I thought they let themselves be destroyed. After all the damage done during the running battle with Starfleet, the Sphere must have been less than 100%.
How would other starship classes have fared in the Delta Quadrant?
- Thread starter Infern0
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I thought they let themselves be destroyed. After all the damage done during the running battle with Starfleet, the Sphere must have been less than 100%.
No, the Sovereign is just that much stronger than that Sphere was.
The Huge Cubes are the real threat, most other Borg vessels aren't that powerful. This should have been made more clear.
That Tactical Cube from VOY they lasted against? It was meant to be weaker than a normal Cube, but this wasn't explained well enough.
The Huge Cubes are the real threat, most other Borg vessels aren't that powerful. This should have been made more clear.
That Tactical Cube from VOY they lasted against? It was meant to be weaker than a normal Cube, but this wasn't explained well enough.
It was smaller than an Assimilation Cube (the one from BOBW) and was "Class 3" instead of "Class 1".
Also, it's a "Tactical" Cube not a "Strategic" Cube or anything like that. Tactical means it's good for smaller engagements but not major operations like Assimilation Cubes are.
Also, it's a "Tactical" Cube not a "Strategic" Cube or anything like that. Tactical means it's good for smaller engagements but not major operations like Assimilation Cubes are.
It was the continued pressure and damage given the cube by Starfleet that allowed a fresh, all system go 1701-E to give the coup de grâce. If the Sphere was undamaged, it would have all the information it needed on quantum torpedoes (The Defiant was armed with them) to make itself resistant to them. So it had to be damaged, or the Borg had to let it be destroyed so they could ensure the destruction of the Phoenix and assimilate the 1701-E then Earth so they could then contact the Borg from that time and given them the new technology of the 1701-E and make the Collective even stronger.
You're assuming that the ability to adapt to damage done by weapons is something all Borg ships can do at the same capacity. It's quite possible that only the big Borg Cubes have that ability to adapt to weapons that fast and that flawlessly, and that Spheres may not have that power. or at least, it's not as easy for them.
There are at least two types of Spheres:
There's the Scout Sphere, the once from FC.
Then there's the huge Tactical Sphere from VOY.
THAT one, a Tactical Sphere on par with the Tactical Cube, could adapt to weapons faster. After all, the Tactical Ships are meant for combat.
The Scout Sphere, believably, wouldn't have the same power as those ships.
Having the information isn't enough if the ship doesn't have the power generating capacity for adaptive shields.
There's the Scout Sphere, the once from FC.
Then there's the huge Tactical Sphere from VOY.
THAT one, a Tactical Sphere on par with the Tactical Cube, could adapt to weapons faster. After all, the Tactical Ships are meant for combat.
The Scout Sphere, believably, wouldn't have the same power as those ships.
Having the information isn't enough if the ship doesn't have the power generating capacity for adaptive shields.
What the writers did wrong was not properly defining the Borg and making it clear that they don't all have the same power levels.
Frankly, those Probe ships VOY fought shouldn't have been tougher than Jem'Hadar Fighters. Then the next level up are the weaker Scout Spheres, then the Tactical Spheres and Tactical Cubes, THEN the massive Assimilation Cubes.
Frankly, those Probe ships VOY fought shouldn't have been tougher than Jem'Hadar Fighters. Then the next level up are the weaker Scout Spheres, then the Tactical Spheres and Tactical Cubes, THEN the massive Assimilation Cubes.
I'm curious, where is it mentioned in canon the strength levels of different Borg ships? And their order from weakest to strongest?
Starfleet/Klingon/Romulan ships do have have some strength levels shown by and mentioned in canon. A Galaxy and a D'deridix Warbird are roughly equivalent in fire power but not speed. A single shuttle is no match for a starship of anykind.
It isn't mentioned in canon, because the writers were lazy. All we have to go by is that it was easier to destroy the Probe ship and the Scout Sphere than the Tactical Sphere and Tactical Cube, and a Deus ex Machina was always needed to stop an Assimilation Sube.
I know by your previous post that you're used to defending Voyager, and I would agree that most of the criticism of Voyager is weak (except for the seeming abandonment of development for Chacotay). But the only real time Deus ex Machina was used to stop an Assimilation Cube was in Q Who? when Q rescues Enterprise with a snap of his fingers. Otherwise it's the gaining of insider knowledge, a prolonged battle, or truly superior technology that stopped an AC; and it was Voyager that survived battles it shouldn't have.
True, her tactics were usually hit and run or diversionary, but even then she got away way too easily. Even One said he could no longer help Voyager because the ship just didn't have the power necessary.
Also, didn't 7 warn Janeway that attacking a Tactical Cube would be folly?
There were points in BOBW where the Enterprise really should have been destroyed, yet it survived too. Folks just don't notice as much because they enjoy the story, as opposed to VOY.
The Tactical Cube was supposed to be WEAKER than an Assimilation Cube, but this wasn't conveyed very well. And they ran away because they couldn't win, but since it was a weaker vessel they could last against in it a straight up fight better than the Enterprise could with an Assimilation Cube.
There's also a bit of the double standard here: If BOBW had been a VOY story, and it had the Doctor interfacing with Seven to stop the Assimilation Cube, I doubt the audience would have enjoyed it as much.
Or, if it had been Janeway who used a solar flare to destroy a Borg vessel I doubt THAT would go over well either.
The Tactical Cube was supposed to be WEAKER than an Assimilation Cube, but this wasn't conveyed very well. And they ran away because they couldn't win, but since it was a weaker vessel they could last against in it a straight up fight better than the Enterprise could with an Assimilation Cube.
There's also a bit of the double standard here: If BOBW had been a VOY story, and it had the Doctor interfacing with Seven to stop the Assimilation Cube, I doubt the audience would have enjoyed it as much.
Or, if it had been Janeway who used a solar flare to destroy a Borg vessel I doubt THAT would go over well either.
In BOBW, the Borg had a plan to capture Picard. Once that was done and Enterprise's deflector burned out, it was no longer an immediate threat. They way they were portrayed at that point, their leaving it behind made sense. To waste resources on it when they knew they were going to face a fleet of ships, as 7 would put it, would have been "inefficient."
I still don't buy that a Tactical Cube is weaker than an Assimilation Cube. The Tactical Cube debuted after the Borg encountered Species 8472.
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Conjecture. But possible, considering some fans dislike of Voyager. I don't count myself as one of those fans. I just disagree with your assessment and ranking of Borg ships.
Actually, IMO, using a solar flare is a brilliant way to dispatch a ship of any kind. Had Janeway thought of it herself, I would have had no problem with it. The only way to beat the Borg is be to considerably more powerful than they are, or being able to swarm their ships and peck away at them for extended periods thereby keeping them from regenerating and adapting.
They could have destroyed the Enterprise after Picard says "your resistance is hopeless Number One." but just left.
Again, after they decimated the fleet at Wolf 359 and they battle the Enterprise somehow they can't destroy it as easily as they destroyed all the other ships (we see them blowing up Starfleet ships in ONE SHOT in "Emissary" and in First Contact but somehow they can't even get a tractor beam lock on the Enterprise Stardrive section) and again they just leave.
The Tactical Cube was MUCH smaller than an Assimilation Cube, and saying those were post-Scorpion upgrades just means that pre-Scorpion Tactical Cubes just looked like smaller Assimilation Cubes and they were still weaker.
Frankly, making all the Borg ships so powerful was a mistake. The only super-dangerous one should be the Assimilation Cubes (meant for assaults on Civilizations) whereas the other ships (Tactical Cubes and smaller) should've been more beatable.
It would maintain them as a great threat (if you run into an Assimilation Cube) but make them more easily re-usable as an enemy (if you run into the other ship classes).
Again, after they decimated the fleet at Wolf 359 and they battle the Enterprise somehow they can't destroy it as easily as they destroyed all the other ships (we see them blowing up Starfleet ships in ONE SHOT in "Emissary" and in First Contact but somehow they can't even get a tractor beam lock on the Enterprise Stardrive section) and again they just leave.
The Tactical Cube was MUCH smaller than an Assimilation Cube, and saying those were post-Scorpion upgrades just means that pre-Scorpion Tactical Cubes just looked like smaller Assimilation Cubes and they were still weaker.
Frankly, making all the Borg ships so powerful was a mistake. The only super-dangerous one should be the Assimilation Cubes (meant for assaults on Civilizations) whereas the other ships (Tactical Cubes and smaller) should've been more beatable.
It would maintain them as a great threat (if you run into an Assimilation Cube) but make them more easily re-usable as an enemy (if you run into the other ship classes).
That is like saying that the Enola Gay could have dropped the bomb on a nearby city like Matsuyama.
