Do people with southern accents seem weird in oldTrek?

[Christopher]

I think you're defining "utopian" far too narrowly for it to be at all useful. A story doesn't have to be completely devoid of any conflict or disagreement to constitute utopian fiction; on the contrary, a great deal of utopian fiction is about challenging the perceived perfection of the utopia. The very word does, after all, mean "no place," as a wordplay on eutopia, "good place." Thomas More's intent in coining the word was, apparently, to imply that a perfect society does not exist, that any society purporting to perfection is still going to have some basic flaws just like any other human creation. So having characters question the society's claims of perfection does not in any way disqualify something as utopian fiction; if anything, it confirms it as such.

Anyway, critics and scholars have been writing about Star Trek's optimistic view of the future for nearly half a century now. I'm amazed I'm even having this debate.

 

[Wadjda]

But if you recognize the absurdity of such stereotypes, then it shouldn't "take you out of it" at all. There is not a single valid reason why a person with a Southern accent can't be a good, intelligent, enlightened, caring person. Your implication that Southern accents are somehow inappropriate for inclusion in a work like Star Trek because of the kind of personality they suggest is deeply dismissive and derogatory, whether you realize it or not.

I said it feels weird for me in old Trek. I fail to see how it's dismissive. Some things just feel weird like my example in the OP about Star Wars Droids. It's not a value judgement.

If it's not a value judgement, then what makes hearing a human speak with a southern accent weird in Star Trek?

Yes, I can understand a southern accent sounding weird from a droid in Star Wars - there was no American south in the Star Wars universe. I would likewise think it odd to hear a Bostonian accent or a Jamaican accent (oh, wait) for the exact same reason. These geo-ethnic regions did not exist "a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away."

Star Trek, however, is different. These humans are either from Earth or have not to distant relatives from Earth. We should hear various accents, unless you think in 300 years those accents will have faded. In that case, we should hear no accents.

Now, if we heard a Vulcan, Andorian or Klingon with a southern (or Bostonian) accent, then that would be jarring.

But WHY does it take you out of the moment to hear a Star Trek human character from the southern United States speak with an accent from that same region?

Actually on a cultural level SW has a much more southern feel then Trek but it still took me out of it.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I think you're defining "utopian" far too narrowly for it to be at all useful. A story doesn't have to be completely devoid of any conflict or disagreement to constitute utopian fiction; on the contrary, a great deal of utopian fiction is about challenging the perceived perfection of the utopia. The very word does, after all, mean "no place," as a wordplay on eutopia, "good place." Thomas More's intent in coining the word was, apparently, to imply that a perfect society does not exist, that any society purporting to perfection is still going to have some basic flaws just like any other human creation. So having characters question the society's claims of perfection does not in any way disqualify something as utopian fiction; if anything, it confirms it as such.

Anyway, critics and scholars have been writing about Star Trek's optimistic view of the future for nearly half a century now. I'm amazed I'm even having this debate.

Possibly, but I think of Trek as optimistic, rather than utopian. A matter of degree I guess.

[
Actually on a cultural level SW has a much more southern feel then Trek but it still took me out of it.

What does this even mean?

 

[Nightdiamond]

In "Ensigns of Command" they cut out the original voice of the character Gosheven and re dubbed with another voice.


It's been said in some articles, that according to the production team, the voice was 'too southern' or had too much of a drawl to it.

I never actually noticed it before, but now, when you pay attention to the re-dubbed voice, it does sound odd.

Trek, especially TNG, had somewhat of a rigid idea of what Utopian future humans were supposed to sound and act like.

It was OK to sound international, but not too much.

The casting call for Geordi's character TNG said for no street types-- understandable, but at the same time what were they expecting?

 

[Wadjda]

I think you're defining "utopian" far too narrowly for it to be at all useful. A story doesn't have to be completely devoid of any conflict or disagreement to constitute utopian fiction; on the contrary, a great deal of utopian fiction is about challenging the perceived perfection of the utopia. The very word does, after all, mean "no place," as a wordplay on eutopia, "good place." Thomas More's intent in coining the word was, apparently, to imply that a perfect society does not exist, that any society purporting to perfection is still going to have some basic flaws just like any other human creation. So having characters question the society's claims of perfection does not in any way disqualify something as utopian fiction; if anything, it confirms it as such.

Anyway, critics and scholars have been writing about Star Trek's optimistic view of the future for nearly half a century now. I'm amazed I'm even having this debate.

Possibly, but I think of Trek as optimistic, rather than utopian. A matter of degree I guess.

[
Actually on a cultural level SW has a much more southern feel then Trek but it still took me out of it.

What does this even mean?

In pop culture southern = republican. SW does not spend a lot of time preaching politics besides freedom=good and tyranny=bad.

 

[Push The Button]

On my short list of favorite Trek characters are Bones and Trip. So I consider a southern accent to be perfectly normal part of Star Trek, Bones and Trip actual have different southern accents.

It's too bad (given his origins) that Sisko didn't have a little bit of Creole in his speech, Joseph too. It would have given "spice" to the characters.

I do wonder, really no offense in tended, where the OP poster is from that Southern accents would be considered "weird?" Such perspectives are not unheard of, in the viewpoint of many of the people where I live (the Pacific Northwest) those with a "American mid-Atlantic" accent are generally perceived to be, in all honesty, dense.

But many of the people on Star Trek have a variation of that accent.

Connor Trinneer will make a great George W Bush someday.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I think you're defining "utopian" far too narrowly for it to be at all useful. A story doesn't have to be completely devoid of any conflict or disagreement to constitute utopian fiction; on the contrary, a great deal of utopian fiction is about challenging the perceived perfection of the utopia. The very word does, after all, mean "no place," as a wordplay on eutopia, "good place." Thomas More's intent in coining the word was, apparently, to imply that a perfect society does not exist, that any society purporting to perfection is still going to have some basic flaws just like any other human creation. So having characters question the society's claims of perfection does not in any way disqualify something as utopian fiction; if anything, it confirms it as such.

Anyway, critics and scholars have been writing about Star Trek's optimistic view of the future for nearly half a century now. I'm amazed I'm even having this debate.

Possibly, but I think of Trek as optimistic, rather than utopian. A matter of degree I guess.

[
Actually on a cultural level SW has a much more southern feel then Trek but it still took me out of it.

What does this even mean?

In pop culture southern = republican. SW does not spend a lot of time preaching politics besides freedom=good and tyranny=bad.

Not helping in any meaningful way.

 

[Christopher]

In pop culture southern = republican.

Then pop culture is forgetting that Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, and Al Gore are all as Southern as the day is long. Not to mention that Texas, supposedly one of the most right-wing states in the country, has had only five Republican governors in its history.

Of course, up until the '70s or '80s, the Southern Democrats were the conservative ones, the ones clinging the most rigidly to the old Confederate values. These days it's the Southern Republicans. Which just goes to show that partisan labels are mutable things and reality is more complicated than lazy stereotypes.

 

[Smellincoffee]

Following World War III, the South rose again. Admittedly the plan for our triumphant return was a bit convoluted. The question therefore is why there aren't more southern accents in 'Trek.

 

[USS Triumphant]

Actually on a cultural level SW has a much more southern feel then Trek but it still took me out of it.

What does this even mean?

Siding with the rebellion? I've got an idiot redneck cousin who has a Confederate flag on his truck, a decal of the emblem of the Rebel Alliance on one half of his back window, and a Hank Jr decal on the other.

 

[The Wormhole]

So where exactly is this conversation going? Are we now comparing the Rebel Alliance to the Confederacy?

 

[Shawnster]

Actually on a cultural level SW has a much more southern feel then Trek but it still took me out of it.

What does this even mean?

Siding with the rebellion? I've got an idiot redneck cousin who has a Confederate flag on his truck, a decal of the emblem of the Rebel Alliance on one half of his back window, and a Hank Jr decal on the other.

So where exactly is this conversation going? Are we now comparing the Rebel Alliance to the Confederacy?

I seriously doubt that most people who fly the Confederate Flag could successfully articulate what, exactly that flag stood or stands for. They give little thought to the issues and causes behind the Civil War. All they seem to see/think about is that Confederate Flag = Rebellion (without giving thought of rebelling against what, exactly). Or, the Stars and Bars stands simply for the South (and the Southern music).

Now, I could be wrong in my assumption.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

What does this even mean?

Siding with the rebellion? I've got an idiot redneck cousin who has a Confederate flag on his truck, a decal of the emblem of the Rebel Alliance on one half of his back window, and a Hank Jr decal on the other.

So where exactly is this conversation going? Are we now comparing the Rebel Alliance to the Confederacy?

I seriously doubt that most people who fly the Confederate Flag could successfully articulate what, exactly that flag stood or stands for. They give little thought to the issues and causes behind the Civil War. All they seem to see/think about is that Confederate Flag = Rebellion (without giving thought of rebelling against what, exactly). Or, the Stars and Bars stands simply for the South (and the Southern music).

Now, I could be wrong in my assumption.

Well, the Rebellion was low on political sophistication and accurate historical memory: the purported Good Guys, the Republic, did essentially use slave labor to fight its wars.

 

[Sector 7]

By old Trek i mean not the JJverse, the other on screen stuff. They kind of take me out of it just like with SW which had one southerner in that goofy Droids cartoon. I really don't know why that is. Maybe it's because we don't really see rednecks in utopian settings. I could see one in JJTek which seems less utopian and more grounded as far as society is concerned. What about you?

From your posts in this thread, I am more concerned about your prejudice toward Southerners. I also take umbrage with USS Triumphant's slander of Southerners.

Speaker of the House John Boehner is one of the most redneck, prejudiced people I know (he is, actually, from my hometown), yet he is from Ohio... a decidedly NON-Southern place.

Like USS Triumphant, I bought into the stereotypes of ignorant, racist Southerners. I had never talked to a black person until I moved here in high school. Since I was never taught to disparage based upon nonsensical factors like race, I quickly made many friends of various backgrounds.

Over 37 years of living in the South and traveling the world, I have come to realize that intelligent/stupid, open-minded/bigoted, educated/ignorant, kind/rude people can be found in every location of our planet. I, also, believe that you always find that for which you are searching. If you are searching for stupid people you will find them. If you are searching for friendly, open-minded people you will find them, as well.

For which kind of person are you seeking?

 

[Christopher]

Over 37 years of living in the South and traveling the world, I have come to realize that intelligent/stupid, open-minded/bigoted, educated/ignorant, kind/rude people can be found in every location of our planet. I, also, believe that you always find that for which you are searching. If you are searching for stupid people you will find them. If you are searching for friendly, open-minded people you will find them, as well.

Hear, hear.

 

[Mary Ann]

If a Star Trek character spoke with an English West Country accent, would you automatically think "farmer" or "pirate"?

"Zet ee phayzers ter stun, me luvvers."

I can't give a source because I read or saw this years ago, but I remember Patrick Stewart saying they'd briefly tried giving Picard a French accent but it ended up sounding as if Inspector Clouseau had invaded the bridge. "Mehk it sooo!"

 

[MacLeod]

Should just have changed the character from French to British after casting Stewart. It's not as if it would have made much difference to the stories told.

 

[Christopher]

People don't always have the same accent as the place where they're born. I once knew a girl who was from Massachusetts or Maryland or something but who had a lovely English accent because she'd been raised by an English nanny. If every character ever had the same accent you'd expect from their nationality, that would be an unrealistic simplification.

 

[MacLeod]

True.

 

[Mary Ann]

Should just have changed the character from French to British after casting Stewart. It's not as if it would have made much difference to the stories told.

The family vineyard would have had to be changed to a cider orchard, though.