the same way Kirk does. Also, in FC at least, he was so messed up that treated his own crewmen's deaths with even less remorse.

On a more general note, while I agree that the way the crew (and, incidentally, the filmmaker, as well) treats the ship is of paramount importance to the concept of succesfully making the ship 'another character', I have to say that this entire discussion of different ship designs having 'character' or 'soul' in and of themselves is pure bunk. Every post I see about this concept basically boils down to 'I just didn't like this design'. That's not 'bad design', it's plain old personal preference.

 

[Ithekro]

One thing the NCC-1701 had over all the others was that it had a history before the show started. The USS Enterprise was old when Star Trek was new. She was the old girl that had the reputation for getting people home. She was the old girl that was touchy and needed a lot of care to keep her running. She was the one that was jury rigged through every section to not only keep her running, but also so she could run circles around anyone else in the fleet. She had a history and Kirk and his crew responded to that.

All the other ships in Star Trek are brand new when we see them.
The USS Enterprise-D is on her first mission under out to Farpoint Station.
The USS Enterprise-E has just finished a year of shakedown cruises to end up patrolling the Neutral Zone.
The USS Voyager has been sent to Deep Space Nine to find some Maquis.
USS Defiant is just out of the shipyards for testing her overpowered systems against the Dominion.
The NX-01 Enterprise is being launched early to deliver a Klingon back to the Homeworld.
The 2009 USS Enterprise is being commissioned early to respond to a destress signal from Vulcan.
They are all new ships.

The only one that is not new aside from the NCC-1701 is Deep Space Nine itself. The old Cardassian station has character to it, but it is an ugly character that tends to turn on the Federation and Bajoran crew until very late one when they've rebuilt it with Federation systems and weapons. And even then it still is ugly as it doesn't save them all the time, but hinders them at points.

So having a history to your ship, and having it be old tends to give it more character as the crew respond to it in some respect. Take the Millenium Falcon from Star Wars. It is an old ship and has a massive amount of personality. Or the Battlestar Galactica. Again and old ship to the point where the crew respond to her in human like terms.

That is probably what was missing fom the later Star Treks. The variable being the NCC-1701-A. She does have a personality due to have Scotty treats her, but it isn't as much as the original since Kirk is not as invested in the two films she stars in. In both Star Trek V and Star Trek VI, the crew seems like they want to be someplace else. They looked happy on arrival in Star Trek IV, of course the events of Star Trek II the crew seem downright happy to be on the old Enterprise.

 

[StarMan]

I loved the first shot of the E in First Contact. It became my favorite class of ship.

Insurrection onwards, however, something felt off. Perhaps the luster of being the new ship on the block and being well shot by ILM had something to do with my original enamor.

 

[NewHorizon]

Contrast that to TSFS, when Kirk is genuinely saddened by the realization of what he did to his old girl, even asking Bones, "What have I done?"

I always felt that comment was more due to the fact that Kirk had outright murdered the Klingon crew, and less about the destruction of the ship. He tried to save Kruge initially too.

 

[King Bob!]

Contrast that to TSFS, when Kirk is genuinely saddened by the realization of what he did to his old girl, even asking Bones, "What have I done?"

I always felt that comment was more due to the fact that Kirk had outright murdered the Klingon crew, and less about the destruction of the ship. He tried to save Kruge initially too.

I don't think so based on what we've seen of the Kirk character. His attachment to the Enterprise. He probably felt that he had killed a close friend.

 

[TheSubCommander]

Contrast that to TSFS, when Kirk is genuinely saddened by the realization of what he did to his old girl, even asking Bones, "What have I done?"

I always felt that comment was more due to the fact that Kirk had outright murdered the Klingon crew, and less about the destruction of the ship. He tried to save Kruge initially too.

I don't think so based on what we've seen of the Kirk character. His attachment to the Enterprise. He probably felt that he had killed a close friend.

Agreed! The Klingons just murdered David, and Kirk had no problem kicking Kruge in the face off a cliff and into a river of molten lava.

No, I think Kirk was lamenting the destruction of the Enterprise, something he considered the embodiment of his career and an extension of himself.

I'll take the Abramsverse version over the 'E', everyday of the week and twice on Sunday.

I also like the Abramsverse version of the Enterprise....

The Abrams Enterprise would be a thousand times better if the neck were moved forward. I did a quick and dirty Photoshop of it a while back just to illustrate:

Well, that's a start, at least. It does look a lot better to me.

I never minded the nacelles as much as the secondary hull as it appeared in the movie. It's all a matter of opinion, and your mileage may vary but to me Abramsprise has got to be one of the ugliest Star Trek ships, EVER. I would take Enterprise-E, even if it isn't t he perfect ship, over that albatross ANY DAY OF THE WEEK!

Hopefully, Star Trek 3 (2016) will follow suit with Star Trek II TSFS and Generations, and we will see the Abramsprise destroyed, and the crew issued a new ship in the next sequel, and hopefully a much better looking Enterprise.

Like I said, the top view of the Enterprise E looks great, its looking up at the underside that it looks less glamorous, but at least it is in proportion and sleek looking. Abramsprise just simply is ugly. The only good thing about it is at least Abramsprise kept the classic saucer similar to the TMP refit. The rest of the ship is just, BLAH!


In the "corrected" pic, the hull is a tad too long and skinny though, and to even it out, the nacelles need to come forward by at least a third.

And the addition of twin torpedo bays at the base of the neck joining the primary and secondary hulls like the TMP refit wouldn't hurt, either.

 

[Ithekro]

My thoughts on the First Contact and beyond uniforms was a responce to the increasing likelihood of war with the Dominion (which started not more than six months after the uniform change if I recall). The idea being that a Federation at war would not want their officers to stand out as much form one to the next at a distance. Before you could just target the guys with the red shoulders and likely kill the commanding officers. With them being all grey (with color trim) you can't as easily see which is the commander from a distance. That is my thought.

 

[Timby]

The E had plenty of character, especially in Nemesis.

We will just have to agree to disagree I think. In First Contact, Insurrection and Nemesis, I've just never "felt" it had any character, I'm afraid. It's a weak connect for me.

I'd love to have fallen in love the Enterprise-E, but I just couldn't.

It isn't simply 7 years of Ent-D vs 3 movies of Ent-E either. I find Voyager just as lacking in character despite its seven years on television, I never loved that ship either.

I don't mind Voyager (outside of the rotating nacelles), but I can sum up exactly why I can't stand the E -- it's everything I hate about John Eaves' designs: More sharp angles for the angles god! The angles god demands more sharp angles! Put some black on it, it'll be sexy! And it needs to be flatter! AND MORE ANGULAR!

 

[Maxillius]

Hopefully, Star Trek 3 (2016) will follow suit with Star Trek II TSFS and Generations, and we will see the Abramsprise destroyed, and the crew issued a new ship in the next sequel, and hopefully a much better looking Enterprise.

Indeed, and I'd like to see an end to the a,b,c,d... crap. What makes the Enterprise so special that it's the only one that gets a letter on the original registry number? As if no other ships and no other crews are worthy of remembrance. What I want to see is, if they blow up the 1701 in ST3-2016 is NCC-1776 or whatever. A new number for a new Enterprise.

 

[Lance]

I don't mind Voyager (outside of the rotating nacelles), but I can sum up exactly why I can't stand the E -- it's everything I hate about John Eaves' designs: More sharp angles for the angles god! The angles god demands more sharp angles! Put some black on it, it'll be sexy! And it needs to be flatter! AND MORE ANGULAR!

^ As much as I enjoyed reading Eaves' book about the making of the Enterprise-E (The TNG Movie Sketchbook), I did find many of his justifications for his design decisions to be rather dubious. It did seem to me that far too little of the design was given any kind of true practical consideration, and far too much was purely asthetic (ie to "look cool").

 

[Robert Comsol]

Indeed, and I'd like to see an end to the a,b,c,d... crap. What makes the Enterprise so special that it's the only one that gets a letter on the original registry number? As if no other ships and no other crews are worthy of remembrance. What I want to see is, if they blow up the 1701 in ST3-2016 is NCC-1776 or whatever. A new number for a new Enterprise.

Well, there was the Yamato, NCC-1305-E for a short duration in TNG, and regardless whether they changed the registry later, I have no doubt that its predecessor was NCC-1305-D.

I can only offer my personal theory for the alphabetic Enterprise numbering. Not only did the TOS Enterprise defeat the first Romulan Bird of Prey it made contact with ("Balance of Terror") but it also destroyed (never shown) a Romulan ship that had made it to the core of the Federation near Tau Ceti (only 11 light years from Earth!), add to this Romulan humiliations in "The Deadly Years" and "The Enterprise Incident".

Thus keeping name and registry must have been a strong psychological signal to the Romulans, the name and registry carried intimidating allusions for any Romulans that wanted to mess with Starfleet.
Of course, the intimidating effect ended when the Enterprise-C got defeated in the Battle of Narendra III. For the next 20 years no Federation starship carried that name and registry.

By the time the Enterprise-D was commissioned there had been no contact with the Romulan Star Empire for several decades. And guess which ship encountered the Romulans for the very first time after all these decades?

For the same reasons the original Yamato (NCC-1305) might have impressed the Klingons (Battle of Donatu V?). But of course, by the time of TNG there was no more need for that, hence the abandoned alphabetic appendix registry.

Bob

 

[JarodRussell]

Jim, the Enterprise-E is almost 20 years old.

 

[Ithekro]

If Star Trek Online has any ground to stand on, the Enterprise-E lasted nearly 40 years.

 

[King Bob!]

If Star Trek Online has any ground to stand on, the Enterprise-E lasted nearly 40 years.

It has none. CBS could produce a series that starts the day after Nemesis and blow the "E" up. Star Trek Online would then have to adjust its story accordingly.

 

[Ithekro]

At this point it is highly unlikely that CBS will touch anything from the older series anymore. They'd likely rather continue on with the alternate timeline than spend the time to get together the Next Generation cast again for a series or film, and they have no reason to attempt a follow on series to any of the 1987 - 2002 series. Unless they wanted to do some kind of anniversery movie set at or around the same time as "All Good Things...", which would be I think four years from now.

 

[C.E. Evans]

At this point it is highly unlikely that CBS will touch anything from the older series anymore. They'd likely rather continue on with the alternate timeline...

I actually think CBS wouldn't touch anything from the alternate timeline either because that's really more of the purview of Paramount and those two companies are still kind of drifting apart as they continue to compete with one another (Paramount took their entire film library away--including all the Trek movies--from CBS' Showtime when they went and formed the rival Epix network with Lionsgate and MGM).

One could say that that the days of Trek shows and movies being in the same continuity are over.