TFF vs. TUC Enterprise Shots

[Ssosmcin]

Ferren did a far worse job than ILM on many counts, of course, but I don't think ILM had any idea how to light the model properly either. But at least ILM knew how to do motion control well.

1989 was an extremely busy time for ILM and going by the other films of that season, I can understand why Bennett and Shatner decided to look elsewhere. Ghostbusters 2 and Indy 3 were below par for them. Back to the Future Part II and The Abyss seemed to get their best people. Star Trek would have probably taken a hit either way. The problem is when searching for a substitute, the chose unwisely.

My next call would have been to John Dykstra or Dream Quest so see if they had time. When TNG is doing better model shots on TV than a feature picture, you know you're in deep tribble droppings.

I think this is the best non-TMP shot of the Enterprise in the whole movie franchise.

The work on TWOK was among the best shots of the Enterprise done by ILM. They matched the look of TMP well enough for the model to feel in concert with the footage from that movie. Even TUC didn't match ILM at their strongest. I know the money was tight, but the lighting and camera moves still made the Enterprise feel less like a ship than a model in a lot of shots.

However, there was some stunning imagination there. Watching the BoP torpedo come up from beneath the ship and the camera pans to the underside of the Enterprise is great.

 

[FormerLurker]

This is a good time for me to throw out my opinion again that the Enterprise-A is in fact smaller than the original's refit was, despite them using the same model for both. I would argue that its proportions would be so similar that a new model would not be worth the effort, although, as some have pointed out, the docking ports, torpedo ports, bridge dome, etc, should be enlarged to make up for it. This came from the claim in Star Trek 6 that the crew was 300, but I am beginning to understand that the lighting effects discussed here might have also played a role in my forming this opinion.

Crew complement has nothing to do with the size of the ship, beyond there being a maximum possible. Just because the ship only has 300 on it doesn't mean it's smaller, it just means it's more mission specific than a general complemented ship of 430/450.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Crew complement has nothing to do with the size of the ship, beyond there being a maximum possible. Just because the ship only has 300 on it doesn't mean it's smaller, it just means it's more mission specific than a general complemented ship of 430/450.

I assumed with greater automation ships in the 2290s might well have smaller crews than their 2260s equivalents. Reduce the crew, more living space, improved crew morale.

Kirk's cabin, on the other hand, seemed little bigger than a closet. I do think Nick Meyer wanted a claustrophobic, nuclear submarine feel to the ship.

 

[CoveTom]

I assumed with greater automation ships in the 2290s might well have smaller crews than their 2260s equivalents. Reduce the crew, more living space, improved crew morale.

Kirk's cabin, on the other hand, seemed little bigger than a closet. I do think Nick Meyer wanted a claustrophobic, nuclear submarine feel to the ship.

FWIW, Kirk's cabin in TWOK was the same cabin as he had in TMP, just redressed a bit. And his cabin in TUC was a redress of a standard TNG cabin. (The replicator is still there!) So I'm not sure how much Nick Meyer got to dictate the size of the cabins.

 

[Ssosmcin]

FWIW, Kirk's cabin in TWOK was the same cabin as he had in TMP, just redressed a bit. And his cabin in TUC was a redress of a standard TNG cabin. (The replicator is still there!) So I'm not sure how much Nick Meyer got to dictate the size of the cabins.

He did shoot them to look smaller and shopworn (he did this with the whole ship). He also put a big support beam in the center of Spock's cabin.

 

[FormerLurker]

FWIW, Kirk's cabin in TWOK was the same cabin as he had in TMP, just redressed a bit. And his cabin in TUC was a redress of a standard TNG cabin. (The replicator is still there!) So I'm not sure how much Nick Meyer got to dictate the size of the cabins.

FWIW, the standard TNG cabin (Worf's/Data's quarters) was a redress of Kirk's cabin from TMP/TWOK. So he was probably in the same cabin again.

 

[Mres_was_framed!]

Crew complement has nothing to do with the size of the ship, beyond there being a maximum possible. Just because the ship only has 300 on it doesn't mean it's smaller, it just means it's more mission specific than a general complemented ship of 430/450.

I understand that crew complement could be less now, but when I first saw the movie that was the impression that I was left with.

 

[Uxi]

Pike's Enterprise in the Cage had 200 while Kirk's TOS Enterprise was said to have 435 and the ship only had minor changes (bridge, bussard spikes, different ends to the nacelles, etc). There would clearly be a minimum skeleton crew (mostly engineering) to run the ship with some more added to keep it running in shifts for 24/7 operation and but they wouldn't need all the science guys or more obscure historian types like Marla McGivers or botanists and geologists, etc or administrative types along with the necessities (legal officers, dentists, even second or third surgeons and you can just wake the CMO in an emergency). Security red shirts would be extra, as well.

Kirk's numbers could easily double if they went to US Navy standards for crew quarters hot bunking and what not (funny enough we did see rows of bunks in TUC).

 

[Tosk]

"They really packed them in on these old ships." - Jadzia Dax.

 

[CoveTom]

"They really packed them in on these old ships." - Jadzia Dax.

Interestingly, when she said that, we saw way more people in the Enterprise corridors than we actually saw on TOS.

 

[Warped9]

Considering the size and interior volume of a 947 ft. TOS E a 430 person crew isn’t a lot of people.

 

[publiusr]

I think this is the best non-TMP shot of the Enterprise in the whole movie franchise.

ILM also did good work with the Protector in Galaxy Quest.

 

[Maurice]

OK, it's taken me ages to find the source, but I have it! The off the shelf AMT kit model was 'apparently' used in a blink and you'll miss it scene on the Excelsior viewscreen. And I have a source!

Star Trek: 10 Secrets Of The Enterprise A You Need To Know

No bloody A, B, C, or D – no wait.

whatculture.com

If anyone can find a better source, I'd love to read more on this.

I missed this before, but that's not a particularly well-researched article, and the language is a little vague.

ST6 shot of the Enterprise on the Excelsior viewer may well be an AMT kit. I used to think the AMT kit was used in the whip-pan following the Enterprise where the hero model goes by the camera, and then the background pans in its wake to see the ship in the distance as it races towards Khitomer, but it might be a photo cutout (as was used for distant Star Destroyers in Return of the Jedi) because I don't see any perspective shift on the ship, thought it doers have lit impulse engines that look like a small model. This trick was necessary because ILM only had 80 feet of motion control track and the big hero model still looks too big for that shot at that distance (per Cinefex #49).

An AMT kit is definitely used in ST3, probably for the BOP POV of the Enterprise approaching over Genesis, A photo of the model is in Cinefex #18.

 

[Tosk]

An AMT kit is definitely used in ST3, probably for the BOP POV of the Enterprise approaching over Genesis, A photo of the model is in Cinefex #18.